Yes, Elon Musk Is Fucking Up Twitter; But No, The Government Has No Business Getting Involved

from the not-how-any-of-this-works dept

So, yes, I’ve written a few things now on Elon’s silly excuses for his frantic speedrun through the content moderation learning curve. It’s getting more mainstream press because of journalist accounts getting banned (including, this morning, Insider’s Linette Lopez, who did not post any “doxing” info but has reported critically on Musk for years, which lead to him harassing her).

And while Musk’s fans have been (hilariously, frankly) trying to defend these decisions by (1) claiming this is somehow “different” because it’s about “safety” — an argument we cleanly debunked this morning — and (2) saying it’s okay because the “liberal” media are now screaming about censorship and free speech, so it’s all hilarious since everyone is switching positions. Except, I haven’t seen much of that supposed “switch.” Lots of people are pointing out that the reasons stated for these suspensions have been silly. And many more people are highlighting how hypocritical the statements and decisions made by Musk are. But most people readily recognize that he has every right to make dumb and hypocritical decisions.

There are a few, however, who do seem to be taking it further. And they should stop, because it’s nonsense. First up we have the EU, where the VP of the European Commission, Vera Jourova, is warning Musk that there will be consequences.

News about arbitrary suspension of journalists on Twitter is worrying. EU’s Digital Services Act requires respect of media freedom and fundamental rights. This is reinforced under our #MediaFreedomAct. 
@elonmusk
 should be aware of that. There are red lines. And sanctions, soon.

That’s her saying:

News about arbitrary suspension of journalists on Twitter is worrying. EU’s Digital Services Act requires respect of media freedom and fundamental rights. This is reinforced under our #MediaFreedomAct. @elonmusk should be aware of that. There are red lines. And sanctions, soon.

But being banned from private property doesn’t impact “media freedom or fundamental rights.” And it’s silly for Jourova to claim otherwise. No one has a “right” to be on Twitter. And even if the journalism bans are pathetic and silly (and transparently vindictive and petty) that doesn’t mean he’s violated anyone’s rights.

Some in the US are making similar claims, even though the 1st Amendment (backed up by Section 230) clearly protects Musk’s ability to ban whoever he wants for any reason whatsoever. Yet Jason Kint, the CEO of Digital Context Next, a trade organization of “digital media companies” — but which, in practice, often seems notably aligned with the desires of Rupert Murdoch’s news organizations — demanded Congressional hearings if Musk did not “fix this within an hour” (referencing the journalist suspensions).

Jason Kint tweet showing screenshots of banned journalists, saying: "I don’t know what happened here but if 
@elonmusk
 doesn’t fix this within the hour with an explanation by morning, I’ll be on Capitol Hill tomorrow demanding that he be hauled in front of Congress."

But that’s silly. Again, his decisions are protected by the 1st Amendment. It’s his property. He can kick anyone out. Just like Fox News can choose not to put anyone on air who would call bullshit on “the big lie” or Rupert Murdoch. That’s their editorial freedom.

And I’d bet that if Congress hauled Lachlan Murdoch in for a hearing to demand he explain to them his editorial decision making practices for Fox News, Kint would be highlighting the massive 1st Amendment-connected chilling effects this would have on any of his member news organizations.

We can mock Musk’s decisions. We can highlight how nonsensical they are. We can pick apart his excuses and the ramblings of his fans and point out how inconsistent they are. But Musk has every right to do this, and that’s exactly how it should be. Getting government involved with editorial decisions leads down a dangerous road.

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Comments on “Yes, Elon Musk Is Fucking Up Twitter; But No, The Government Has No Business Getting Involved”

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119 Comments
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Anonymous Coward says:

Re:

the fix section 230 crowd

The problem with that idea, the majority of the “fix §230 crowd” are all the people who Elon has now allowed to return to Twitter, and are actively applauding Elmo’s current ban streak. And guess what, §230 is the first protection against lawsuits from Elmo’s moderation decisions.

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Koby (profile) says:

Re: Re:

All mr Elon has done is light a new fire for the fix section 230 crowd to use.

