Hadopi Already Up To Sending Out 25,000 'First Strike' Notices Per Day

from the no-internet-for-you dept

When Hadopi first started sending out “you’re an infringer!” first strike notices last month, we noted that it was initially sending out 10,000 per day with plans to ramp up to 50,000. It isn’t taking long. The latest reports show that it’s already sending out 25,000 notices per day. That seems like an awful lot. Remember, in all the years the RIAA was suing individuals for file sharing, it only ended up suing 18,000 people total, though it threatened legal action against 30,000.

Of course, this should give you an indication of why the entertainment industry likes these sorts of three strikes things much more than actual due process and lawsuits. They can go after a lot more people, for a lot less money, and a lot less of pesky due process and silly antiquated concepts like “innocent until proven guilty.”

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Comments on “Hadopi Already Up To Sending Out 25,000 'First Strike' Notices Per Day”

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Anonymous Coward says:


The good news is that, it doesn’t matter, no law will stop the “piracy phenomenon”, because that is about connecting with others and the only way to stop it is to stop all inter-communications between people and I don’t see that happening ever.

I read that some in the industry want to bring “piracy” to acceptable levels, that always put a smile on my face. To see how naive some people can be assuming of course that was the real intent of those statements.

Since the law in France was passed filesharing grew 3% already and it is showing no signs of slowing.

Perhaps in 10 years other will see how this all works out, in the meantime I will continue to backup my DVD’s, not to buy music from labels and their hundreds of fronts and keep teasing them about it.

I’m a pissed off consumer, one that will not give a f’ing dime to those people if I can help it, more importantly I’m aggressively lobbying everybody I know to find alternatives, pirating that stuff is still giving them something that has value and that is attention.

Karl (profile) says:

Re: Re:

Since the law in France was passed filesharing grew 3% already

Do you have a source for this? I’m not being snarky, I’d actually like to see the data.

I’d also like to see the sales records for recorded music. Have these laws resulted in any increase in French people buying music? I suspect the answer is no.

(Not that the law is justified either way, of course.)

Karl (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re: Re:

Mike did a little writeup on just that a few months ago.

Thanks! I don’t know how I missed that.

If you read the original article, it also makes an interesting observation:

Another remarkable statistic uncovered by the researchers is that half of all P2P users who download copyrighted content also buy digital content online. This means that if these users were disconnected from the Internet under the new law, the music industry would lose customers and thus revenue.

Emphasis mine.

Kicking “pirates” off the ‘net won’t just stop them from being pirates. It will eliminate any means by which they can become paying customers. Considering that “pirates” are bigger customers than non-“pirates,” this means you’ll lose almost all of your online business, and probably a significant part of your “brick and mortar” business as well.

That’s why I’m waiting to see what effect this will have on legitimate music sales. I’m expecting those sales to drop… dramatically.

Hephaestus (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re:2 Re:

“That’s why I’m waiting to see what effect this will have on legitimate music sales. I’m expecting those sales to drop… dramatically.”

Shhhh!!! be quite stop talking about this the record labels might hear you! … Oh wait, when have they ever done the smart thing, or not done the self defeating thing … never mind continue

John Paul Jones says:

Re: Re: France, the country full of outlaws?

Prohibition is such a moronic analogy.

During Prohibition, the purchase of alcohol was illegal.
It isn’t illegal to purchase music.

It’s just that you used to be able to get away with taking it illegally.

Freetards are throwing a tantrum because people are finally wise to how much they rip people off.

Now go make me a sandwich. I’ve decided I’m entitled to a free one. Get to it.

The Mighty Buzzard (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re: France, the country full of outlaws?

Prohibition was a dead on example actually making a large portion of the nation outlaws not an analogy.

Also, I don’t throw tantrums about what the publishing companies are doing. I mock them. It’s more in line with my own particular idiom.

Further, I don’t download music. I also don’t buy it. On the rare occasion that I actually want to listen to it, I find a streaming site online, do so, and close the browser tab when I’m done. I just enjoy mocking fools; it’s great fun.

make: *** No rule to make target `sandwich’. Stop.

Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Re: France, the country full of outlaws?

“It’s just that you used to be able to get away with taking it illegally.”

A-ha ha ha ha ha-Ooh he he he-aha oh he ha…
I actually almost did a spit take reading that.

Used to be able to? Used to?

BitTorrent. Misnamed rapidshares, sharebees, megauploads. Invite only share sites. Open wifi. Good encryption. Darknets.

