Google Ordered To Reveal Blogger's IP In Israel
from the sorry,-no-anonymity-for-you dept
Someone who prefers to remain anonymous writes in to let us know that: "An Israeli court has ordered Google to reveal the identity of a blogger that uses Google's own blogging platform, Blogger. The blogger accused a Shaarei Tikva comity member of illegal acts all through his blog posts. Google objected to the request claiming freedom of speech, however the court sided with the plaintiff and said that since the plaintiff is a public figure running for reelection, he is allowed to confront his accuser and clear his name." Google did, apparently, try to reach the blogger in question who did not respond, and the company only needs to hand over an IP address -- which isn't necessarily the blogger's "identity," though it could lead to it. There's nothing wrong with a court requiring a service provider to cough up identifying information on someone who has broken the law -- but it gets into very tricky territory when it comes to things like libel. We recently covered a number of similar cases in the UK where the results were the same -- but a case in the US had the judge determine that the anonymous speech was protected and the person shouldn't be revealed. It seems likely that we're only going to see more of these cases over time -- and questions about jurisdiction are only going to make them more confusing. What if the blogger in this case actually resides in the US, for example?
Reader Comments (rss)
(Flattened / Threaded)
Here's an idea... by TheDock22 on Nov 27th, 2007 @ 9:30am
Don't let people be anonymous on the Internet. Then maybe they would be a tad bit more thoughtful in what they post.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
by GrammarMan on Nov 27th, 2007 @ 9:33am
First sentence after the quote uses "thought" instead of "though"... just so you know =)
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
by atomatom on Nov 27th, 2007 @ 9:36am
If the blogger is Israeli then Google is doing business in Israel, and has to treat its Israeli customers under Israeli law. If they can't abide by Israeli law then they should not let Israelis use their services.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Here's an idea... by OwningXylophone on Nov 27th, 2007 @ 9:39am
"Don't let people be anonymous on the Internet."
Isn't that a touch hypocritical coming from someone called 'TheDock22'??
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Here's an idea... by anon on Nov 27th, 2007 @ 9:54am
....says Dock22.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
by Jack B. Nimble on Nov 27th, 2007 @ 9:57am
Hey Dock22,
Would you please include your ip address when you post.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Here's an idea... by Casper on Nov 27th, 2007 @ 10:06am
Wow, that is quite possibly the most idiotic thing I have heard today. I applaud you for the humor you have contributed to my day, however, I object to the fact you may reproduce.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: by Mike on Nov 27th, 2007 @ 10:07am
First sentence after the quote uses "thought" instead of "though"... just so you know =)
Fixed, thanks!
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: by Rick on Nov 27th, 2007 @ 10:09am
"If the blogger is Israeli then Google is doing business in Israel"
Isn't the blogger doing business in the USA since Google is in the US? Does Google need to obey an Israeli court?
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
anonymous posting ... by Ed Alexander (Indianapolis) on Nov 27th, 2007 @ 10:11am
Anonymous posting breeds rude comments and degrades our ability to use a civil approach to find the truth.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Here's an idea... by Yea Right on Nov 27th, 2007 @ 10:12am
So "TheDock22" Is that the name your mother gave ya ?
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: anonymous posting ... by Anonymous 2 on Nov 27th, 2007 @ 10:22am
Fuck you, Ed
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
by atomatom on Nov 27th, 2007 @ 10:24am
"Isn't the blogger doing business in the USA since Google is in the US? Does Google need to obey an Israeli court?"
Really, it's both. The blogger is doing business with a US company... but Google is accessed in Israel. It's complicated, but I suppose it's sort of like Google is shipping a product to Israel that has to comply with Israeli regulations.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
by Bob Jones on Nov 27th, 2007 @ 10:44am
I think the country where the user lives is key ... especially if Google does anything there, like R&D.
I think expectations to export American law around the globe are a tad colonial ...
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: Here's an idea... by TheDock22 on Nov 27th, 2007 @ 10:47am
So "TheDock22" Is that the name your mother gave ya ?
Well Dock is in my name. But I was mostly trying to be sarcastic than make a truthful statement. People are touchy today.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Ha-Ha-Ha-Ha-Ha by angry dude on Nov 27th, 2007 @ 10:56am
Hey, Mikey
You know my IP, don't you ?
Now try to get a name... Good luck with that...
