NYPD Still Shelling Out Millions In Lawsuit Settlements Every Year, Still Protecting Its Worst Officers From Accountability

from the bleeding-the-city-dry dept

The NYPD’s refusal to engage in nearly any form of accountability means it’s up to the city’s residents to pay billions for police work that adds tens of millions to the tab with lawsuit settlements.

In 2022, the NYPD cost residents $121 million in settlements. This came on top of the NYPD’s budget, which cleared $11 billion. Sure, it’s the largest local law enforcement agency in the United States, but that doesn’t mean it shouldn’t be doing something to cut expenses that should be considered discretionary. Imposing better discipline would deter officers from violating rights and regulations so often it takes another hundred million to set things right.

NYPD officers routinely engage in misconduct, racking up thousands of complaints. The NYPD routinely refuses to discipline officers, preferring to exonerate them in closed sessions that rarely result in discipline of any severity.

This total of 207 substantiated force allegations is based on the data provided to OIG-NYPD by CCRB. The total number of substantiated force allegations represents approximately 2.0% of the more than 10,000 allegations of force received by CCRB from 2010 to 2014.

That’s from an Inspector General’s report published in 2015. Despite nearly a decade of being provided the opportunity to learn from its mistakes (along with a constant stream of high-profile incidents that highlighted endemic problems in US policing), the NYPD remains as awful as ever.

Last year’s total was $121 million in settlements. This year isn’t looking much better, according to the numbers compiled by Akela Lacy for The Intercept. In fact, it might be even worse by the time the final totals are in.

The New York Police Department has been making headlines for the huge settlements paid out by the city in misconduct cases. In the first half of 2023, New York City paid more than $50 million in lawsuits alleging misconduct by members of the NYPD. 

That figure is on track to exceed $100 million by the end of the year — but even that total doesn’t capture how much the city has to spend in cases where its cops are accused of everything from causing car accidents to beating innocent people.

The $100 million figure does not include lawsuits settled by the city prior to litigation, which reached $30 million in the first nine months of this year, according to data obtained from the office of the New York City Comptroller through a public records request. Pre-litigation settlements from July 2022 through September of this year totaled $50 million — meaning the city’s payouts in such suits since July 2022, including those settled after litigation, rose to a total of around $280 million.

It’s an obvious problem, one that results in at least another $100 million in expenditures, year after year after year after year. What has the NYPD done to stem the constantly rising tide of lawsuits and their subsequent settlements? Well, as Akela Lacy reported in October, it’s done things like this:

NYPD Sgt. David Grieco, a cop with the street nickname of “Bullethead,” was named in at least 17 suits between his hiring in 2006 and his first promotion in 2016. After advancing to the rank of sergeant in 2017, he was named in at least eight more suits. That promotion came less than one week after Grieco was named in his 28th suit. Since his last promotion, Grieco has been named in at least 27 additional lawsuits. Payouts for suits naming Grieco exceeded $1 million this year.

[…]

Lt. Henry Daverin started at the NYPD in 2008 and promoted to sergeant in 2013. Daverin was named in at least 19 suits between 2013 and 2017, when he was promoted to his current role as lieutenant. Settled police misconduct suits that named Daverin have paid out at least $1.5 million since 2013. 

[…]

Detective Abdiel Anderson was hired as a police officer in 2003. He was named in two lawsuits shortly afterward. In 2008, he was promoted to detective. Anderson has been named in at least 43 suits since then, with settled cases paying out more than half a million dollars. 

That’s how the NYPD is handling its misconduct. Whatever isn’t deliberately ignored or immediately exonerated is apparently treated as an indicator of future success within the NYPD.

Not that the NYPD wants anyone to know this. Its misconduct record portal is deliberately incomplete, forcing those seeking complete information about officer misconduct to scour court records and file public records requests, the latter of which tends to result in litigation to actually liberate records the NYPD is legally required to hand over to records requesters.

Make no mistake: the laws in the NYPD’s so-called “transparency” effort are deliberate. They’re as deliberate as the pre-trial settlements, which allow the NYPD to purchase presumed innocence by tying settlements to statements averring no admission of wrongdoing. Every time it does this, it keeps another misconduct record from entering its “transparency” portal.