Very true. Government has no business getting involved; the fix is for private right of action, as a potential contract breech between individual users and platforms. Revise Section 230(c)(2)(A) to spell out the actionable categories, such as profanity, doxxing, death threats, or commercial spam, while also eliminating the “otherwise objectionable” loophole.

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Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re:

while also eliminating the “otherwise objectionable” loophole.

So you’re in favor of ordering people who carry other people’s speech to do so regardless of their own desires, outside of a few categories that you favor. Got it.

So… what happens, when you discover a new category that is causing active harm Right Damn Now? Those people you’ve just restricted now have their hands tied. Congress can’t legislate on a dime. Those people will still be harmed for considerable time to come.

And that’s not even counting the business decisions involved in moderation: Do you force them to allow assholes to blatantly lie about (insert topic here), against the wishes of most of the people forced to see their writings? Do you force them to allow Leftist democratic trolling on eg Truth Social? Do you force the r/weather to host commentary on sociology (and vice versa) against the designated topic of the forum?

And then there are the lawsuits. Lawsuits in sufficient number to drown even Facebook (I would have said “even twitter”, but…). That’s what you’re advocating for.

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Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re:

Government has no business getting involved; the fix is for private right of action, as a potential contract breech between individual users and platforms.

You have no right to use other peoples property. The way you sound is exactly like a rapist sounds. “You can’t tell me no, I have a right to fuck you because you wore revealing clothing!”

Also, if there is a private right of action, who besides the government will enforce it? How can the government not get involved?

Also also, profanity? Get the fuck out of here you fucking piece of shit.

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Koby (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re: Re:

“You can’t tell me no, I have a right to fuck you because you wore revealing clothing!”

People are very much allowed to contractually exchange property so long as the property isn’t outlawed.

Also, if there is a private right of action, who besides the government will enforce it? How can the government not get involved?

Government enforcement of a judgement is not considered to be government involvement from a first amendment perspective.

Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Re:2

People are very much allowed to contractually exchange property so long as the property isn’t outlawed.

Yes, and when one side breaks the contract by violating the ToS, then they have reason to be kicked off of the platform.

See how simple that is?

Government enforcement of a judgement is not considered to be government involvement from a first amendment perspective.

It’s 100% considered government involvement, because the government is the only entity that has any enforcement powers, and the 1st amendment states explicitly they can’t.

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Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re:

Criminal codes already cover anything objectionable.

As for the rest? Legal, though very much unethical. Except for foul language, asshole. If you have a problem with the f-word while demanding to say racial slurs and dehumanizing language with zero repurcussion…

Though you’re not here to argue in good faith, terrorist.

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Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re:

while also eliminating the “otherwise objectionable” loophole.

It’s quite telling about you Koby that you want to eliminate the “otherwise objectionable” phrase. That basically means that you want to be able to call people ni&&ers online, harasses LGBTQ+ communities, and all other legal speech that gets moderated under the “otherwise objectionable” category.

Essentially, you want to be a fucking asshole online, but don’t feel you should suffer any consequences, such as being banned, because of your actions.

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Thad (profile) says:

I could see maybe an argument that banning links to competing social networking sites is anticompetitive, like how the court ruled in Epic v Apple that Apple can’t ban apps from linking to alternative payment sites. But that’s the only example I can think of where it might be plausible to punish him for blocking certain speech on his platform (at least, under US law; I can’t speak to the UK or EU or anywhere else).

Course, there’s plenty else he’s doing that’s going to get him into trouble with various governments, from not paying people he owes money to to violating the FTC consent decree.

Rihilism says:

Forest through the trees

Um, the EU can’t force or expect to be able to choose who Musk can and cannot ban but they certainly can level sanctions including Twitter’s ability to operate in the EU, right? I’m not familiar with the EU’s Digital Service Act but the reference you’d made is to private property rights in the US.

I think Kint’s use of “hauled” is silly and I feel awful defending anything that man says but calling tech CEOs to testify for their company’s behavior is not unheard of, is it? Attempting to interfere with his editorial decisions is off limits but asking him explain his actions and pointing out the downsides and hypocrisy isn’t, is it?

As one who is frustrated by those who conflate constitutional freedom of speech with things that shouldn’t be conflated with the 1st amendment, I can understand the impulse to criticize. I’m just not sure that that either of these examples are clear cut examples of misunderstanding 1st amendment and private property rights.

