Font Company Can't Come Up With Good Business Model; Punishes Customers

from the yeah,-that'll-work dept

Tyler Hellard writes in to alert us to the bizarre and self-destructive plan of a company called Letterhead that sells different fonts. The super paranoid company apparently includes the name, email and account ID of each purchaser with the font itself. One font buyer shared the font with a company making a sign for him (which seems reasonable enough) and that company ended up sharing the font on a file sharing network. That's the point at which Letterhead went ballistic. It claimed that every single download was "stolen" (which, of course, it was not) and then sent the original purchaser a bill for $944 for all of those downloads (Update: Apparently the folks at Letterhead aren't happy about this post -- they've blocked anyone coming from this site, so if you want to see the article, you need to copy and paste the URL, rather than just clicking the link. Apparently, they don't deal with criticism well.). How many downloads were there? A whopping 32 copies. But Letterhead falsely assumes that all 32 would have purchased the font (no, they would not have) and then thinks it can change its original deal with the guy so that they can charge him for those downloads. The company also published his name and his contact info (which would appear to be a violation of a customer's privacy).

Then, to make things even more ridiculous, Letterhead decided to punish all its own customers for its own inability to put in place a business model that recognizes basic supply and demand. So, along with publishing the story and this guy's name, it's significantly raised the price of the font from $30 to $40 -- saying that it will keep the price up until the full $944 is paid off. This is doubly stupid. Not only are they making it even less likely that anyone will buy the font, they're now competing with the fact that this font is already out there available for free. That's not the time at which you raise prices. Obviously, they're trying to shame the guy into paying $944 -- but the real problem is the company doesn't understand its own market or the products its selling.

In fact, it goes out of its way to admit that it doesn't understand digital goods by claiming:
"Fonts are tangible goods around here and will forever be treated as such. Theft always affects the price of fonts and there are some costs that must be recouped. (1) The time that Duncan Wilkie spent in creating the fonts (2) The time Letterhead Fonts spent in helping Duncan to refine his fonts (3) The time and advertising dollars Letterhead Fonts spent to promote LHF Garner (4) The time Letterhead Fonts spends removing LHF Garner from the file-sharing websites."
This shows a fatal lack of understanding of basic economics. First, fonts are not tangible goods. They never have been, and to say that the company will always consider them to be suggests that it will probably go out of business well before businesses that understand what they're actually selling. Then, claiming that there are specific costs that need to be recouped, again is a misunderstanding of economics. Yes, costs need to be recouped, but that's the responsibility of those setting up the business model -- not the customers. Furthermore, the company falsely includes fixed costs with the marginal costs in figuring out how to "price" the fonts, again insuring that other companies will be able to create much more reasonable business models.

Basically, the company is advertising its ignorance of basic economics and its own products and market, while punishing customers for its own incompetence. It may think it's going to shame one of its customers into paying, but all it's really doing is convincing a lot of folks never to buy anything from Letterhead fonts in the future.


Reader Comments (rss)

(Flattened / Threaded)

  1.  
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    dfp, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 7:42am

    Re: Letterhead Fonts

    Actually, the entire tirade on their site makes for interesting reading. The guy running the company sounds more like a self-absorbed fanatic than a business owner.

     

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    deadzone (profile), Apr 14th, 2008 @ 7:43am

    Dumb!

    It's a very dumb move on the part of this company. I am pretty sure the court of public opinion will come back and take care of this little situation though.

    It's sad that companies continue to be so dumb about copyrights though.

     

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  3.  
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    Anonymous Coward, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 8:08am

    I guess Adobe will do for me now on.

    So let's roleplay: You go to the store and bought a single bag of marshmallows, paid and left. You made the best S'mores.

    The next time your in the area, you come back to the store and purchase steaks, bratwurst and other stuff. The bill is 20x larger than the last time you patronized the store. But you were THAT happy with the S'mores (They were that good.)

    But while checking out, the manager stops you and says "You were the last person to buy marshmallows, but we're now missing 4 bags, pay us for the 4 missing bags."

    What would your whitty response be?

     

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  4.  
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    Danny, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 8:27am

    watch them try to sue you now....

    "...all it's really doing is convincing a lot of folks never to buy anything from Letterhead fonts in the future."

    Amen.

     

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  5.  
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    Ken Adams, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 8:43am

    Re: Fanatic, much?

    You guys should check out his update tirade. The crowning achievement is his assertion that God will punish the evildoers:

    "[...]I find strength in Psalm 140. See, Letterhead Fonts would never go out of business simply because some punk wishes it so. God created this business and only He has the ability to take it away."

    Read the rest of the rant at http://letterheadfonts.com/news/index.shtml?a=blog&id=5 .

     

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  6.  
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    Anonymous Coward, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 8:53am

    Re: Re: Fanatic, much?

    O.o
    Just wow.

    I wish my business was propped up by an omnipotent being.

     

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  7.  
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    Chuck Norris' Enemy (deceased), Apr 14th, 2008 @ 9:03am

    Re: Re: Fanatic, much?

    I like how he states if you want to blow your money on crappy fonts to go to this site. (with a link to myfonts.com)

     

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  8.  
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    SteveD, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 9:08am

    Its a shame...

    So it’s not about the money, its about the fonts, but its also about the money so we’re going to drive off the rest of our customers?

    It’s a shame, because this guy seems to have the best of intentions (70% to the Artist? If only the record industry worked like that). But he doesn’t get digital business.

    It’s not so much that fonts are or are not tangible goods, but he’d prefer to think of them like that because it makes a more straightforward business model.

     

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  9.  
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    Anonymous Coward, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 9:19am

    Fonts, what a joke

    Fonts are nothing but bothersome trash, especially for print industry workers. I have upwards of 50k and would never pay for any. They only cause output problems especially in the hands of designers, but that is a different problem altogether.

    Letterhead's fonts are not even worth downloading for free!

     

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  10.  
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    comboman, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 9:21am

    no copyright?

    Typefaces cannot be copyrighted, at least in the US. Strangely, when they are put on a computer as a font file, they can be.

     

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  11.  
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    ehrichweiss, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 9:32am

    Re: Re: Fanatic, much?

    I'm guessing he hasn't noticed that God(tm) doesn't have enough followers in the print industry to actually make a business model for him. Of course he also didn't read the part in his bible where his god said to give up all material possessions: It is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of god.

     

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    Violent Acres, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 9:32am

    Re: Re: Fanatic, much?

    That explains a lot. It takes someone who is seriously mentally ill to become that righteous. I hope his god sees him through this trying time. What a maroon.

     

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  13.  
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    Anonymous Coward, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 9:36am

    Here is a link to some of their fonts...

    Only 4, but his should get that retard going.


    http://thepiratebay.org/tor/3914591/171_Retail_Typefaces


    LetterHead.Fonts.Goldsmith .Script.WinAll.Commercial.Font-TYPO.rar
    LetterHead.Fonts.Monogram.English.WinAll.Commercial.Font-TY PO.rar
    LetterHead.Fonts.Sarah.Script.WinAll.Commercial.Font-TYPO.rar
    LetterHead.Fonts.Scriptana.Wi nAll.Commercial.Font-TYPO.rar

     

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  14.  
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    ehrichweiss, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 9:37am

    Re: no copyright?

    There's a subtlety there that you're missing. It's the *file* that's under copyright, not the typeface itself. If you duplicated the look of the font(hence the typeface itself), it ceases to be under copyright.

     

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    Michael Brutsch, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 9:38am

    What happened last time?

    He apparently uncovered some thieves in January, but I can't find anything about raising prices back then. Perhaps all the brouhaha this time is simply about much-needed publicity?