It’s just insults piled on top of financial injury. Residents are already expected to cover the $11 billion-plus the NYPD demands just to cover its day-to-day expenses. Then they’re asked to cover tens of millions in settlements, many of them occurring pre-trial, which means the city doesn’t feel these are winnable despite the multiple immunity options (and rights exceptions) it has at its disposal. Throughout all of this, officers named in multiple lawsuits are rising through the ranks. And rather than get better at their jobs, their promotions tend to increase the frequency in which they’re named in complaints and lawsuits.

The city is paying billions to pay a workforce with steadily decreasing value. And yet, little will change because the NYPD is too big and too powerful. And far too often, it has been given blanket support by whoever happens to be sitting in the mayor’s office. The NYPD runs the town. Everyone in it is just expected to keep giving ’til it hurts. And then give some more.

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Comments on “NYPD Still Shelling Out Millions In Lawsuit Settlements Every Year, Still Protecting Its Worst Officers From Accountability”

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Arijirija says:

As a non-fan – but at times reluctant watcher – of police dramas, whathaveyou, I feel there is a need for this to be dramatized and put on the small screen.

We’ve had heaps of police dramas where, as Phillip K. Dick pointed out in the intro to one of his books, the propaganda – that the cop is the good guy – gets ladled on like it was icing. There have been only a few that I can think of off the top of my head, where that has not been the case – Sledgehammer is the first one that springs to mind, where the title character Sledgehammer’s a gun-loving loonie who escapes many attempts on his life without noticing. And there was a cop series in the seventies where the good cop found himself facing bad cops, but that could be considered a subset of the overall good-cop propaganda.

Someone gets a nickname of Bullethead when the people giving him that nickname consider that bullets don’t have brains; and a Detective who racks up 48 lawsuits after being promoted to that rank, might be better titled a Defective.

Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Check out “The Chicago Code”

It was about 10 years ago, and I thought it was a great show about police and political corruption. But it only lasted one season. Had 100% on rotten tomatoes and 84% audience score. It was so good. Call me a conspiracy theorist, but I believe these shows don’t get made because the cops threaten folks who try. .

That One Guy (profile) says:

Dumb criminals end up in cells. Smart ones in law enforcement

Even if they don’t have the guts to do anything more what the city should do is treat any settlement amounts as ‘unneeded’ cash and cut it from the next year’s budget for the NYPD.

So for example if in a given year the NYPD pays out $200 million in settlements that’s money that wasn’t going to actually doing their gorram job to say the least and therefore clearly they can get by with $200 million less next year. Rinse and repeat a few years and the city could recoup a few billion in funding to be spent on services/agencies that aren’t getting the city sued on a regular basis.

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Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re:

“Black and white people surveyed diverged most sharply in 2020–37 percentage points–after Floyd’s death, with 19% of Black Americans expressing confidence in police compared to 56% of white Americans.”

You’ll note in my original comment I contented specifically that “most productive Americans” appreciate the police. Black people are by and large unproductive parasites, so my point stands.

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davec (profile) says:

Fire them all.

Given the fact that you can basically sue “deep pockets” NYPD for free, it is a wonder they aren’t sued more.

Since I have no plans to visit NYC anytime soon, I suggest they fire every police officer that has a complaint against them, even the unsubstantiated claims. Nobody wants to get a ticket or arrested, so threaten to make a complaint if the officer tries to do his job. Eventually the only ones left on the force will be those officers that do nothing but collect a paycheck.

But don’t despair, I’m sure there will be millions of elite, Learned Leftist willing to step forward to maintain law and order and show just how easy that is.

Can’t wait to see how that turns out.

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Anonymous Coward says:

Re:

One thing you have demonstrated with your cop-apologist mantra is that you believe that cops can do no wrong, are above the law and they can treat civilians in any way they see fit without any repercussion or consequences even if the civilian dies in the process.

The reality is that you are a stupid old fart who is incapable of realizing that all cops isn’t infallible, incorruptible, upstanding, professional or law-abiding. Demanding that cops be held to a higher standard is a no-brainer for people who have a smidgen of intelligence and reason – all which you seem to lack.

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davec (profile) says:

Re: Re:

One thing you have demonstrated with your cop-apologist mantra is that you believe that cops can do no wrong, are above the law and they can treat civilians in any way they see fit without any repercussion or consequences even if the civilian dies in the process.

No, I believe cops are humans and unlike you I don’t expect them to be infallible.

Demanding that cops be held to a higher standard is a no-brainer for people who have a smidgen of intelligence and reason – all which you seem to lack.