Stoat says:

Re: Muscles flexing

Yes the 1st Amendment version of ‘free speech’ means nothing outside the US. EU countries have its own definitions, and it’s amazing, as a non-American, how ignorant Musk apparently is of the many differences. Like when he illegally tried firing European staff without notice or due cause. Er you can’t do that Elon.

Maybe he figures he can just barrel his way through and take the inevitable fines of the cost of doing business, but the EU is flexing its muscles and licking its lips, and Musk, who seems to be increasingly friendless would make a tasty little test case as it prepares to take on the likes of Meta, Microsoft and Amazon.

Anonymous Coward says:

Re:

but calling tech CEOs to testify for their company’s behavior is not unheard of, is it?

And almost always, Congress has no business doing this whatsoever. The fact that no one has blown them off yet is, frankly, astonishing.

asking him explain his actions and pointing out the downsides and hypocrisy isn’t, is it?

No, it’s the demanding an appearance before Congress and acting like refusing to appear or answer to their satisfaction is grounds for contempt charges which should be off-limits. (For nearly reason they’ve asked anyone to appear in recent memory. It’s all theater and compelled speech.)

Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re:

And almost always, Congress has no business doing this whatsoever. The fact that no one has blown them off yet is, frankly, astonishing.

Think social, not legal. For pete’s sake, it’s in the name of the product they selling. INAL but gov’t can’t sue if they don’t show but can widely publicise they didn’t show.

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Anonymous Coward says:

All this stuff with Elon buying twitter really just highlights how warped the perception of twitter has become. Imagine someone saying:

News about arbitrary suspension of journalists on Myspace is worrying. EU’s Digital Services Act requires respect of media freedom and fundamental rights.

or

News about arbitrary suspension of journalists on Tumblr is worrying. EU’s Digital Services Act requires respect of media freedom and fundamental rights.

Sounds quite absurd, doesn’t it? Yet at the end of the day, they and Twitter are fundamentally the same. The only differences are how popular they became, and what features they offer.

Yet because Twitter became by far the most popular, suddenly its micro-blogging service is treated as though it were essential communication and a new owner changing the ban criteria to suit his whims is treated as a grave violation of fundamental rights. What’s next? Governments demanding accountability because some journalist gets banned from Reddit?

Anonymous Coward says:

Re:

Imho, it’s a sign that the company has gotten worryingly big, and has too few/weak competitors.

It’s not a violation of the first amendment, but the reason the first amendment exists is that it’s a bad thing if a single organization can censor people and/or topics from the realm of public discussion.

If a company has gotten so powerful that it approaches being able to do that, that’s a problem, for the same reason that we have anti-trust regulation: letting profit (or ego) driven corporations have too much market power leads to bad things.

I would think that their would be a plausible anti-trust complaint in the censoring of mastodon links: similar to how microsoft got issue with bundling IE ~20 years ago, or google prioritize it’s services over competitors in the search results.

Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re:

Only one organization can censor: Government.

And it’s not even like Twitter (which also is not that big, lol) is being all 19th-20th century capitalst and private police disappearing people and literally making it so they can’t speak. Which still isn’t censorship, unless governmentall sanctioned.

Tanner Andrews (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re: more than one

Only one organization can censor: Government.

Dictionary defines censor:
* to examine in order to suppress (see suppress sense 2) or delete anything considered objectionable

Many organizations can do that. For instance, the local newspaper can censor its letters-to-editor page, replacing or omitting undesired speech. Television stations reporting on the Nixon tapes could bleep out certain words.

A porn site may censor comments urging people to watch less porn or to view pictures of different porn stars. And twitter can censor criticism of the owner.

None of this presents a 1A problem because in each case it is a private entity controlling its own property.

Toom1275 (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re:2

To turn a the above half-truth into the whole truth:

suppress
verb
sup·​press sə-ˈpres
suppressed; suppressing; suppresses
transitive verb

1
: to put down by authority or force : SUBDUE
suppress a riot
2
: to keep from public knowledge: such as
a
: to keep secret
b
: to stop or prohibit the publication or revelation of

Private “censorship” hardly fits the full definition.