     

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  16.  
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    Anonymous Coward, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 9:40am

    Her are a couple more

    http://thepiratebay.org/tor/3447431/Commercial_Fonts_for_Windows_2006.02.20

    Obviously more than one person decided to share with the masses.

     

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  17.  
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    Anonymous Coward, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 9:41am

    Re: no copyright?

    Very interesting. If I understand this correctly if I design a font I can trademark the name but I can't copyright the typeface. However, if I develop a software font I can copyright the software version.

    That's seem contradictory but give the state of patent and copyright law it probably makes a sick kind of sense.

    It seems to me this moron missed a golden opportunity. His company provides a service (scare good) that produces letterhead fonts(infinite good). He got paid for the original font so his company probably got about all it would ever get for a custom letterhead font. If he allowed these fonts to go 'out into the wild' it would probably drive business to his company whereas his current strategy will likely drive customers away. Fortunately for him he has God as a business partner so let the smiting begin.

     

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  18.  
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    Alimas, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 9:43am

    Re: Re: Fanatic, much?

    And then God said, "And let there be fonts!"

    Where the hecks my invincible company?

     

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  19.  
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    Anonymous Coward, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 9:45am

    Re: Re: Fanatic, much?

    You guys should check out his update tirade. The crowning achievement is his assertion that God will punish the evildoers:

    I wonder what he thinks about Jesus. You know, the one who took the fish and loaves of bread and then proceeded to duplicate and share them with the crowd. Does he consider Jesus evil? I think he better reconsider his position. Of course, some people only acknowledge the parts of the bible that suit them.

     

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  20.  
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    Anonymous Coward, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 9:49am

    Free & Fine for me...

     

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  21.  
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    TehNube, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 9:54am

    Re: Here is a link to some of their fonts...

    PWN3d!

     

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  22.  
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    Anonymous Coward, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 9:59am

    Re: Re: Re: Fanatic, much?

    He only refered to "God" and "Psalms" -- you assume he's Christian putting in the bit about the camel. You don't know, maybe he's Jewish.

     

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  23.  
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    Joe, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 10:05am

    Is this guy trying to get free publicity off this or is he really that dumb?

    Given the website, and how ridiculous the guy is I have to think he is either a complete idiot or he is trying to milk this for free PR.

    I know they say that any press is good press but this guy has gone off the deep end. Lets just watch the site crumble.

     

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  24.  
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    Vincent Clement, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 10:10am

    Re: Re: Fanatic, much?

    So if he truly believes in a god, shouldn't he take this as a sign that his business is not going to survive?

     

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  25.  
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    Daniel, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 10:26am

    Hah!

    This guy is like the Derek Smart of the font world. What a megalomaniac.

     

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  26.  
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    Tim Bobbotybim, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 10:35am

    Re: Here is a link to some of their fonts

    Someone needs to open those fonts with a hex editor, replace the embedded ID/Email with those of the loon at letterhead.com and reseed in a package with some really popular files. See what happens.

     

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  27.  
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    TheTraveler, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 10:54am

    what a nut job!

    Wow, I just read this, and this dude is out of his mind! The fact that he even thinks this will get him any ware; he might as well burn his building down with all of his designers in it, because he is just taking them down with him!

     

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  28.  
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    asdf, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 10:56am

    wow. just wow.

     

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  29.  
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    Anonymous Coward, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 10:56am

    All press isn't good press . . .

    "All press is good press" generally only applies to politicians.

    Bad press, in particular, this kind of bad press is very bad for this company. I know plenty of folks in design who regularly read tech blogs like this one.
    I can't imagine anyone doing business with them after reading this.

    As for the religious aspects, his use of Psalm 140 is not relevant to his stating that "God created this business". God didn't create the business. To a Christian, God is the creator of him. Man rules over man, and is given free will, but supposed to follow the will of God. The will of God may have been for this man to create this business. The will of God may not be for it to succeed. And then there's that whole touchy subject about man's interpretation of the will of God.

    As a general rule, if someone has to resort to stating that the thing they are doing is "the will of God" because those looking upon him think it's the will of ... not God ... chances are pretty good that it was not the will of God.

    In other words, if you have to announce that you are a Christian as a result of behavior that goes against Christian teaching "you're doing it wrong".

    Besides that absurdity, his actions run afoul of the entire message of the gospel and plenty of verses in the old and new testament alike.

    @erichweiss: "It is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle ..." Relevant verse, but not necessarily in the way you stated. *That* particular rich man was asked by Jesus to give up his possessions and follow Him. The lesson was that you are to put God ahead of everything. As that verse and the lesson within it relates to this individuals actions, one can reasonably question whether this gentleman has put God above his desires to have a successful business.

     

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  30.  
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    qwerty, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 10:57am

    i envision this guys business burning to the ground within the week. way to go moron.

     

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  31.  
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    JB, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 11:00am

    Reasonable?

    Why is it "reasonable" to share the font with the sign company?

    What sort of business model would you propose for a company that designs fonts? I think selling their fonts sounds reasonable. And if those 32 people want to use the font they should buy their own copy.

     

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  32.  
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    The, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 11:00am

    Re: what a nut job!

     

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  33.  
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    TheTraveler, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 11:04am

    Re: Reasonable?

    Your right but the question is not whether they should buy there own fonts or not! The problem is this guy going completely ballistic over it, charging one guy for the piracy of a completely different company and then charging more for the font itself. to Recoup the costs of the loss of that font!

     

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  34.  
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    satan, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 11:05am

    who the hell pays for a font?

    I don't get it.

     

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  35.  
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    Mike C., Apr 14th, 2008 @ 11:07am

    Hypocrite...

    So.. he has a problem with someone else "stealing" his content, but has no problem using content from NBC and Saturday Night Live?

    Happy Fun Ball font.

    Wonder if has paid the appropriate license fees to NBC...

    More importantly... I wonder if NBC knows.

     

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  36.  
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    jonnyq, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 11:24am

    Re: Reasonable?

    Designing custom fonts and logos is a marketable business. Relying on the sale of easily copyable teensy weensy files is not.

     

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  37.  
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    Scote, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 11:25am

    "Why is it "reasonable" to share the font with the sign company? "

    Because that has been common in the industry for years. Large print-houses can afford to buy large collections of fonts but they can't have everything. If printers had to buy every one off font for every job you'd never be able to get anything printed. Quark collects fonts for output for a reason.

    Anyways, since type faces can't be copyrighted hopefully someone has made a generic tracing of this font and given it away for free.

     

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  38.  
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    R. H., Apr 14th, 2008 @ 11:26am

    Re: Reasonable?

    It was reasonable to share with the sign company because the sign company was doing work for them. Here's how I see it: the font purchaser needed a sign made using the font that he bought. In order for the sign company that he contracted to make the sign in this font, he had to share a copy with them. However, either the purchaser never told the sign company that the font was under copyright or someone at the sign company said, "Wow! What a nice font. I think the guys at TPB will love this one...." and uploaded it to the internet causing all of this mess. All-in-all even if one were to consider copyright law to be fair I don't think that going after the purchaser of the font is appropriate here. His use of the font was legal under present day copyright law. Whomever uploaded the file to the P2P networks however, should probably keep their head down for a while.

     

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  39.  
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    Jack Mehoff, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 11:37am

    Write Off

    I have read all the replys. I have read LetterHeads posts on his site. This guy is a fool. (Though i admire his faith in God.) But if he knew how to run his business all he would have to do is write off the expense. It should have been part of the Business Plan. This is a fail safe, so when you go by marshmallows you don't get charged for the four missing bags. (LOL, i liked that one.) The "store" simply counts that as a loss and get reimbursed for the loss. LetterHead needs to take a business course (Buss 101). For the meantime, just don't shop there. He will get the picture. And if he reads this he can email me, i can explain how it works, so he doesn't have to screw his clients.