Constantly pissing on the cops isn’t holding them to a higher standard. None of you Anonymous Chickenshits would do the job for even one day, yet you demean and dehumanize them in every post. If you don’t like a particular law, you piss on the cops for enforcing it. If you don’t like a judge’s decision that sides with the cops, you piss on the cops. If you like a judge’s decision that sides against the cops, you piss on the cops. Cops in this forum are damned if they do and damned if they don’t, so don’t pretend for one second that there is ANY standard you would accept.

Despite thousands of stories of cops saving lives or giving their own, Tim has yet to post one. Why? Because just like you, he thinks cops are so far beneath him, they don’t matter, he gets paid to piss on them and you eat it up.

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Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Re:

Given the fact that you can basically sue “deep pockets” NYPD for free, it is a wonder they aren’t sued more.

You keep citing this apocalyptic scenario like it’s inevitable, and yet there’s been no deluge of lawsuits being thrown at the NYPD, or indeed any US police department. Here’s the thing: lawsuits ain’t free, and certainly not for the people being shat on by the police. This idea that cops and their departments are being inundated by lawsuits doesn’t hold water.

I don’t expect them to be infallible

“I just expect everyone to be okay with cops that strangle, choke and beat up randos and get angry when people don’t agree with me that those cops shouldn’t face consequences because I’ve heard of other cops saving lives or something.”

None of you Anonymous Chickenshits would do the job for even one day

Neither would you. And here, it’s relevant to bring up another point brought up in another article: you keep demanding that average Joes on the street join the force to bring change around the 1% of bad cops. What the hell are the other 99% doing?

If you don’t like a particular law, you piss on the cops for enforcing it. If you don’t like a judge’s decision that sides with the cops, you piss on the cops.

The law and the judge get pissed on, too, don’t worry.

Despite thousands of stories of cops saving lives or giving their own, Tim has yet to post one. Why?

Despite thousands of stories of doctors saving lives or giving their own, you have yet to post one. Why? Because you have a vested interest in demanding the red carpet treatment for cops.

Going by your posts, if the cops bashed in your door, shot your wife and demolished your house because they got the wrong address while chasing a suspect, you’d still lick their toes because you thought they had a good reason.

Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Re:2

“Going by your posts, if the cops bashed in your door, shot your wife and demolished your house because they got the wrong address while chasing a suspect, you’d still lick their toes because you thought they had a good reason.”

davec beat you to it fam, he’s already said as much.

davec’s the kind of guy who, if his kid got run over by a car, he’d beat the shit out of his kid for the inconvenience, then wonder why his kid shoots up a school or switches gender ten years down the road.

davec (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re:3

davec’s the kind of guy who, if his kid got run over by a car, he’d beat the shit out of his kid for the inconvenience, then wonder why his kid shoots up a school or switches gender ten years down the road.

No, I’m very proud to say, I have four kids, all in their 40s and 50s, married with children. No tattoos and no piercings. Two are in law enforcement, married to spouses in law enforcement. Two have Masters Degrees. When I asked them how I got so lucky, all four said the same thing, “we didn’t want to disappoint you”. So when an Anonymous Chickenshit like you degrades and demonizes them because of their profession, I speak up and push back.

Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Re:4

degrades and demonizes them because of their profession, I speak up and push back

I’m sure some people shit on <ops just because of the profession, but if you actually took the time to listen what a majority of people actually say it is that they shit on cops because of their behavior.

And you unflinchingly defend cops just because they are cops while ignoring the abhorrent behavior many of them exhibit and how other cops close ranks or just don’t say shit about the former ones.

The reality is that there are bad cops and other cops protect them explicitly or implicitly. If no cop speaks up about the bad cops, that means there are no good cops.

It has been proven over and over again that a profession that has no real accountability invariably leads to an unhealthy culture were those who try to affect change for the better are marginalized and ostracized by those who like having no accountability.

Nobody has claimed being a cop is easy, and it is a job that isn’t supposed to be easy because it is all about dealing with people in various situations, some very difficult. Cops are making their own jobs harder by having an “us vs them” mentality, everything seems to be some sort of confrontation for them. They have stepped outside the community which they now look on as some adversarial entity that needs to be subjugated when friction occurs.

davec (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re:5

I’m sure some people shit on <ops just because of the profession, but if you actually took the time to listen what a majority of people actually say it is that they shit on cops because of their behavior.