Stephen T. Stone (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re:3

More to the point: Censorship is about denying people either access to information or the right to speak their minds. Private entities can do those things, but that generally involves the threat of government involvement (e.g., lawsuits) or some form of violence (or the threat thereof). Someone being banned on Twitter, for example, is not the same as someone shutting up because they were threatened at gunpoint.

Tanner Andrews (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re:3 more than one

to keep from public knowledge: such as a: to keep secret

Right you are. And I can certainly keep things from public knowledge, or at least reduce public access to knowledge, without government involvement.

Consider a tobacco vendor. They may, through selective funding of research institutions, effectively limit the spread of information about unhealthful effects of their product.

Or consider a social media cry-baby. He can, through account management practices, limit the spread of information as to where his airplane is to be found.

Or consider a coal mine. The operator may use Pinkertons to prevent information about working conditions from gaining public attention.

The information may not be entirely stamped out. People may eventually find out that tobacco is not good for them, or where airplanes are to be found, or that coal companies do not care about you. but the respective entities can at least suppress information spread.

Tanner Andrews (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re:5 more than one

Minor quibble here.

What if the information is publicly available?

Then, as I said, the information may not be entirely suppressed. People may eventually find out about coal mine conditions, health detriments of tobacco, deleterious effects of truck-based long-haul delivery systems, and even perhaps airplane locations.

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ZT says:

More like the government has no business getting involved in this one, extremely distracting but ultimately petty issue.

The government has plenty business involving itself in Musk’s apparent violations of privacy law, employment law, and hamstringing of the company’s trust and safety team to the extent that doing so compromises the ability to remove CSAM.

There’s so much more at stake here than hurt feelings and culture wars.

bigbrother’s bigdaddy says:

Re: Re: Al dente

well, it often comes down to holding a transcendental belief of digital space as being more than bits of information …and then going around trying to convince others that those bits are somehow more of a physical reality than the medium in which they are expressed.

30 years in, aren’t we done experimenting , don’t we have a more common sense approach for deciding just who’s job it is to protect the Commons?

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Matthew Bennett says:

What the fuck is wrong with you?

You goddamned, actual moron.

Twitter was already fucked up, already losing vasts amount of money, AND THE FBI WAS IN CONSTANT CONTACT WITH THE CENSORSHIP TEAM. This has been proven now.

You don’t have to like it (based on what you did like, I’m glad you don’t) but this is way way better than it was before.

Just shut the fuck up. You’re gaslighting now. Saying utterly untrue nonsense and trying to pretend it matters.

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Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Re:

I’m not the one running a one-man harassment campaign to get Mike to “issue an apology and never write about Twitter again”.

I’m not the one shilling for an authoritian who shills for others like him.

I’m not the one who’s against free expression and freedom of the press.

And I don’t fit the FBI definition of a terrorist.

You do. And you’re eventually gonna try to assassinate Mike anyway, so if the shoe fits…

Synonymous Scaredycat (profile) says:

Well, you’ve been picking at the flaws in EU’s content regulation for some time now. I think this is a good thing, not because the EU is making good choices , but because they’re fucking up and will be forced to have a ‘learning experience’ because of it. The motivation to address problems in online communication is understandable, but the plan I saw mentioned from Germany seemed better: stop relying on social media to distribute important government content!

The same applies to journalism, being reliant on social media is a dead end and not doing so offers a chance to revitalize actual news and reporting. Meanwhile, Elon Musk’s actions are the trash (Elon) taking himself out: he’s shown himself to be a boldfaced hypocrite and liar to everyone whose support he’s ever courted.

I guess there’s yet another poll (or three? or more?) asking about reinstating the journalists; supposedly ‘the people’ have required the banned journalists to be reinstated already. Maybe he’ll save some ‘free speech’ face that way, maybe not.

Meanwhile the rest of us can be motivated towards actually sharing content of length and quality on longer-form sites and blogs. TechDirt is an obvious example, but it’s not like we can’t all fediverse our way into creating more lasting and impactful content than blips on an infinite scrolling/refreshing/random feed.