     

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  40.  
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    MLS, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 11:37am

    This Article

    If I may ask some questions:

    This business designs and sells scalable fonts. Just what is wrong with that?

    This business sells these scalable fonts to its customers with the totally understandable requirement that they not be redistributed. Just what is wrong with that?

    This business appears to generally price its scalable fonts on what it believes customers are willing to pay. Just what is wrong with that?

    I have a difficult time understanding just what it is about this company's product that justifies the animosity reflected in the above comments.

     

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  41.  
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    Mike, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 11:45am

    Re: watch them try to sue you now....

    Convinced me!!

     

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  42.  
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    Anonymous Coward, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 11:48am

    Re: This Article

    Maybe you should read the article and not just the comments. Just a thought.

     

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  43.  
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    Jim, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 12:13pm

    Re:

    I'd call you an idiot for thinking of the worst analogy ever.

     

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  44.  
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    RTFM, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 12:27pm

    Re: This Article

    Are you the corporate counsel for the loon that owns Letterhead? Did you actually read the article and not just the comments? Not one person questioned the legitimacy of suing the sign-company which (allegedly) uploaded the font to a file-sharing website. They are the guilty ones here, not the original customer of Letterhead who paid for the font.

    In some cases, it is simply better to shut one's trap. The owner of Letterhead should have directed his anger (and his legal mouthpiece) at the sign company, not at the schmuck who actually paid for the use of his product.

     

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  45.  
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    Rekrul, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 12:52pm

    http://www.dafont.com


    Thanks for posting this!

     

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  46.  
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    Anonymous Coward, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 12:56pm

    Letterhead Fonts

     

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  47.  
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    Anonymous Coward, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 1:00pm

    Letterhead Fonts

    Ironic tirade considering most of the fonts on his site are reworkings of older fonts Which Someone Else Designed
    back in the 30's or 50's or whenever.

    These fonts are included in the larger pirated font packages so turning purple over 30 odd downloads is missing the forest through the spindly oak sapling.

     

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  48.  
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    Bob, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 1:05pm

    This guy gives all "Christians" a bad name. It's this sort of behavior that really makes people confused about wanting to be associated with your type. You fake Christians are nothing but a big disappointment and it seems you know it.

     

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  49.  
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    Todd, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 1:47pm

    Theft

    It seems to me that if this is indeed theft of tangible property he should sumbit the "loss" to his insurance company. I'm sure they will be more than cooperative in approving that claim.

     

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  50.  
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    MLS, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 3:05pm

    Re: Re: This Article

    I did read the article and links and, of course, agree that there are more productive ways for a business to address this matter. My questions were posed not in support of the hamfisted approach being used, but because of some posts suggesting that scalable font selling is somehow wrong because it involves digital data. Those posts were to my way of thinking troubling, as if because digital data is involved there is nothing wrong with someone who happens to get a copy uploading the data for all to use free of charge.

     

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  51.  
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    Tim Bobbitybim, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 4:04pm

    Re: Write Off

    He can't write it off...if he can't document inventory on hand that went missing he hasn't got anything. Lost revenue is a myth - the folks that downloaded the font weren't on the verge of plunking down $35 at his site then suddenly switched gears and found it for free. Chances are good that if they hadn't found the free download they would have done without.

    This is like the MPAA/RIAA claiming millions in lost sales - pure BS. The guy who fills his terabyte san with pirated movies wasn't going to go out and spend thousands of dollars at Wal-mart. He only pulled them because they were free.

     

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  52.  
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    DevNull, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 4:09pm

    Has he never heard of the Streisand Effect? Guess not. I also guess maybe I'll not try to embed any of my 522 Letterhead fonts because I have NO idea of where they came from...

     

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  53.  
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    Mike (profile), Apr 14th, 2008 @ 4:14pm

    Re: This Article

    This business designs and sells scalable fonts. Just what is wrong with that?

    Nothing is wrong with it... other than that it's an unsustainable business model the way it's set up. He's discovering that, but rather than adjusting his business model in the right way, he's adjusting it in a way that will only escalate these problems.

    This business sells these scalable fonts to its customers with the totally understandable requirement that they not be redistributed. Just what is wrong with that?

    Again, nothing's wrong with that if you can make it sustainable. But, a little lesson in basic economics suggests that you cannot do so.

    This business appears to generally price its scalable fonts on what it believes customers are willing to pay. Just what is wrong with that?

    But that's not the issue at all. The issue is that he's now jacking up the prices on fonts not due to customer demand, but due to some anti-economic tirade. Not only that, but he's doing it in a way that is sure to lose him more customers than it will gain.

    That's just bad business.

    I have a difficult time understanding just what it is about this company's product that justifies the animosity reflected in the above comments.

    It's a bad business strategy focused on punishing paying customers, rather than changing with the marketplace.

     

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  54.  
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    MLS, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 6:28pm

    Re: Re: This Article

    "But, a little lesson in basic economics suggests that you cannot do so."

    Can you elaborate a bit? The site does not sell services...it sells scalable fonts to people who are typically graphic artists/designers.

    Please be advised my comments have nothing to do with the problem the site faced and how it chose to deal with it. I am more interested in trying to figure out just what it is about the site's business plan that some seem to believe does not measure up to economic realities.

     

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  55.  
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    Xanius, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 7:45pm

    Re: Hypocrite...

    Apparently his hypocrisy is not on display any more.
    Error 403!

     

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  56.  
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    Xanius, Apr 14th, 2008 @ 7:47pm

    Re: Re: Hypocrite...

    Hmm looks like the site is blocking referrals from techdirt. No links to the site work if you go from here.

     

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  57.  
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    Mike (profile), Apr 14th, 2008 @ 10:46pm

    Re: Re: Re: This Article


    Can you elaborate a bit? The site does not sell services...it sells scalable fonts to people who are typically graphic artists/designers.


    Right, and the basic economics suggests that's not a sustainable business model. And that's what they're learning. In response, they're doing the exact wrong thing (raising prices) rather than figuring out a way to deal with the market.

    What you're saying is the same as "but the buggy whip maker doesn't sell automobiles... it sells buggy whips" and then asking us to explain why it can't keep selling buggy whips.

    They can't sell buggy whips because the market goes away.

     

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  58.  
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    Mike (profile), Apr 14th, 2008 @ 10:46pm

    Re: Re: Re: Hypocrite...

    Hmm looks like the site is blocking referrals from techdirt. No links to the site work if you go from here.

    Now, that's hilarious. I've edited the post to make note of this. Thanks for pointing it out.

     

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  59.  
    identicon
    anonymous, Apr 15th, 2008 @ 2:09am

    here are some more just to make letterhead happy.
    http://www.gfxworld.org/fonts/new_fonts_5.html

    on the plus side techdirt is now the third result on google when searching for LHF Garner. lets get to number 1, and show him how blocking a website (refreshing works) will only backfire. someday business will realize that the best way to fight something is quietly, with minimal media attention. aka ignore it.

    People You Will Meet In Hell
    Letterhead Fonts
    Lori Drew

     

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  60.  
    identicon
    iSaac, Apr 15th, 2008 @ 5:10am

    when fonts make noise

    you know, with all the thousands of free fonts on the web and all the cheaply available software to make your own untold numebr of custom fonts, i cant get over the fact that this "company" even sells......fonts.....that strikes me as (like the teenyboppers say) soooooo 1990's....