So if I don’t speak up and push back, all you’ll ever hear in this echo chamber is how bad cops are. You’ll assume that most if not all cops are bad and as a father and father-in-law of cops that certainly isn’t my experience. You assume because of the bias and bigotry of this forum that cops are breaking the law all the time without any accountability and that’s not true. You’ll assume that cops not breaking the law at the time are covering for the ones that are and again that’s not true. I know you want to be comfortable in your bigotry, but you are wrong and I intend to push back against it.

Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Re:6

So if I don’t speak up and push back, all you’ll ever hear in this echo chamber is how bad cops are.

I’ve never seen a cop stand up an publicly denounce bad cops unless the shit has really has hit the fan.

You’ll assume that most if not all cops are bad and as a father and father-in-law of cops that certainly isn’t my experience.

I’m assuming that cops who don’t speak up to be bad, implicitly or explicitly. And as a father and father-in-law your experience is that of a relative, not some random person being accosted by cops on the street. That you don’t understand that your experience can’t be translated to what people on the street experience is indicative that you can’t understand in any capacity the public perception of cops.

You assume because of the bias and bigotry of this forum that cops are breaking the law all the time without any accountability and that’s not true.

I assume that when cops do bad shit they should be accountable, yet you have adamantly defended every cop regardless of the shit they pulled with your favorite excuse “my son says/my son is a cop” etc. Ever heard of the “appeal to authority” fallacy?

You’ll assume that cops not breaking the law at the time are covering for the ones that are and again that’s not true.

And yet…you have defended them when they have very obviously violated peoples civil rights, which is exactly what other cops also did. Do I also need to point out all the times cops have claimed QI for shit they done that any reasonable person would condemn?

I know you want to be comfortable in your bigotry, but you are wrong and I intend to push back against it.

This is funny. You think pointing out bad behavior is bigotry, bad behavior you always defend. You think you are right because you are deeply emotionally invested in being right, and the simple reason for that is that you have relatives that are cops which has severely colored your views of them.

Here’s an exercise for you: Don’t turn a blind eye and actually criticize people for their bad behavior regardless of who they are and their profession.

Just ask your son, has he ever reported a colleague for not adhering to procedure or breaking the law? If says he never seen a colleague do shit like that, he lies. If you think I’m wrong about that, just ask yourself how much shit went down in your company when you where in Vietnam that was never reported. Every profession protects their own to a degree, thinking cops don’t is just a fantasy.

Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Re:7

I assume that when cops do bad shit they should be accountable, yet you have adamantly defended every cop regardless of the shit they pulled with your favorite excuse “my son says/my son is a cop” etc. Ever heard of the “appeal to authority” fallacy?

davec’s reads like the parent whose kid punches the hell out of other kids at school, and when the teacher calls him up to report his kid’s shitty behavior he goes, “Well, I just don’t tolerate that kinda thing at home, my kid’s the most perfectly behaved angel ever. He doesn’t want to disappoint me, don’tcha know. All the other kids must’ve done gone and bruised themselves!”

Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Re:6

So if I don’t speak up and push back, all you’ll ever hear in this echo chamber is how bad cops are.

So if we don’t speak up and push back all you’ll ever hear in your family echo chamber is how good cops are. You realize how dumb that sounds when it’s turned on you?

Realistically, you don’t, because you’ve fashioned yourself as the last line of defense standing between yourself and total anarchy if we don’t let cops shoot randos on the street.

You assume because of the bias and bigotry of this forum that cops are breaking the law all the time without any accountability

All the time? No. Without accountability? Hell yes, I’d believe that! Because you’re here demanding that these cops shouldn’t get held accountable.

You’ll assume that cops not breaking the law at the time are covering for the ones that are

Eh, personally I don’t think all of them are covering. Some of them have plausible deniability and I’m willing to give that benefit of doubt for them. I am not a fan of the idea that “the only thing it takes for evil men to win is for good men to do nothing”. But you know who is a fan of such thinking? Cops, and those who defend them, who use it to justify why bystanders get to be knocked to the ground and roughed up.

I intend to push back against it

You have genuinely fashioned yourself to be the main character in your own war simulation game. Maybe you should genuinely go riot in front of the courthouse when the Trump verdict gets announced. Sign up with the Proud Boys.

Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Re:6

So if I don’t speak up and push back, all you’ll ever hear in this echo chamber is how bad cops are.

Why does every bootlicker think they’re going to be the first people to say something positive about cops that anyone else has ever heard and also that what they say will magically convince people that cops aren’t bad?