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David says:

Re: Re:

If banning fascists, racists, queerphobes, and mis- and disinformation peddlers “appeases the left”, what does that say about “the right”?

That the right is not susceptible to the messages of fascists, racists, queerphobes, and mis- and disinformation peddlers and needs no mollycoddling censors to protect their feeble understanding from people enjoying a hearty laugh?

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ThorsProvoni (profile) says:

Technological Development Has Sunset Section 230

I put two short articles on Quora to explain why a 2022 Social Medium Platform does not come close to meeting the Section 230 definition of an Interactive Computer Service (ICS).

  1. So What was a 1996 § 230 Access Software Provider?
  2. What Is an Interactive Computer Service by Careful Grammatical and Syntactic Analysis?

The definition of an ICS is a matter of law. SCOTUS can rule in any Section 230 litigation that a 2022 Social Medium Platform is not a Section 230 ICS, and everybody wins.

When SCOTUS wants, it can be extremely picky with respect to the text of a statute as the ruling of Patterson v. McLean Credit Union, 491 U.S. 164, 109 S. Ct. 2363 (1989), indicates.

Section 230 caselaw is a judicial coup against the American public. This coup takes away Constitutional rights of the American public (1st Amendment, 9th Amendment, and 14th Amendment) and unconstitutionally confers 1st Amendment rights on wealthy message common carrier megacorporations to the harm of the US political system as I argue in Martillo v. Twitter [22-532].

SCOTUS does not have to respect precedents, and it’s attachment to a legal stance can be eroded.

  1. Dred Scott (chattel slavery, white supremacy) was overturned.
  2. Lochner (ban on labor legislation) was overturned.
  3. Plessy (segregation) was overturned.
  4. Roe (mostly unlimited right to abortion) was overturned.

Vitiating Section 230 immunity should be much easier. SCOTUS has never ruled on Zeran-based caselaw.

SCOTUS now has my blanket consent for amicus briefs in 22-532.

A Medium Corp takes my argument seriously and has hired an “award-winning brief writer and experienced oral advocate” to oppose my petition. I wonder whether Musk’s commitment to free speech extends to CRA protected groups. So far Facebook and LinkedIn, which are two extremely discriminatory social medium platforms, have been trying to ignore my litigation.

Please take a look at the two short articles on the meaning of ICS. I studied with top linguistics scholars at Harvard and MIT. In the petition‘s argument for a grant of cert, I applied the legal knowledge that I acquired while I worked with the pre-Breakup AT&T legal department.

[I am also running a fundraiser: The Ninth Amendment Challenge to Social Medium Abuse. I have raised approximately $4,000.]

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Synonymous Scaredycat (profile) says:

Re: Re:

And a tellingly unintelligent comparison; Twitter (for all it’s many flaws and issues) was much more like an unending (or intended to be) tapestry than it was like a person, and you can’t rape a tapestry even you can do your best to destroy it. To make such a comparison is at best an admittance of the writer’s desires.

Instead every user was a weaver, even if simply observing the action of warp and weft from the sidelines. That it outgrew the ability of the weavers running the loom to keep if from fraying apart was obvious to some, but easily ignored by most in how entrancing the nearly-magical way different threads knitted together to create not just portraits of the users, but landscapes of whole communities, triptychs of current events, and so on.

Then some troll who fancied himself a brilliant smith became not just entranced with tapestry as so many others had, but addicted to the power it made him, just as many others had. So he took his army of weak automatons, brain-washed cultists, treasure-hoarding dragons, and sung the battlehymns of the Troll-in-Chief (which sound a bit like Tucker Carlson’s worst gastric distress).

And having often tried to become weavers in the past despite being frustrated by their inability to grasp that the point was to weave instead of rend, that army declared triumph and began to ‘weave’ in earnest, never having learned from their previous failures at such a seemingly-simple task. And so those trolls sit in burned and torn strands, thinking themselves won.

While the weavers have certainly not been idle, instead increasing creating new tapestries after having learnt so much from this one. This may be a battle the weavers lost, but in our exodus a diasporic diversity of approaches has arisen while our former tormentors are trapped in their own pyrrhic ‘victory’ in an increasingly flame-ridden dumpster fire that was once intended to be something more.