    I had to laugh.....so i did...ahaha...hahaha

     

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  61.  
    identicon
    Jake, Apr 15th, 2008 @ 5:17am

    I can kind of understand Letterhead being annoyed about the font going up on a file-sharing website without their permission; even if that design company thought it was being helpful, there are few things more irksome than someone doing what they think is best for you without consulting you beforehand. But not only am I slightly dubious about the legality of their contract versus the First Sale Doctrine, but at no point have Letterhead even implied that the signwriter did this with their customer's knowledge or consent; why are they suing him?

     

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  62.  
    identicon
    stationstops admin, Apr 15th, 2008 @ 5:56am

    yes they are morons, font business sucks

    Yeah, these guys are morons.

    However, I don't envy fontographers in any way - a good font is indeed a work of art and very difficult to get a good return on your work investment.

     

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  63.  
    identicon
    MLS, Apr 15th, 2008 @ 7:45am

    Re: Re: Re: Re: This Article

    As I previously noted, I am not asking anything about how the company responded to the specific situation it was presented.

    What I am trying to understand is why a company whose sole business is "selling" scalable fonts over the internet is not pursuing an economically viable business model? It is in a niche market (graphic designers/artists who need high quality scalable fonts) and appears to have a customer base that is willing to pay for the product provided. While it is a small scale operation, its business model is not that different from software sellers who ply their products over the internet, or even sites like Getty and Corbis that sell stock photos and graphics.

    Obviously, a company in the business of selling digital products is always vulnerable to those who cheat and upload files for P2P copying. That is always a risk, albeit in this niche market not something that will necessarily bankrupt the company. It does not, however, account for your comment that the company's business model is economically unsound.

     

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  64.  
    identicon
    BoyHowdy, Apr 15th, 2008 @ 8:05am

    For your chuckling pleasure

    FYI - I added the bolding.

    From the FAQ:

    "Can I send my Letterhead Fonts to my printer?

    No. Sharing your Letterhead Fonts with any third-party constitutes piracy and carries with it serious consequences-- including 5 years in federal prison and a minimum fine of $250,000. Your account information is embedded in each of your Letterhead Fonts. Should your printer or someone working there distribute the fonts elsewhere, you will be held responsible for damages resulting from each case of piracy. Instead, protect yourself by converting your text to vector outlines before sending your file to the printer. Please see this page for more information."

    What a douche.

     

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  65.  
    identicon
    Melvillain, Apr 15th, 2008 @ 9:15am

    Wow, and I thought the MPAA, RIAA...etc was bad.

     

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  66.  
    identicon
    Anonymous Coward, Apr 15th, 2008 @ 9:18am

    Re:

    This is the dumbest comment I've ever read. How can a reader of the Techtirt blog still not understand the difference between tangible (scarce) goods and intangible (infinite) goods. Anything you buy at a grocery store (marshmallows, steaks, bratwurst) is a scarce good - to reproduce them incurs additional cost. Fonts are an infinite good - they can be reproduced infinitely with no additional cost.

     

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  67.  
    identicon
    Anonymous Coward, Apr 15th, 2008 @ 9:23am

    Re: Re: Re: Fanatic, much?

    Yeah, it was lucky for Jesus that there was no patent, copyright, or trademark on fish and bread. Otherwise, he'd have been crucified for infringement by lawyers for the fishermen and bakers!

     

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  68.  
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    Mike (profile), Apr 15th, 2008 @ 10:32am

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: This Article

    As I previously noted, I am not asking anything about how the company responded to the specific situation it was presented.


    Neither am I. As I thought I made clear (I guess not...) this company is trying to sell an infinite good. Supply and demand (basic 101 econ) will point out to you that such a good will eventually get priced at $0 in a competitive market.


    What I am trying to understand is why a company whose sole business is "selling" scalable fonts over the internet is not pursuing an economically viable business model?


    Because they're trying to sell an infinite good. That's not a sustainable business model. They come under pricing pressure, and unless you figure out a different model, you're in trouble.

    It is in a niche market (graphic designers/artists who need high quality scalable fonts) and appears to have a customer base that is willing to pay for the product provided.

    Yes, for now, but it's not sustainable, because the market is increasingly flooded with free alternatives.

    its business model is not that different from software sellers who ply their products over the internet, or even sites like Getty and Corbis that sell stock photos and graphics.

    Indeed. All of which are finding their business models under serious pressure.


    Obviously, a company in the business of selling digital products is always vulnerable to those who cheat and upload files for P2P copying.


    I'm not talking about competing with file sharing. I'm talking about competing with those who recognize how to do the same thing by giving away the content and charging for scarce goods.

     

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  69.  
    identicon
    BoyHowdy, Apr 15th, 2008 @ 12:53pm

    For your chuckling pleasure

    FYI - I added the bolding.

    From the FAQ:

    "Can I send my Letterhead Fonts to my printer?

    No. Sharing your Letterhead Fonts with any third-party constitutes piracy and carries with it serious consequences-- including 5 years in federal prison and a minimum fine of $250,000. Your account information is embedded in each of your Letterhead Fonts. Should your printer or someone working there distribute the fonts elsewhere, you will be held responsible for damages resulting from each case of piracy. Instead, protect yourself by converting your text to vector outlines before sending your file to the printer. Please see this page for more information."

    What a douche.

     

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  70.  
    identicon
    RANDY HOWE, Apr 15th, 2008 @ 3:56pm

    LETTERHEAD FONTS

    Hi Folks, first time reader...first time poster - YES IT'S ME! - the guy Chuck Davis of Letterhead Fonts fame has blasted on his website. A friendly stranger gave me the link to this site and I thank him for that. Had a chance to skim over all the previous comments and would like to take a minute to clarify a few things about how things developed to the point of ridiculum ( I just made that word up ) that they have reached with regard to the font scandal Chuck has conjured up in his head.

    It all started in Southern Ontario on a sweltering day in the summer of 1959, in the tiny bayside village of St. Williams, when Fred and Betty Howe gave birth to their son -ME.

    Fast forward to 2008.

    I have been in the sign business for over 20 years, and I have purchased many, many fonts from Lettethead Fonts since they first started doing business 8 years ago - love the fonts - use them everyday even still. Last year I hired a local company to help ME launch a website for ME consisting of pages designed by ME using fonts purchased by ME - it's really just that simple and far from contrary to the rules set out by Letterhead Fonts.

    OOPS - wife just called - meeting some friends for supper, have much more to add

    TO BE CONTINUED.....

    RANDY HOWE

     

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  71.  
    identicon
    RANDY HOWE, Apr 15th, 2008 @ 6:13pm

    LETTERHEAD FONTS

    Hey y'all - ME again ( just got back from Hilton Head and picked up a bit of a southern drawl )...
    anywhooo - so I know you're wanting to know - why has Chuck decided to freak out on ME, why would HE do what HE do if it wasn't true?
    Here's what went down...Chuck emails ME and asks ME to phone him about an urgent matter, so I do so. He tells ME that the Garner font I purchased is being offered up for free online and wanted to know how it got there. I told him I had no idea, and if indeed it was MY font, wanted to find out how it got there as much as he did. He asked ME about MY new website and the people I worked with to develop it.
    I told him there was no way that they distributed the font.
    ( I know this to be true and quite frankly don't care who believes it - how do I know? - I just know - end of story ) In fact - once they seen my collection of Letterhead Fonts, they were so impressed that they purchased several Letterhead Fonts of their own ( YOU'RE WELCOME CHUCK! )
    Next thing you know, I get an email from Chuck telling ME how sad and disappointed he was with ME, to get the font removed from the site, or he would go public and blah blah blah blah blah.
    That's when I said hang on a minute there Chucky Boy, if you want any help from ME, you had better give your attitude an adjustment, and if you don't, then you can kiss my ass, and feel free to go ahead with your threats...and so folks, here we are.
    Initially I received several nasty emails telling me what a dick I am. I responded to them all, provided them with my phone number so they could call ME and tell ME in person, or talk to ME and find out what really happened - no one took ME up on it - pithetic chickenshits. However, as time and Chuck went on, the tone of the emails began to change, and I was reassured that most people do have a sense of fairness at least.