You’re speaking from a privileged position about privileged abusers of authority against the tsunami wave of recorded videos and news reports and court testimonies and jury verdicts that have found a vast amount of LEOs abusing their authority.

That you admit you do so because you’re related to some LEOs undermines your position rather than justifies it. You’re just taking it personally by proxy, but you’re not actually witnessing the abuses first hand.

davec (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re:2

You keep citing this apocalyptic scenario like it’s inevitable, and yet there’s been no deluge of lawsuits being thrown at the NYPD, or indeed any US police department. Here’s the thing: lawsuits ain’t free, and certainly not for the people being shat on by the police. This idea that cops and their departments are being inundated by lawsuits doesn’t hold water.

Lawyers usually get 30% of the payout if it doesn’t go to trial and 40% if it does go to trial. So for the plaintive the trial is free.

“I just expect everyone to be okay with cops that strangle, choke and beat up randos and get angry when people don’t agree with me that those cops shouldn’t face consequences because I’ve heard of other cops saving lives or something.”

Cops, like doctors and nurses sometimes make mistakes that cost lives. When you throw people like Kim Potter in jail, it demonstrates to all police officers (good ones and bad ones) there will be no empathy or tolerance for split second life and death decisions gone wrong. “One bullet from death. One mistake from prison.”

Neither would you. And here, it’s relevant to bring up another point brought up in another article: you keep demanding that average Joes on the street join the force to bring change around the 1% of bad cops. What the hell are the other 99% doing?

No I wouldn’t do the job (I was just a simple aerospace engineer). Someone far better than me has done it for most of his life and yet he had to stand in formation while people screamed in his face calling him a racist and a murderer.

I asked him if he had ever seen another police officer do something illegal and he explained that as a patrol officer, he spent most of his time alone. He was asked to assist some other officers in what he thought was a very questionable decision.

An elderly couple called the police on their grown son who had threatened to kill himself with a knife and had barricaded himself in his room. My son wanted everyone (parents included) to leave and let the situation defuse but the other officers wanted to go in. There were legal questions since the parents owned the house, but the son was a legal resident, and it was his room they were entering. They went in and fortunately the son gave up without a struggle and they took him in and got him help.

Had the son attacked the cops with the knife it could have gone terribly wrong. Tim would be writing about it and you would be pissing on the cops, my son included. These are some of the decisions cops face all the time.

Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Re:3

Lawyers usually get 30% of the payout if it doesn’t go to trial and 40% if it does go to trial

And who pays the lawyer for their time? It’s not going to be the homeless druggies you keep citing as the source of everything going wrong in every US city. You keep insisting that there’s a new wave of “woke” lawyers trying to represent black thugs and gangsters pro bono, but the statistics simply don’t fit your narrative.

When you throw people like Kim Potter in jail

Ah, the Kim Potter martyrdom story again.

I can tell you that if a surgeon ended up grabbing a scalpel when he should have grabbed some forceps and fucked up a patient’s insides, nobody here would bat an eyelid if he rightfully got his ass nailed to the wall for such a ridiculous mix up.

No I wouldn’t do the job

Anonymous Chickenshit.

I asked him if he had ever seen another police officer do something illegal and he explained that as a patrol officer, he spent most of his time alone

So your best analogy for “nothing illegal ever happens on the job” is to find a guy who’s intentionally put out of the way as much as possible.

davec (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re:4

And who pays the lawyer for their time? It’s not going to be the homeless druggies you keep citing as the source of everything going wrong in every US city. You keep insisting that there’s a new wave of “woke” lawyers trying to represent black thugs and gangsters pro bono, but the statistics simply don’t fit your narrative.

“Homeless druggie” wants to sue the NYPD for $10,000,000 so he goes to a lawyer. If the lawyer thinks the case has merit or if he thinks the NYC might settle, he takes the case. In the end, NYC settles the case for $1,000,000. Using the math we learned in elementary school, 30% X $1,000,000=$300,000 for the lawyer (lawyer happy). $1,000,000-$300,000= $700,000 for “homeless druggie”.

Ah, the Kim Potter martyrdom story again.
I can tell you that if a surgeon ended up grabbing a scalpel when he should have grabbed some forceps and fucked up a patient’s insides, nobody here would bat an eyelid if he rightfully got his ass nailed to the wall for such a ridiculous mix up.