In my years on Twitter, I learned so much; I also learned that the ‘value’ in social media is created by me, whether I’m creating content or consuming it. That means I have the power and not the trolls who are busy masturbating to the most useless scraps of what the weavers of words left behind and thinking it’s… something. Often a violent and disgusting power fantasy like turdop’s above, because at heart the trolls are all incels.

And from the scraps we brought with us elsewhere to establish new tapestries, we’re already making beauty and creating more than Twitter really allowed for. Personally I’ve decided that blogging suffers from the same issue of often being linked to some kind of feed like Facebook and Twitter (and Mastodon, I guess), as well as generally being too short-form; this is a personal preference since I prefer to reading to podcasts and videos, and I prefer books to magazines.

However as a writer (aka a weaver of words), I also know some of my intended audience only reads bite-size chapters of serialization typical in modern webnovels as much as other readers in my intended audience may prefer to hold a book made of dead trees in their hands like I do. Blogging might sometimes be able to meet the former need, but Twitter never could. And instead of blogs, there are dedicated webnovel apps where writers can publish. Instead of writing a novel’s worth of tweets just to try to engage people, I can spend my time writing actual novels and planning a serialized publishing strategy.

I was giving away free labor to Twitter and getting nothing in return, now I’ve finally found a way to take the typing practice I got there and put it to good use weaving my own tapestries. And the trolls won nothing by my leaving Twitter, because nothing they do is winning. It’s just losing increasingly loudly, while everyone else goes back to actually getting things done.

Synonymous Scaredycat (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re:

I’m pretty sure “well, it’s not unexpected” is just a way of saying “I expected this” with double-negatives.

That is, it was expected. More importantly it’s telling than whether it was unexpected or not. While it’s really not new information, it’s at least consistent shitbaggery.

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Chozen (profile) says:

Re: Re:

” Congress has always had the power to look into direct attacks, find out who did what etc.”

No they don’t. This last “referral” proved what a crock the whole trying was. Congress has the authority to investigate for a legislative purpose. They ended it with criminal referrals and no proposed legislation.

Rocky says:

Re: Re: Re:

No they don’t.

Yes they have, or are you actually suggesting Congress can’t look into possible criminal actions? Seems you are conflating what they can do with what they can’t do in responding. Congress can legally gather evidence and information on who did what but they can’t take legal action on that which is why any result from this type of committee always ends with no action, legislative suggestions, criminal referrals or a combination of the last two.

Chozen (profile) says:

“Yes they have, or are you actually suggesting Congress can’t look into possible criminal actions?” Any Article III investigation must serve a “valid legislative purpose” Quinn 1955. For the Jan 6th committee to end with no proposed legislation but instead criminal referrals means that everyone involved in the drafts and arguments submitted to the court committed perjury and should go to jail.

Rocky says:

Re:

Any Article III investigation must serve a “valid legislative purpose” Quinn 1955. For the Jan 6th committee to end with no proposed legislation but instead criminal referrals means that everyone involved in the drafts and arguments submitted to the court committed perjury and should go to jail.

You should really read up on what “valid legislative purpose” encompasses when it comes to what powers the Congress wields while investigating events it was directly involved in. The case you are referring to actually says this about Congress power to investigate: *It cannot be used to inquire into private affairs unrelated to a valid legislative purpose *, and the case specifically talks about forcing a witness, a private citizen, to possibly incriminate himself.

I should add that it doesn’t say anywhere that a committee must end with a proposed legislation because that’s just plain stupid since a reasonable assumption is that some committee’s will come to the conclusion that no new legislation is necessary (and that has actually happened). You are of course free to point to any law, regulation or policy that binds a Congress committee to always come up with a legislative change. I wish you good luck on that.

As usual when you quote from a legal case you totally misunderstand what it actually says.

Chozen (profile) says:

“Yes they have, or are you actually suggesting Congress can’t look into possible criminal actions?” Any Article I investigation must serve a “valid legislative purpose” Quinn 1955. For the Jan 6th committee to end with no proposed legislation but instead criminal referrals means that everyone involved in the drafts and arguments submitted to the court committed perjury and should go to jail.

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