    I will end this here, and welcome anyone to contact me or visit my website to see what all the fuss is about...

    THANKS ALL, RANDY HOWE
    519-426-0740
    www.gougerville.com

     

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  72.  
    identicon
    Tina, Apr 16th, 2008 @ 9:38am

    Randy Howe... You're a loser! You should have helped him get the font off. I don't think it was too much to ask after what you did. You weren't supposed to share the font, correct? You did. You are the wrong one here. Simple as that in my opinion.

     

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  73.  
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    Peter Blaise (profile), Apr 16th, 2008 @ 9:49am

    In summary, returning to the point of the matter ...

    Wow. A confluence of problems and miscommunication, compounded by a steep personality at the font company. Where to start, where to start ... ?

    "World's First $1,000 Font?" I don't think so! I remember the first commercial digital version of Rudi Ruzicka's Fairfield was $1,500, so this company's claim for the "first $1,000 font" is remarkably inaccurate, revealing that they don't even know their own industry history. I have also sold private, custom fonts for $2,000 and didn't think much of it (except that I didn't get paid adequately for my time, more like minimum wage!).

    Here's what I see. There are two worlds that will apparently never meet in friendship:

    - original creative artists

    versus

    - copyists.

    As a (self proclaimed) world-class font wizard and designer, I quickly saw the price of fonts fall from hundreds of dollars for off-the-shelf fonts, to $1 a font on licensed CDs from the big names, to 1/2 cent a font for clone knock-offs on CD, to ZERO over the Internet. And, what's worse is that expensive Adobe and Monotype versions still sucked and needed smoozing to work without error, only Bitstream (the first wholly digital foundry) fonts worked first time, every time. So, I had to re-digitize fonts from any source anyway to get them to work, often also needing to replace or add enhanced characters malformed or missing from the suite. So, why pay $40 or more for a single font face that I have to rebuild, when ZERO is the price of the competition (that also might need rebuilding anyway)?

    On the one hand, I applaud the mentioned font foundry for saluting and singing the praises of their typeface designers, and trying to provide a revenue stream for their effort.

    On the other hand, this publicity is not positive, and actually is fostering publicity for their competition. Doh!

    Personally, may I suggest a LEGITIMATE free alternative? I cannot think of a kinder, nicer, fairer, more considerate, person in the FREE font world than Glenn Folkvord, the Font Man at

    http://www.fontcollectors.com/

    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/fontpacks

    ... who says at http://fontcollectors.com/linkpiracy02.htm

    "... bandwidth theft and link piracy ... against people who can't be bothered to ask before they ... benefit from my work ... Obviously the fonts themselves are not mine but I spend a great deal of time ... the least I should expect is that people download as members from MY list/group ... the only real satisfaction I get ... is to see that the member count always grow, and ... know that ... people enjoy the fonts ... I welcome all new members and hope you will enjoy the fonts ... I don't want to come across as an self-important guy or blow the link theft out of proportions ... enough is enough and let's get back to collecting them there fonts, OK? ... P.S.: If you ever use a font for something, I urge you to buy a license from the font's creator. If your newsletter or website or company benefits from a designer's font, he or she should benefit too, it's the right thing ..."

    Very different attitude there, eh? Some people KNOW how to behave and run their organization with respect for everyone - you set a great example, Glenn. Thank you!

     

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  74.  
    identicon
    nick shinn, Apr 16th, 2008 @ 9:52am

    Techdirt

    Letterhead adopted their aggressive and unusual policy towards piracy a while ago, and are still in business.

    Rather than make uninformed critical comments about what one assumes to be bad business practices, let's be more open-minded about how different folk choose to deal with the mind-boggling ethical and economic conundrums of digital media, and encourage experimentation.

     

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  75.  
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    Mike (profile), Apr 16th, 2008 @ 12:04pm

    Re: Techdirt

    Letterhead adopted their aggressive and unusual policy towards piracy a while ago, and are still in business.

    I never said they'd go out of business immediately.

    But wait and see.

    Rather than make uninformed critical comments about what one assumes to be bad business practices, let's be more open-minded about how different folk choose to deal with the mind-boggling ethical and economic conundrums of digital media, and encourage experimentation.

    Right. As for uninformed and critical, didn't you just do the same thing, without recognizing how much research and analysis we've put into digital economics and business models over the last decade? The position I took wasn't just some fly-by-night claim. It's based on a thorough understanding and analysis of economics and business models in the digital age.

    This is a bad business practice, plain and simple.

     

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  76.  
    identicon
    RANDY HOWE, Apr 16th, 2008 @ 1:34pm

    LETTERHEAD FONTS

    Tina - how can you say that I am a loser...maybe a hoser, but not a loser ( A little Canadian humour there...do you have a sense of humour? ) I did not share the font - I used the fonts I purchased for my own purposes. Was I not supposed to let anyone else see it, give your head a shake.
    The font in question did not come from me, I don't care if Chuck says it does have my info - how do I prove it - I have no idea, but I have been put in touch with a forensic computer analyst who I will use to find out if forced to. I purchased fonts and carried on a friendly relationship with Chuck for 8 years ... there's a certain way to ask people for help, Chuck's approach to me was uncalled for and I took a stand. I'm a friggin' signmaker for crying out loud,
    I wouldn't know how to help him get the font off even if he did ask me nice.

     

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  77.  
    identicon
    Malbright, Apr 16th, 2008 @ 6:10pm

    Letterhead Fonts

    It's true. Chuck has gone ballistic and handled this in a way that has created a lot of problems.

    But as I see it, it takes a great deal of time and energy to design and market a good font. It's a tough business to make money in, even for the big houses. Chuck has made it very clear that when you buy a font, you can do whatever you want with it, just don't put it in a pdf or send it with your files—you've got to make an outline of it first so it cannot be pirated or illegally copied. Since most of his fonts are for display purposes, this extra step really isn't all that big of a deal. Granted, I don't love the extra hassle. But imagine how you would feel if you saw hundreds of your fonts being pirated for free. Wouldn't you try and do something to stop it?

    Now, I'm not justifying Chuck's reaction. But I do understand how frustrated he must be. Even here on this thread there are people posting links to pirate copies of his fonts. I wonder how these people would feel if someone did the same thing to them?

    Someone made the comment that fonts are worthless and don't work, etc. That shows a profound ignorance of typography and the current state of the art.

    I may not agree with Chuck's handling of Randy's situation with his customer, nor of his citing God, though that's his god-given right. but what he is asking for in his EULA isn't really all that intrusive. He's just doing the best he can to apply some kind of DRM to protect his business.

    A font is worth money, and just because it's in a digital format doesn't change that. Fontographers need to do something to protect themselves, otherwise, all of us designers who rely on their art, their expertise and their assistance will suffer.

    It sounds like Randy made an honest mistake, and Chuck went ballistic. It's really a shame, because in my dealings with Chuck he's been a really nice guy and very reasonable. Moreover, he has always kept the price of his fonts quite reasonable, trying his best to keep prices low when many others are not doing the same.

