Copyright

by Mike Masnick


Filed Under:
android, api, cafc, copyright, fair use, java

Companies:
google, oracle



Off We Go: Oracle Officially Appeals Google's Fair Use Win

from the off-to-the-races dept

It was only a matter of time until this happened, but Oracle has officially appealed its fair use Java API loss to the Federal Circuit (CAFC). As you recall, after a years-long process, including the (correct) ruling that APIs are not covered by copyright being ridiculously overturned by CAFC, a new trial found that even if APIs are copyright-eligible, Google's use was covered by fair use. Oracle then tried multiple times to get Judge William Alsup to throw out the jury's ruling, but failed. In fact, on Oracle's second attempt to get Alsup to throw out the jury's ruling, citing "game changing" evidence that Google failed to hand over important information on discovery, it actually turned out that Oracle's lawyers had simply failed to read what Google had, in fact, handed over.

And now the case will finally move up a level, as it was always going to do. There should be lots of fireworks here. CAFC is notoriously bad on a variety of issues, but it would take a pretty impressive level of confusion here to mess this up. Going against a jury's findings on fair use is a big ask, and Oracle is likely to try some silly games whining about jury instructions and such. Hopefully CAFC doesn't fall for it. If it does, hopefully, it doesn't muck stuff up as badly as it did with its first ruling in this case, that simply got confused over the nature of what an API actually is.

Reader Comments

Subscribe: RSS

View by: Time | Thread


  • icon
    Norahc (profile), 26 Oct 2016 @ 4:18pm

    Fair use

    If Oracle has such a hard time understanding fair use, then maybe their customers should introduce them to the concept of no use and stop using Java completely.

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • identicon
      Anonymous Coward, 27 Oct 2016 @ 1:06pm

      Re: Fair use

      Few companies use actual Java these days. There are many, many alternatives that are A: better, B: free, C: Not Oracle.

      Their famous attacks on customers for arbitrary license fees that total in the millions are well known, adding Java only incites Oracle to attack more often.

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

      • icon
        Eldakka (profile), 27 Oct 2016 @ 6:41pm

        Re: Re: Fair use

        There are buttloads of companies and organizations (e.g. governments) that still use java and have no plans to replace it.

        And as to your points:

        A) possibly, depending on task. it depends on what you are doing as to whether there are better alternatives.

        B) Java is free. When was the last time you paid:

        • to write code in Java;
        • for a JVM (binaries to run your Java code in) implementation?

        Sure, you CAN pay for those, if you want, but usually you are paying for support or a developer tools (IDE, e.g. J Builder) or management framework (Application Server, e.g. Weblogic, WAS, etc).

        C) There are non-oracle implementations of Java.

        Don't get me wrong, I do dislike, despise even, Oracle the Company - I think them buying Sun was one of the worst events for the IT industry in the last decade.

        reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

        • icon
          Mike (profile), 28 Oct 2016 @ 6:49am

          Re: Re: Re: Fair use

          My particular hatred for them comes from what they did to MySQL. From my perspective, they purchased MySQL just to shut down it's development and protect OracleDB's market share.

          I'm a web developer - a huge number of (I might even go so far as to say most) database driven websites use MySQL. The complete lack of features for it compared to other free databases (PostgreSQL, MariaDB, etc) is shameful, and makes my job a lot harder than it needs to be.

          reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 26 Oct 2016 @ 6:43pm

    It's disgusting that a company would potentially destroy an entire industry (including their own) all for sake of some money.

    I guess that's how you tell when a company has reached irrelevancy. When it's decided on the motto "If I can't have it, then no-one can."

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • identicon
    Zem, 26 Oct 2016 @ 8:07pm

    Headline correction needed

    The page headline should read.

    Oracle to retire JAVA

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • identicon
      Anonymous Coward, 27 Oct 2016 @ 3:08am

      Re: Headline correction needed

      About time too. One COBOL was enough, now we have COBOL2 (C++), COBOL3 (JAVA), COBOL4 (C#), and so forth. We need to bring back the good ole days of FORTH.

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

      • identicon
        Anonymous Coward, 27 Oct 2016 @ 11:57am

        Re: Re: Headline correction needed

        You first.

        reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

        • identicon
          Anonymous Coward, 27 Oct 2016 @ 6:51pm

          Re: Re: Re: Headline correction needed

          I am. (Tone of delight).

          Various project work based on FORTH principles. Once ready then released. Yippy.

          reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

      • identicon
        Anonymous Coward, 27 Oct 2016 @ 12:18pm

        Re: Re: Headline correction needed

        Come on now, Cobol is a language written for use by non programmers, but which is only ever used by programmers, and only under duress at that. C on the other hand is a language written by programmers for programmers, and is the language of choice for implementing other languages.

        reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

        • identicon
          Anonymous Coward, 27 Oct 2016 @ 7:08pm

          Re: Re: Re: Headline correction needed

          Cobol in a prior organisation was used to write various communications facilities by some serious programmers. I found it better than C++, JAVA and C#. It may have been verbose in many ways, but it was still usable in a clear way, particularly for support and maintenance after it was written. I do know of one programmer who would never program in it again no matter what payment was offered.

          C is a badly designed high level assembler. Inconsistent in the various implementations, very easy to foul up and excellent at making buggy programs.

          But, I wasn't describing C as a COBOL, but those COBOL like languages (that are worse) that are in use today - C++, JAVA, C#, etc.

          The only reason I am using it for implementing a language at this point in time is that it is used for the rest of the project. The hoops I will have to jump through to allow for multiple O/S's and hardware bases will make using C a real pain in the posterior.

          reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 27 Oct 2016 @ 3:56am

    Not content with destroying Sun...

    ...Oracle now seeks to destroy the entire Java ecosystem.

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • identicon
    Crazy Canuck, 27 Oct 2016 @ 9:05am

    If at first you don't succeed, try, try, try, try, try, try again.

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]


Add Your Comment

Have a Techdirt Account? Sign in now. Want one? Register here
Get Techdirt’s Daily Email
Use markdown for basic formatting. HTML is no longer supported.
  Save me a cookie
Follow Techdirt
Techdirt Gear
Shop Now: Copying Is Not Theft
Advertisement
Report this ad  |  Hide Techdirt ads
Essential Reading
Techdirt Deals
Report this ad  |  Hide Techdirt ads
Techdirt Insider Chat
Advertisement
Report this ad  |  Hide Techdirt ads
Recent Stories
Advertisement
Report this ad  |  Hide Techdirt ads

Close

Email This

This feature is only available to registered users. Register or sign in to use it.