Hint: if you post through a proxy firewall the only way to get a computer and person id is by using a court ordered subpoena on firewall logs - a highly unlikely event unless you do something really really stipud, like threaten some high-ranking government official etc.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: anonymous posting ... by B on Nov 27th, 2007 @ 10:56am
"Anonymous posting breeds rude comments and degrades our ability to use a civil approach to find the truth." People also tend speak more truthfully when anonymous.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
by Verse on Nov 27th, 2007 @ 10:57am
+1 for user lives ruling, when you sign up for things like prize games and things, it clearly states in the EUA that you must be in a country that allows this, thus it's irrelevant where the servers are held, it's up to the user to abide by the rules in their own country IMO
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Ha-Ha-Ha-Ha-Ha by Chuck Norris' Enemy (deceased) on Nov 27th, 2007 @ 11:06am
You think Mike cares? Jokes on you paranoid angry dude.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Re: Ha-Ha-Ha-Ha-Ha by angry dude on Nov 27th, 2007 @ 11:22am
angry dude doesn't care
Always wear clean underwear
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: anonymous posting ... by Anonymous Coward on Nov 27th, 2007 @ 11:37am
Anonymous posting also allows the truth to come out in cases where people fear some type of persecution for telling it.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Doing business in Israel by Shun on Nov 27th, 2007 @ 11:39am
Fortunately, or not, when you do business in a foreign country, you need to abide by their laws. If a blogger starts his blog in Israel, it makes Google into a "doing business in Israel site". This is true of all commercial law. As long as some company puts its goods into the "Stream of Commerce" any court can claim jurisdiction.
There are famous U.S. cases about this practice. Most notably, International Shoe v. Washington (326 U.S. 310 (1945)). The question should be: "Is Google 'doing business' by making blogspot available to people in Israel?" Are they making any money from blogspot? Probably.
There is precedent for blocking IP addresses coming from foreign IP's. Notice Torrentspy's decision to block all U.S. originating IP addresses. This would turn Google into a non-world-wide phenomenon (offer not available in certain countries, YMMV). Of course, the horse is already out the gate, in this case, so it won't help this Anonymous Blogger.
Google can whine and go to the U.S. government. We'll see what happens after that. This could get interesting.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Oops, I meant Blogger by Shun on Nov 27th, 2007 @ 11:41am
Sorry, my mistake.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Here's an idea... by Danglerose on Nov 27th, 2007 @ 11:42am
I appreciate the simplicity of your approach, but with the apathy already rampant in our society (and others) we need to encourage people to speak out, and then rely on our own grey matter to separate fact from fiction. I am willing to tolerate infinite rudeness if it leads to the news that we need being brought out into the open since the established media outlets seem less and less inclined and able to do so. Stick and stones, eh..?
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
by freedoman on Nov 27th, 2007 @ 12:10pm
if they don't like it don't read it.freedom of speech at all costs!
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Danglerose .. by Killer_Tofu on Nov 27th, 2007 @ 12:34pm
.. has a very good point and I am inclined to agree.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Doing business in Israel by erock on Nov 27th, 2007 @ 3:08pm
how will israel enforce any ruling on google when all there assets are in the US? Israel cant do anything unless they were to come to the us with weapons and say google give us the ip address.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Re: Doing business in Israel by lost_monkey on Nov 27th, 2007 @ 4:06pm
"Isn't the blogger doing business in the USA since Google is in the US? Does Google need to obey an Israeli court?"
"how will israel enforce any ruling on google when all there assets are in the US? Israel cant do anything unless they were to come to the us with weapons and say google give us the ip address."
All Israel has to do is ban google's ip from their country much like China has done several times, and Google will change their tone. It would be difficult to prove Google is "wrong" by not coughing up the IP, but you can't stop Israel from banning Google either.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
The English translation of the Israeli Blogspot bl by Objective on Dec 3rd, 2007 @ 1:32am
A new blog is providing English translations from the blog and also from the judge's verdict. It is extremely educational. Why don't you see for yourself and then make an informed decision. This is the democratic way. Here is the link: http://shaarei-tikva.behirot.net
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
by Anonymous Coward on Dec 20th, 2007 @ 3:14pm
It would be easy enough to confront the truth with what people say if someone defends their name just as they did against a person who isn't anonymous.
(reply to this comment) (link to this comment)
Add Your Comment