And hell, if those fail, we’ll go back to Sneakernets.

Mike42 (profile) says:

Re: France, the country full of outlaws?

Sarkozy doesn’t care about pissing people off. The entire country’s shut down right now with people striking and rioting about a law which will increase the retirement age. Rather than back down, he’s pushing the bill through faster!

From what I’ve heard on NPR, the French see him as another rich jerk. I don’t know how he was elected, but then, I don’t know how Dub-Yah was elected, and I have no clue how Dub-Yah was re-elected.

Anonymous Coward says:


On the political front, China has reduced the exports of rare earth metals to low levels that threatens the high tech industries of other countries this is what you get when you piss off others.

This is why the U.S. will not be able to enforce ridiculous laws everywhere, they don’t get the power to do so, the BRIC is growing in influence and together with Africa they are owners of almost all raw resources available on earth and China owns Africa while the U.S. lost the capacity to influence Africa.

India, Brazil and some African countries have already organized something I think it is called Like Minded Megadiverse Countries (LMMC).

The LMMC Group has been created to Act as a mechanism of cooperation to promote their interests regarding biological diversity and in particular the protection of traditional knowledge, access to genetic resources and the fair and equitable sharing of benefits derived from their use.


Colgate the biopirate 🙂

About the rule of law, 2 U.S. marshals flee Brazil after being charged with assault for handcuffing a passenger in a flight.


If the law is the law, those 2 marshals should be in a jail by now right? Not even law enforcement apparently respect the law in the U.S..

Us one politician once said, “For my friends everything for my enemies the law”, it reminds me of Bush Jr.

btr1701 (profile) says:

Re: Law

> Not even law enforcement apparently respect the
> law in the U.S..

When the law is being used to gain petty vindictive revenge, then actions like those taken by the air marshals are appropriate.

No one disputes what happened on that flight and Brazil was clearly violating provisions of its treaty with the U.S. in charging the marshals. So if Brazil isn’t willing to abide by its own laws, why should the marshals have stood idly by and be railroaded by a notoriously corrupt justice system?

This problem could easily be solved by issuing all air marshals on international flights diplomatic passports and protecting them with diplomatic immunity.

Richard (profile) says:

Fifty Million Frenchmen

At that rate, in five years they’ll hit 50 Million, maybe they’ll remember the reputation for freedom France used to have…

“When they put on a show, and it’s a hit
No one tries to censor it
Fifty million Frenchmen can’t be wrong.
And when a book is selling at it’s best
It isn’t stopped; it’s not suppressed.
Fifty million Frenchmen can’t be wrong.”


Rikuo (profile) says:

Re: Simple math.

“Sarkosy will pass a law forcing people to buy one CD each month?”

Actually…go back through the Techdirt articles a bit and you’ll find one where Sarkozy is using taxpayer money to subsidize music download cards. Basically, the taxpayer pays half the cost, and the end purchaser pays the other half.
Does the fact that Sarkozy’s wife is a famous singer matter at all? No, clearly it doesn’t…

Rich Kulawiec says:

Time to call their bluff

Everyone in France should make it a point to be detected as “infringing”. (It occurs to me that perhaps I should write a browser plug-in that will trip the detectors each time a button is pushed.) Everyone.

Then let’s see how long this lasts. Is France, as a nation, actually willing to cut off its entire population to prop up extortionists?

Anonymous Coward says:

Article is completely wrong

If you read the news quoted by the article it says that “rights-holders are reporting 25,000 music related copyright infringements to HADOPI every day” it doesn’t say anywhere that 25000 mails are sent everyday !!

If you read this (in french sorry) http://www.pcinpact.com/actu/news/60008-hadopi-volumetrie-identification-email.htm

it says that the goal is to reach 1000/2000 emails everyday by end of 2010 …

Anyway, it still sucks but misinformation is what help pass these kind of laws so might as well set things straight where we can…

Jeb says:

Reasonable mode of cost recovery

I’m not an RIAA fan by any means, but I have a big problem with depriving artists of reasonable compensation for the fruits of their labors. While it’s ridiculous to think that we could ever stop piracy outright, I believe that cost recovery for the producers of digital goods is something that should be pursued so that the artists and developers continue to produce the things we need and/or enjoy.

The Mighty Buzzard (profile) says:

Re: Reasonable mode of cost recovery

Wait, when did making your money back become a certainty in the anything publishing business?