    Remember, you never really BUY a font. You buy a license to use the font on x number of computers. The lesson is that when you buy any software, including typography, you need to read and abide by the EULA.

    Maybe some of you have better ideas on how Chuck can protect his fonts. If you think there's a better business model, please let us know, because everyone in the industry struggles with this every day.

    No, it is not right to publicly berate a customer and then make everybody else pay (although all of us pay the price for piracy in one way or another—Chuck is just being up front about it.) But it is also wrong to pirate software and fonts, obviously.

    I feel badly for Randy; the guy made a simple mistake and Chuck went nuts on him. But I also feel badly for Chuck, a person who runs an honest, quality business and is just trying to stop people from using his fonts for free.

     

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  78.  
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    Mike (profile), Apr 17th, 2008 @ 2:16am

    Re: Letterhead Fonts

    But as I see it, it takes a great deal of time and energy to design and market a good font.

    No one doubts that, but that's a fixed cost -- and your basic economics will tell you that you can't expect to price things based on your fixed costs. It's just not a sustainable business.

    A font is worth money, and just because it's in a digital format doesn't change that.

    Remember, price and value are not the same: http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20080411/153919828.shtml

    Just because something is valuable, it doesn't mean that selling it is sustainable.

    Fontographers need to do something to protect themselves, otherwise, all of us designers who rely on their art, their expertise and their assistance will suffer.

    As many other industries have discovered, there are business models that can be built around giving away completed digital goods for free. It need not involve "protection." In fact, protecting digital content generally means you're limiting your potential market because you're cutting off the best promotional resource you have.

    Maybe some of you have better ideas on how Chuck can protect his fonts. If you think there's a better business model, please let us know, because everyone in the industry struggles with this every day.

    He shouldn't be protecting it. He should be leveraging it to sell scarce goods (such as his ability to create amazing new fonts):

    http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20070503/012939.shtml

    No, it may not be as *easy* a business model, but I'd bet it would be a lot more profitable long term. The fact is that your basic economics of supply and demand will push the price of already-created fonts towards zero. It's not a good idea to base your business model on pretending those economics don't exist.

     

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  79.  
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    Peter Blaise (profile), Apr 17th, 2008 @ 4:21am

    Re: In summary, returning to the point of the matter ...

    I told them what I think at

    http://www.letterheadfonts.com/contact/index2.php

    ==

    Re: Piracy

    I don't think people are upset that you take a stand against piracy. I think people are aghast that you inaccurately take an unsupportable public stand against non-pirates (your customers and potential customers) instead of accurately finding and prosecuting those who may have broken a law or a contract that involves you. Such investigation and prosecution cannot be done in a public forum. On the one hand, I applaud you for saluting and singing the praises of your typeface designers, and trying to provide a revenue stream for their effort. On the other hand, this publicity is not positive, and is fostering animosity against you and publicity for alternatives.

    ==

    I'll let you know if they respond.

    Someone here said: "... Someone made the comment that fonts are worthless and don't work, etc. That shows a profound ignorance of typography and the current state of the art ..." I hope that was not directed towards me. As a font designer, I know better, and I know that many "official", full price, legitimate fonts are crappy and need rebuilding to properly do their job in many, or even any, environment. Perhaps your comment was directed at the "hey, it's digital, give it away and sell advertising and support" philosophy, which, as a tech consultants, TechDirt is exampling quite well, since no one pays directly for reading this wonderful, participatory blog.

     

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  80.  
    identicon
    Spinmeister Wannabe, Apr 17th, 2008 @ 5:52am

    Re: Letterhead Fonts

    Dear Malbright,
    Since your post is an obvious PR piece and your writing style differs from Chuck's I'm guessing that you're probably a hired gun and not Chuck himself. Additionally, Letterhead Fonts doesn't appear to be large enough to have its own PR department so I further suppose that you are a contractor. I've been thinking about trying to get into that business myself and would really like to learn more about it. Now I realize that as a professional you probably can't disclose the details of your particular relationship with Chuck but I have some questions about how this business works in general if you would be so kind as to answer them:
    1. Do you typically already have a business relationship with your client before some episode needing PR spin occurs or does that relationship develop afterwards?
    2. If it occurs afterwards, who typically initiates first contact, you or the client?
    3. If it is the client, how do they usually find you? I mean, is it by referral or some other means? Do you advertise?
    4. If it is you, how do you find clients? Do you perhaps watch the news for potential clients in trouble and then contact them with an offer of your services (similar to an ambulance chasing lawyer)?
    5. What kind of fees do services of your type usually command?
    6. How do you respond to people who would label you a "turf troll" or "shill"? Does it bother you and, if so, how do you deal with that?

    Thanks in advance for any insights you can give a potential future colleague.

     

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  81.  
    identicon
    malbright, Apr 18th, 2008 @ 12:52am

    Letterhead Fonts

    Dear Spinmeister,
    Your assumptions are incorrect. I have no relationship with Letterhead Fonts whatsoever. I am not a PR hack for him—in fact, when Chuck first deployed his troublesome, and later abandoned, font installer, I was one of his biggest critics. If you read the threads on typophile you can see that for yourself. I thought it was one of the most boneheaded ideas I heard in a long time, and it was obvious it was a non-starter.

    At the time, I took it upon myself to write Chuck and engage in a dialogue. I was pretty upset at his plan, yet, for all my vitriol, I was surprised at how gracious and accommodating he was. Though I totally disagreed with his installer scheme, as well as a lot of his methods for fighting piracy, I gained a greater understanding of his position.

    It really sucks to see your stuff stolen and to realize there is almost nothing you can do about it.

    But believe whatever you want.

    Because I am empathetic to his plight doesn't make me a turf troll or shill. I am equally sympathetic to poor Randy, who strikes me as a reasonable, nice guy—his site shows a great sense of humor and style—and who seems to be the brunt of Chuck's pent up frustration. I also think Chuck went way over the line in the way he handled the situation with Randy. I think his behavior is counterproductive and bad business.

    However, back to your questions. On a positive note, with your flair for cynicism and complete lack of productive, thoughtful suggestions, I think you have a world of career options open to you and the answers you seek will no doubt come as you gain experience once you've found a full-time position. I encourage you to pursue your passion, and not worry about the details yet.

    Cheers.

     

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  82.  
    identicon
    Anonymous Coward, Apr 19th, 2008 @ 10:34pm

    Re: Letterhead Fonts

    It really sucks to see your stuff stolen and to realize there is almost nothing you can do about it.

    Copyright infringement isn't theft and to claim otherwise is dishonest. Because you have demonstrated such dishonesty I am not inclined to believe your other denials.

     

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  83.  
    identicon
    Tina, Apr 23rd, 2008 @ 12:24pm

    First off, Mike Masnick shouldn't be writing about business failures. He obviously knows nothing about business. Maybe he should take a class on the subject. Letterhead is raising the price of its goods due to thief. Every business does this. Unless you plan to grow your own crops and sew your own clothes, you're paying for thief everytime you walk into a store. Sorry, the truth hurts.

    How can I call you a loser Randy? Well, it's about as easy as putting on my velcro strap sneakers in the morning. I read both Letterhead's side of the story and yours. I see a company that is fed up with their hard work getting pirated by thugs (some of which I see reside on this very site.) They find out how it got there and contact you. Because they're upset, you tell them, "you can kiss my ass" (that must have been a very repulsive thought for them.) That's a swell way to handle it! If it was me I would have sued your ass not kissed it!!! But that's just me.