Fortunately, patients undergoing surgery are sedated. Perhaps if the surgent was operating on a struggling patient halfway in an accelerating car with other doctors and nurses in danger of being ran over, they might be more understanding if the surgent mistook a scalpel for a forceps.

So your best analogy for “nothing illegal ever happens on the job” is to find a guy who’s intentionally put out of the way as much as possible.

Yes, someone alone in their patrol vehicle-like most patrol officers. I know you want to hold every cop accountable for the actions of Chauvin, but it would be very hard for my son to stop what happened when his patrol had him 2000 miles away and 12 hours removed from the event.

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Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Re:5

30% X $1,000,000=$300,000 for the lawyer (lawyer happy). $1,000,000-$300,000= $700,000 for “homeless druggie”.

That would be very profitable math – if the case even existed.

The fact that no such precedent has been set or spoken of beyond your frantic napkin scribbling is highly suggestive of the fact that this idea of a homeless black heroin addict making such a windfall doesn’t actually exist. If it did, actual police departments would be bitching about it. Republicans would be whining about it. Instead we have you, writing lawyer fanfiction.

Perhaps if the surgent

Guy, maybe calm the fuck down instead of angrily mashing your phone keys so you don’t make dumbass typos like this. I know the fact that doctors don’t have the rep you think they should have makes you throw up in your mouth, but the least you could do is not make every cop-fellating acolyte look like a complete drooling moron.

I know you want to hold every cop accountable for the actions of Chauvin

They get held accountable for enabling other shitty cops and justifying their shitty practices like choking or shooting the unarmed.

You on the other hand want to paint Chauvin as a martyr.

davec (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re:6

That would be very profitable math – if the case even existed.

Do you mean like this one?
Lawsuit filed over LAPD arrest of homeless man | Al Jazeera America
http://america.aljazeera.com/articles/2015/5/19/lawsuit-filed-over-lapd-arrest-of-homeless-man.html

Guy, maybe calm the fuck down instead of angrily mashing your phone keys so you don’t make dumbass typos like this.

So, I’m supposed to be infallible too?

I know the fact that doctors don’t have the rep you think they should have makes you throw up in your mouth, but the least you could do is not make every cop-fellating acolyte look like a complete drooling moron.

You’re the one demanding people pay for their mistakes. But only if they’re cops.

Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Re:7

Do you mean like this one?

Congratulations, one case. And where’s the follow up? Where’s the millions of dollars that were paid out to that one homeless man? Where’s the deluge of lawsuits filed by lawyers on behalf of homeless druggies and the mountains of money they’ve won? Never mind that the case predates Chauvin.

No one’s falling for your fearmongering, davec.

So, I’m supposed to be infallible too?

If you don’t want to be treated as infallible maybe don’t constantly try to speak down to everybody else by virtue of how much of a hero you imagine yourself to be.

You’re the one demanding people pay for their mistakes. But only if they’re cops.

And several comments ago I said:

“I can tell you that if a surgeon ended up grabbing a scalpel when he should have grabbed some forceps and fucked up a patient’s insides, nobody here would bat an eyelid if he rightfully got his ass nailed to the wall for such a ridiculous mix up.”

But you ignore these remarks, because you want to paint cops as John Rambo archetypes, armed to the teeth but so broken inside we need to be the better person and let them blow us up in a hail of bullets.

davec (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re:8

Congratulations, one case. And where’s the follow up? Where’s the millions of dollars that were paid out to that one homeless man? Where’s the deluge of lawsuits filed by lawyers on behalf of homeless druggies and the mountains of money they’ve won? Never mind that the case predates Chauvin.

Have you tried to look these things up for yourself? Just google “Homeless man sues police” and you’ll get several examples.

And several comments ago I said:

“I can tell you that if a surgeon ended up grabbing a scalpel when he should have grabbed some forceps and fucked up a patient’s insides, nobody here would bat an eyelid if he rightfully got his ass nailed to the wall for such a ridiculous mix up.”

But you ignore these remarks, because you want to paint cops as John Rambo archetypes, armed to the teeth but so broken inside we need to be the better person and let them blow us up in a hail of bullets.

I responded to an Anonymous Chickenshit. Whether that was you or not, I’m not sure.

Fortunately, patients undergoing surgery are sedated. Perhaps if the surgent was operating on a struggling patient halfway in an accelerating car with other doctors and nurses in danger of being ran over, they might be more understanding if the surgent mistook a scalpel for a forceps.

From that comment, all I got back was surgent should have been surgeon.