That said, they’re only hurting at all because Apple and Amazon beat them to the “setting up a usable, online music store” chase. If they’d done it themselves, they wouldn’t be having to give Apple or Amazon a thin dime of their profits.

If they’d bought Napster and stuck their entire catalogs on it at say a quarter per song, they’d be laughing all the way to the bank. But that’s new, change, frightening, so they scream bloody murder that their buggy whips^W^W CDs aren’t selling as well as they’d like anymore.

fogbugzd (profile) says:

50K angry customers a day

What kind of business model is based on an objective of making 50,000 customers angry every day? Even if the strategy is 100% effective in shutting down file sharing will it create new CD or movie sales? There is lots of evidence that illegal downloaders also buy a lot of music. How many thousand of those customers swear off ever buying a CD or movie again?

For that matter, how many political parties can survive a system that angers 50,000 voters a day?

John Paul Jones says:

Re: 50K angry customers a day

Those aren’t customers. They’re assholes that have been stealing from us for 10 years. They obviously don’t care about us, so…

Fuck em.

There’s nothing they can do now that’s any worse than what they’ve already done.

You freetards don’t get it. You don’t understand what is happening.

fogbugzd (profile) says:

Re: Re: 50K angry customers a day

You still didn’t answer the basic question. How is Hadopi going to increase music and movie sales?

Perhaps you just want revenge on the people you think destroyed your business. There are two problems with this line of thought. First, the free downloaders are not the ones who destroyed your business. You can look within your own corporate suites to find the guilty parties. Second, revenge is very expensive. Few businesses can afford revenge because it means taking a huge hit in longterm viability. The big labels are already in trouble and can’t afford too many more big hits. In this case the music industry is essentially admitting defeat and announcing plans to go out of business entirely. The only question is whether they will manage to take the movie industry down with them.

Hephaestus (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re: 50K angry customers a day

“You can look within your own corporate suites to find the guilty parties.”

That is a very astute point.

“The only question is whether they will manage to take the movie industry down with them.”

Its a given that there will be backlash against all content companies based on Hadopi and three strikes. If you look at the US and how pissed the population is towards the politicians, the same thing will occur but it will be directed at big content. You will also have better and more encrypted communication occur.

A great line … “alienating your customers is a business model that only works until you go out of business”.

Christopher Gizzi (profile) says:

Re: Re: 50K angry customers a day

Freetards? What are we? Third Graders? It would be nice if you came to the discussion with civility.

But beyond your childish name calling, they are customers… they are lost customers. They are people you failed to convince your content is worth paying for. Offer value and, more often than not, they’ll buy. You have to earn your paying customers with respect good value for their hard earned dollar.

You’re competing against a diverse amount of global content; the competition for a persons time and money is fierce and you can’t waste your efforts pissing people off. You won’t convince anyone to buy your wares that way.

You certainly deserve to earn a living; no one says you shouldn’t. But with your name calling, its going to be hard for you to earn a living.

Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: 50K angry customers a day

Man, you’re making me miss TAM.

At least TAM always found some tenuous (sometimes hilarious) point of criticism. Sometimes I would think “Damn, this is some solid point. How will TAM attack this one?”, and TAM always came through.

You, on the other hand, just come here and insult everyone. You are no fun. Please go away.

Karl (profile) says:

Re: Re: 50K angry customers a day

Those aren’t customers.

I know I said I wouldn’t respond to you, but this is one of the “big myths” that people like to repeat all the time: that people who download illegally won’t pay for music, and “just want stuff for free.”

The fact is, every legitimate study ever made proves this is wrong. People who illegally share files actually buy much more music, legally, than people who do not. For instance:

A study released this week by Jupiter Research reports that about 34 percent of veteran file swappers say they are spending more on music than they did before they started downloading files.
Study: File sharing boosts music sales

Digital music research firm The Leading Question found that they spent four and a half times more on paid-for music downloads than average fans.
Downloading ‘myths’ challenged

A newly study commissioned by Industry Canada, which includes some of the most extensive surveying to date of the Canadian population on music purchasing habits, finds what many have long suspected (though CRIA has denied) – there is a positive correlation between peer-to-peer downloading and CD purchasing.
Gov’t Commissioned Study Finds P2P Downloaders Buy More Music

Researchers monitored the music download habits of 1,900 web users age 15 and above. Over time, the study found that users who downloaded music illegally from P2P file-sharing sites like BitTorrent ultimately made ten times as many legit music purchases than the law abiding users.
Study finds file-sharers buy ten times more music

Now, obviously, studies like this cannot prove that illegal file sharing causes legit purchases (correllation is not causation), though it does suggest the possibility. What it does prove is that the core base of music fans, and the core base of music “pirates,” are exactly the same people.