    Now, please, I beg someone to accuse me of working for Letterhead. I only wish I had half the talent.

     

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  84.  
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    Mike (profile), Apr 23rd, 2008 @ 4:33pm

    Re:

    First off, Mike Masnick shouldn't be writing about business failures. He obviously knows nothing about business.

    Of course not. He's only built a rather successful one himself. And helps many other businesses with their business strategy.

    I know, because I'm him. But clearly, I know nothing, right? And what do you know of me?

    Letterhead is raising the price of its goods due to thief.

    No. They're not raising prices due to theft. They're raising prices due to in inability to deal with infringement. If you think infringement is the same as theft, you've got a problem.

    Every business does this.

    No. That's simply untrue when you're talking about infringement. If businesses have worked out a way to build a business model that embraces infringement and leverages it for positive purposes, than those that try to increase the price due to infringement will find less and less business available.

    The problem is you seem to be equating infinite goods to scarce goods. Unfortunately for you, the world doesn't work that way.

    Unless you plan to grow your own crops and sew your own clothes, you're paying for thief everytime you walk into a store.

    Not quite, but this is the statement you've stated that's closest to accurate. Yes, if you are buying tangible goods, it's likely that some of the cost of "loss" or "leakage" is included in the pricing, but that's not what's being discussed here. The problem is that there's no *loss* when you're talking about an infinite good, such as a font. There's only lost *opportunity* and unlike *real* losses, you don't bake lost opportunity into your price unless you want your competitors to beat you silly.

    Sorry, the truth hurts.

    If only you knew.

     

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  85.  
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    Tina, Apr 23rd, 2008 @ 6:22pm

    Hmmmmmm... nope, still not convinced. I know nothing of you except the article above. And I couldn't disagree more with all that you've said.

    But I'll tell you what:

    If "competitors beat" Letterhead "silly" and they fail due to their price increase and business practices, I'll think of you and admit that you are a business genius.

    Until then...

     

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  86.  
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    Mike (profile), Apr 24th, 2008 @ 1:02am

    Re:

    Hmmmmmm... nope, still not convinced. I know nothing of you except the article above. And I couldn't disagree more with all that you've said.

    Well, it's nice to know that you judge whether or not someone knows anything about business based on a single paragraph you misread.

    If "competitors beat" Letterhead "silly" and they fail due to their price increase and business practices, I'll think of you and admit that you are a business genius.

    Whether anyone realizes it or not, they already are. If they weren't, Letterhead wouldn't have freaked out over a small number of folks sampling the font for free.

     

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  87.  
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    RANDY HOWE, Apr 24th, 2008 @ 12:29pm

    LETTERHEAD FONTS

    Just to correct you Tina - Letterhead Fonts doesn't tell us how the font got there - they just claim that it's mine and come to a convenient, yet incorrect, conclusion on how it got there.
    I tell you that it didn't get there from us but you choose not to accept that - same as Chuck...so what am I to do.
    I challenge anyone to show me how the font supposedly - and I stress supposedly - got from my computer to some obscure Russian website that I've never heard of before.
    In spite of what's been said about me all over the internet because of this, I've received plenty of support and encouragement from friends and strangers alike - I've tried to keep somewhat of a sense of humour about the situation but when I read a comment from an ignorant braindead maroon like yourself, I must admit I start to get a bit pissed off.

    If anyone has a suggestion on how this sort of thing can be tracked, without breaking the bank, I'd love to hear it .

    RANDY HOWE, temperature rising

     

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    Tina, Apr 25th, 2008 @ 12:31pm

    Wow, now I know what Letterhead dealt with. It doesn't take much to upset that Canadian humor you bragged about.

    Letterhead told us exactly how the font got there. You shared the font and the font then found it's way to the internet. Your account information was embedded in it. I'm not a computer wizard but I'm sure that can be done. I doubt seriously Letterhead saw one of their fonts on a pirate site and decided to pin it on a customer that "started doing business 8 years ago" with them. Especially someone who has "purchased many, many fonts from" them.

    Sorry to get your "temperature rising." I'm just stating my opinion.

     

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  89.  
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    RANDY HOWE, Apr 25th, 2008 @ 5:03pm

    State your opinion all you want, but why not get the facts straight. You say you're not a computer wizard, no problem, but it is blatantly obvious that you are not on an intellectual level that can comprehend what is being presented to. It's not a crime to be stupid and ignorant, just accept it and keep your piehole clamped shut - and for the good of mankind - DON'T REPRODUCE!

     

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    James, May 11th, 2008 @ 10:43am

    letterhead fonts

    I can understand Letterheads position and I love both their site and their fonts. That being said I understand the peoples argument here. Fist off here's my problem's with the current arrangement.

    1. As a loyal customer I am now being punished for others misdeeds. If I choose to buy it then I'm being a loyal customer, not forgoing the process of paying the original artist and representation rather than just go get the product for free (you know stealing) yet somehow I now am being penalized for making the right decision.

    2. I find it troubling that my personal information is being tagged and distributed to who knows by Letterhead font, without my permission. I would argue that now that they've put how they embed my info onto their fonts it could put my personal info at jeopardy. I'm not sure why I haven't noticed this before in the terms of use license nor if it's there but computers and hackers in particular today are very creative if there's a exploit to use this information out there they can find a way to retrieve it. I see that they value their artwork in the form of fonts but they don't respect the value of my personal information.

    3. While I agree that Letterhead has the best font's around and a amazing site, I don't buy the advertising angle they represent. Their advertising is the site itself and it's a sales tool. I see no advertising anywhere else nor do I see them in any publications that refer to font's. In fact unless your a type / font fan you might be hard pressed to even know it exists. Hardly the advertising I could justify the 30% take from. In fact if anything I would expect the owner of Letterhead to make a reward system for his products, find a file sharing site with our product report it to us and we'll knock $5 - $10 off the price of a font. In this way he would be actively pursuing the problem, engaging the customers to be familiar with the artist plight and rewarding people for actually buying the product rather than doing the exact opposite. Since he doesn't do this and has instead charged more for the product he should be paying the artist more than 70% as he failed to distribute the product to the masses as he was commissioned to do. Charging would be customers would make sense if the company was at a loss for the theft, but they are not. People often forget that they can and will mark this off as a loss on their taxes. As such they will be making more than a little profit off this fiasco. Namely they will be getting the Letterhead name out, they've now had a reason to mark up the product, and they have hit the original purchaser of the font for the damages. Even if he doesn't pay up it will go to the losses posted in taxes as mentioned. I don't see the downside to their position other than the fact that at least 32 people have the product now, than did before and have not paid for it.
    4. I love these font's and I respect the many artist that have spent time and effort to put these together but let's call a spade a spade. Many of these font's are copies of type from Billheads, Signs from advertising in the late 1800's and other places. Now that may not be the case with all of the fonts but a far share are. So what we are seeing is someone ranting about others taking work without paying and yet the work in question is a recreation and fixing of another's work in the first place. Now I don't mind paying for this as I don't have the time and energy to put into taking these lettering samples, scanning them into Fontographer, cleaning them up and submitting them to Letterhead font to be further cleaned up and distributed, but when I see someone get huffy about what is essentially a service that recreates digitally the works of master artist from long ago, I have to wonder why they don't kick some of that money down to the original artist's families, (oh wait they don't have to because that persons more than likely dead or unknown) to me this would be the equivalent to someone wanting to get paid for someone sharing a digital clip art of the mona lisa that they charge for then upping the price of the clip art to compensate for the price. Should they charge for it in the first place? Well, they did make the effort to digitize it sure and they distributed it as well so yes. Now should they get uppity if someone else takes the artwork? No because that is what they essentially did as well.