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Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Re:5

Fortunately, patients undergoing surgery are sedated. Perhaps if the surgent was operating on a struggling patient halfway in an accelerating car with other doctors and nurses in danger of being ran over, they might be more understanding if the surgent mistook a scalpel for a forceps.

Fortunately, fantastical fantasies has nothing to do with reality. Kim Potter was supposed to be a seasoned officer and in this instance she was the FTO in charge. That the FTO fucked up this badly is kind of mindboggling.

Plus, you know, a doctor’s tools are used to save lives whereas a gun is meant to kill of incapacitate a person.

Yes, someone alone in their patrol vehicle-like most patrol officers. I know you want to hold every cop accountable for the actions of Chauvin, but it would be very hard for my son to stop what happened when his patrol had him 2000 miles away and 12 hours removed from the event.

And how many other cops where at the scene with Chauvin? Three, and none of them could be bothered to do anything. Stop using your son as some bad excuse so you don’t have to deal with reality.

Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Re:

If people aren’t suing the NYPD more even though they could do it “for free” – it surely suggests that they’re not doing it, no?

If anything, the fact that millions of dollars are being paid out seems to indicate that the police, the bastion of truth and justice, don’t seem too confident that they can win those cases. They’d rather pay nuisance fees instead of proving their innocence. Now why is that? If they have nothing to fear, they should have nothing to hide, right?

davec (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re:2

If anything, the fact that millions of dollars are being paid out seems to indicate that the police, the bastion of truth and justice, don’t seem too confident that they can win those cases. They’d rather pay nuisance fees instead of proving their innocence. Now why is that? If they have nothing to fear, they should have nothing to hide, right?

My brother is a truck driver and in the event of an accident where the other driver is mostly at fault, if the damages are less than $250,000, the trucking company’s insurance will just pay it rather than fight it. A lot of companies have made similar decisions. I assume NYC has made the same decision.

davec (profile) says:

Fortunately, fantastical fantasies has nothing to do with reality. Kim Potter was supposed to be a seasoned officer and in this instance she was the FTO in charge. That the FTO fucked up this badly is kind of mindboggling.

So, you do believe cops are supposed to be infallible. Are you aware that “fuck up” has happened 15 times previously.

Plus, you know, a doctor’s tools are used to save lives whereas a gun is meant to kill of incapacitate a person.

And yet mistakes by doctors and nurses kill up to 400 times more people than police officers do.

And how many other cops where at the scene with Chauvin? Three, and none of them could be bothered to do anything. Stop using your son as some bad excuse so you don’t have to deal with reality.

And all of them are in jail but I don’t think that is enough for you. Somehow you want to blame all cops. Please explain how a patrol officer alone in his vehicle 2000 miles away was supposed to intervene. Talk about fantastical fantasies.

Anonymous Coward says:

Re:

So, you do believe cops are supposed to be infallible. Are you aware that “fuck up” has happened 15 times previously.

I expect cops to be professional and accountable. Just like I expect it from any other profession.

And yet mistakes by doctors and nurses kill up to 400 times more people than police officers do.

Are you harping on that stupid excuse again? 34 million hospital admissions, everyone one reflects a person with health problems spanning conditions from a stubbed toe to near death. And everyone of those people were treated by a person that hasn’t QI, who’s first response wasn’t reaching for a gun.

And all of them are in jail but I don’t think that is enough for you. Somehow you want to blame all cops.

That because you don’t understand what I’m saying, you have an emotionally vested interest in not understanding what I say.

Please explain how a patrol officer alone in his vehicle 2000 miles away was supposed to intervene. Talk about fantastical fantasies.

I don’t care, you invented that particularly stupid and fantastical explanation for why cops can’t step in and stop bad behavior.

davec (profile) says:

I expect cops to be professional and accountable. Just like I expect it from any other profession.

Good, because they are. Do you also expect doctors and nurses to be professional and accountable?

Medical errors may stem more from physician burnout than unsafe health care settings | News Center | Stanford Medicine
https://med.stanford.edu/news/all-news/2018/07/medical-errors-may-stem-more-from-physician-burnout.html

Medical errors and accidents: an ongoing threat to health- STAT (statnews.com)
https://www.statnews.com/2021/08/04/medical-errors-accidents-ongoing-preventable-health-threat/

Are you harping on that stupid excuse again? 34 million hospital admissions, everyone one reflects a person with health problems spanning conditions from a stubbed toe to near death.