So, yes: When you attack pirates, you attack your biggest customers.

Perhaps this could be the next “debunking” post on Techdirt?

Hephaestus (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re: 50K angry customers a day


This is like a religious conviction for them. They have someone to blame for their downfall and nothing you do or say is going to change their beliefs. It reminds me of all the times in history where the line “Its not your fault you ar poor, stupid and starving. It the (insert racial, religious, or bad guy of your choosing here) that are causing this”. Once it starts it becomes a closed, self reinforcing system that denies any proof to the contrary. A system were denial of proof runs rampant, were discent is shouted down, were people who do discent are excluded from the group, and rationalizing of actions occurs on a daily basis.

All in in these people are following in the footsteps of any number of cults.

oh and the point … the proof you provided will be ignored, even if read it will be forgotten with in a couple days.


RD says:

Re: Re: 50K angry customers a day

“Fuck em.

There’s nothing they can do now that’s any worse than what they’ve already done.

You freetards don’t get it. You don’t understand what is happening.”

I do. I accuse you of copyright infringement of my songs. I will be filing a complaint with your ISP, followed by 2 more complaints, and then your internet service will be disconnected. I will continue this process every time I can find any ISP you have service with. I will ensure that you either never have internet service again, or have to constantly change ISP’s and re-establish new accounts, over and over.

Still seem like a good idea to you? As no proof is needed, and the sole determining factor is the rights holders’ belief in the infringement of whomever they are accusing, this should be A-OK with you, as you fully support the side of the rights holders to operate this way. See you soon.

TtfnJohn (profile) says:

Re: Re: 50K angry customers a day

They’re assholes that have been stealing from us for 10 years

I was kidding above when I said you wanted us to believe that you played bass for Zep.

Now I’m starting to think you believe it yourself.

Oh, and I’m soooooo insulted by your grade school insults.

Now report to the office, you have an appointment with the Vice Principal and his handy strap.

Free Capitalist (profile) says:

Burden of Poof....

Hadopi Already Up To Sending Out 25,000 ‘First Strike’ Notices Per Day

Anyone else have a suspicion that french World of Warcraft players and everyone else “sharing” any torrents whatsoever are getting these notices? I’m curious to see how this plays out in the next six months.

At least when they had the burden of proof to make a civil case, the industry reps had to try to correlate a particular seeded torrent with a copyrighted work.

With no burden of proof whatsoever, what is the incentive to verify anything?

Emilio says:

I have nothing against Musicians/Producers/Engineers getting paid for their work. I do have a problem with obsolete distribution monopolies claiming exclusive rights to all that money, then giving as little of it as possible to the people who actually make music, and turning us all into criminals by default with their greedy, under-handed attempts to co-opt the rule of law to their advantage. Makes me cringe to think how they’re ruining the rest of the world’s opinion of a country I used to be proud of…

Will (profile) says:

When a notice is not a notice


The story may have got lost in translation. Notice, in the French Hadopi context, is when a file has been detected on the network. “Notice” in the English speaking countries of UK and USA is a notification to the ISP customer. You cant easily track and detect 25,000 files a day, but then you make a decision as to how many infringers should be notified. Notifying customers costs money, the marginal cost of detection is closer to zero given the infrastructure.

Can’t promise this is 100% accurate but pretty sure I’ve got it right – hope this helps you and your readers.

Ben says:

Should we question the numbers?

Some more analysis would be welcome here. If the numbers are correct, they have created a monster. The problem is that they sound hyped up, for propaganda purposes (you can run but you can’t hide…).

Twenty-five THOUSAND per day? That adds up quickly. 175,000 in a week. 700,000 in a month. France’s internet users won’t last long… But of course, these are not unique users; how many people will then manage to rack up three notices in a month or two?

And I may have missed something, but where, exactly, does the entertainment industry get these IP addresses? I assume they monitor bittorrent traffic — but how much of it? How effective are the infringement trackers in rooting out infringers of their content (or their clients’ content)?

With so many receivers of infringement notices, there should soon be a wave of disconnections — perhaps Hadopi will brag about that too. I doubt those that are disconnected will remain silent — we should find out then whether this number has any basis in reality. My feeling is that it is incredibly inflated.

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