If you read the medical accidents that have caused deaths, they have little to do with the patient’s overall health.

And everyone of those people were treated by a person that hasn’t QI, who’s first response wasn’t reaching for a gun.

Quite the contrary. Both the cops, doctors and nurses have QI if they can prove what they did was what a reasonable member of their profession would have done.

I don’t care, you invented that particularly stupid and fantastical explanation for why cops can’t step in and stop bad behavior.

Just as a doctor or nurses can’t give aid to a patient they don’t know about, a cop can’t stop a crime he doesn’t know about.

Anonymous Coward says:

Re:

For someone who’s constantly angry about how the doctors and nurses get away with everything it’s curious why you don’t go in there and do something about it.

You’ll demand that everyone angry about Chauvin be a policeman to stop all the institutionalized racism, but you won’t take your own advice to solve what you think is a problem. Peculiar indeed.

davec (profile) says:

Re: Re:

For someone who’s constantly angry about how the doctors and nurses get away with everything it’s curious why you don’t go in there and do something about it.

I like doctors and nurses, but I know despite their best intentions, they sometimes make mistakes—just like police officers. I’m just pointing out the glaring double standard you have in judging them.

You’ll demand that everyone angry about Chauvin be a policeman to stop all the institutionalized racism, but you won’t take your own advice to solve what you think is a problem. Peculiar indeed.

Since everything is racist (including God, Jesus, the solar system, the medical profession, dogs, cats, the ocean, rocks and atoms) I’m not sure what you want me to do. Kick a rock? What are you doing to end this scourge that touches everything?

Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Re:

I’m just pointing out the glaring double standard you have in judging them.

Doctors and cops get judged by different standards because the former don’t get their panties in a collective twist when people point out that you shouldn’t kneel on the chests of the unarmed.

It’s not that hard to grasp. You bitching about this is reminiscent of the class clown who gets asked to stand in the corner for causing a disturbance and uses “But everybody’s doing it!” as your excuse.

including God, Jesus, the solar system, the medical profession, dogs, cats, the ocean, rocks and atoms

Yet it’s strange that only cops seem incapable of managing the urge to be a nasty piece of shit to racial minorities, no? I’m not arguing that doctors and nurses aren’t racist. But it really is strange that cops seem to feel the need to express their hatred so much they’ll talk about how many black men they want to shoot up, or go on a private forum to celebrate how many children they’ve turned into orphans that week.

What are you doing to end this scourge that touches everything?

Calling out dumbass stooges like you, who will give the cops the benefit of the doubt even after they’ve shot your wife.

davec (profile) says:

The problem with answering Anonymous Chickenshits is you never know which one you are dealing with. They are like gophers, blind, solitary, frightened, popping their heads up only long enough to spew a mound of dirt, then fleeing back into their hole to hide. I have answered the same questions over and over and presented real life examples to one Anonymous Chickenshit after another then been accused of “bitching about it”.

Doctors and cops get judged by different standards because the former don’t get their panties in a collective twist when people point out that you shouldn’t kneel on the chests of the unarmed.

I get that you hate cops because they kill people. But you don’t hate doctors and nurses that kill 400 times as many people.

You hate cops because they don’t always end up in jail when you think they should. Yet nurses literally got their panties in a bunch when it looked like one of their own might be sent to jail.

You claim good cops coverup for bad cops’ mistakes making them all bad cops. Yet the biggest argument for not jailing doctors and nurses for their mistakes was that they would begin covering up for one another.

You want the police to change, but then you use the worst example you can find to claim that the police are incapable of change, and you only do that with the police.

I assume (depending on which Anonymous Chickenshit you are) that you want to replace the police, but you never give an example of where that has worked. Police violently kill people, yet without them, more people are violently killed so people want the police back and you are at odds with that.

Calling out dumbass stooges like you, who will give the cops the benefit of the doubt even after they’ve shot your wife.

The cops haven’t shot my wife and I doubt if they’ve shot your wife or husband so why all the hate? Just hating for others huh? You are quite the Anonymous Chickenshit.

Anonymous Coward says:

Well, I must say, I am impressed davec.

You have single-handedly kept this thread going in circles for 8 days and many dozens of posts and kept all of the intelligent folks repeating the same things over and over again to no avail.

Are you paid by the hour or the post??
I might have a job for you – untaxed of course. 🙂
And we pay by the hour and the post.

Contact me at blueman@qualimmun.Org AN

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