    As I said before I am a fan of letterhead font. I know it doesn't sound like it but I am. They provide a service and represent artist in a way that no-one does, but they also show they're artist naivete by their business practices. Their customers are diehard font fans and as such will forgive them their transgressions, so I don't see their actions changing their profit much at all. But it does remind me of the old joke about the 2 bulls one young, one old. The young one says to the old timer hey let's run down and screw us a few cows, the old Bull replies nah, let's walk down and screw em all. The point being that by alienating the consumer and charging more they won't hurt their business too much as the customers they offer a specialty product for a niche consumer. But had they taken the time to embrace the power of these consumers and enlist their help they would find themselves in a better market position. They could have put a good spin on the angle, maybe someone would have put the story on digg and it could have generated some of the publicity that the owner of Letterhead font charges 30% for. Products would be more secure since customers (loyal as ever) would have spent a little time to hunt down the beloved fonts on file sharing sites and report them and thus making pirated fonts that much harder to find. This would make me as a font artist more agreeable to using Letterhead font as my distributor as they would show their prowess at keeping this my "creations" off the file sharing sites and profits in my pocket.

    As it stands now I have no reason to spend any of my time doing letterhead font any favors, I mean why should I? If I do find a file being shared and I report it it will only make that and other font's go up in price and after a while that add's up, and what would I do then? Of course I do own fontographer and have a extensive library of old types, I guess I could always just get off my soap box and recreate some of those old fonts that everyone is clamoring for. Now if I recreate Billhead from the original Source am I imposing on Letterheads trademark / copyright?

    3.

     

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    James, May 11th, 2008 @ 1:34pm

    Letterhead fonts

    I was just rereading the article by chuck davis and came across this bit:
    "Ignoring piracy devalues our work and makes it that much harder for the next generation. Indeed, I can see a day when creativity has been stifled so severely that the only fonts being created are simply knock-offs of other fonts. After all, who wants to spend months creating an original typeface only to have it pirated the first week it's released?"

    And yet when you stop and look at almost every one of the font's at his site you'll notice they are almost entirely lifted from older works. Take a look at anything from the 1880's to the 1940's and you'll discover so many great letterhead font's and soon to be letterhead font's. I bought the book "the art of the market" and was amazed to see so may of the Fonts created by these designers used in old stock and bond certificates that it started me looking at some of the others, sure enough I found some from advertisements for Pharmacy labels, old cutouts from circulars, and quite a few from font foundries that were no longer in business. My point here is that one one hand ol' Chuck would like to use the argument that "I can see a day when creativity has been stifled so severely that the only fonts being created are simply knock-offs of other fonts" I find this funny since a lions share of his business is just that and he seems fine with it, worse his clients are fine with it, and he makes a profit with no problems. Then he says "After all, who wants to spend months creating an original typeface only to have it pirated the first week it's released?" But does it really take months on end to recreate a font? I've done my bit of design with font's and while I don't want to take the time on a lot of projects to design a font, when I have do so it has never taken months, and I am in no way as skilled as many of these artist when it comes to font design, and yet when you factor in the source material allowing the artist to lift a majority of the lettings then you really only have to scan, clean up the lines and recreate maybe a 1/3 or 26 letters and 10 numbers maybe 12 characters. If that takes months of work then these guys are not the pro's I thought them to be.

     

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    Anonymous Coward, May 24th, 2008 @ 12:29am

    Obviously Tina only taking one sided view

     

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    Frank Rengald, Jun 12th, 2008 @ 8:38pm

    Re: Re: Letterhead Fonts

    And you sound like a fucking idiot. Just like Best Buy would put the metal detectors in their doorways, Letter Head Fonts puts up anti-piracy measures as well... only coming in the form of encryption. You fucking egotistical idiot. They work hard, for months and months ( I've personally tried to make a font half as good as them and it took me SIX MONTHS!) and then retards who think they own the world go taking them. You should rot in hell you thieving bastard.

    No wonder Chuck is bitter, which I don't personally know, he has the right to change the price on his goods as the cost of everything goes up. I talked on the phone with him and he was as reasonable as any. He talked about God too... which you personally need in your life. You decadent stick in my shoe.

    Have you ever thought about all the costs put into ONE FONT. Yea, bet you haven't you waste of an embryo.

     

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    Frank, Jun 12th, 2008 @ 8:41pm

    Re:

    I love you Tina

     

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    James Keely, Jun 12th, 2008 @ 8:42pm

    Re:

    Obviously cowards should keep their mouths shut. Idiot.

     

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    Jonathan Renald, Jun 12th, 2008 @ 8:45pm

    Re: Re:

    Ok Mike. You dick.

    When your favorite restaurant raises its prices.... I know you are the first one to complain to the manager about his broke a$$ making your fat a$$ pay more.

    People like you are wastes of air.

     

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    Sarah Treel, Jun 12th, 2008 @ 8:47pm

    Re: Re: Letterhead Fonts

    Mike Mike Mike.

    How do you think he pays for the wonderful people answering his phone? With smiles and high fives. EVERYTIHNG costs money.

    Surely you should know this since you're a big man on the block right.....


    right?

     

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    Jessica, Jun 12th, 2008 @ 8:51pm

    Re: LETTERHEAD FONTS

    Well Randy you smart smart man. Show us proof. Show us the e-mails. OR send us a copy of the phone bill with his number....no?

    You don't have jack shit...
    No surprise.

    You are a waste.

     

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    Mike (profile), Jun 13th, 2008 @ 3:37am

    Heh.

    The series of posts from on June 12th starting at 8:38 and going in rapid succession until 8:51 -- each with a different name, all come from the identical IP address. Somehow, I get the feeling that Frank, James, Jonathan, Sarah and Jessica are all the same person.

    No surprise there.

    I'll also note that each response is an insult rather than actual argument.

    I would suggest, Frank, James, Jonathan, Sarah and Jessica that you are much more likely to get someone to take you seriously if you actually respond to what I discussed, instead of tossing around insults and making false claims.

     

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    G W, Jun 19th, 2008 @ 10:48am

    Fonts

    Randy Howe was fine in supplying the font to a sign company to produce a product. The illigal action was on the company sharing the font elsewhere. Any good print house or sign shop never passes out clients property.

    And as far as im concerned, Letter Head Fonts is still has the best looking sign fonts around.

    gw

     

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  101.  
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    G W, Jun 19th, 2008 @ 10:51am

    Fonts

    Randy Howe was fine in supplying the font to a sign company to produce a product. The illigal action was on the company sharing the font elsewhere. Any good print house or sign shop never passes out clients property.

    And as far as im concerned, Letter Head Fonts is still has the best looking sign fonts around.

    gw

     

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    Robert, Jun 26th, 2008 @ 10:48pm

    Actually G W is wrong when he says Randy did nothing wrong when he supplied a sign shop with the font. It happens all the time in the graphics industry but most agreements do not allow sharing with others. The font company has the right to be upset.

     

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    Mr McCall, Jun 27th, 2008 @ 1:50pm

    There is no good reason to send the font along to the printer (unless they are tweaking the text, and you as the designer should be the one to do that)... Its up to the designer to OUTLINE the font in say... Illustrator (or rasterize if in Photoshop) BEFORE sending to the printer. Most printers WANT fonts outlined... Gosh... But, I will just not buy the font in question. It is tainted now... and unloved. All their other typefaces are fair game!

    cheers!

     

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    LewisB, Jul 2nd, 2008 @ 6:41am

    Brilliant response James and I think you've added a new valuable response in suggesting that Letterhead maybe try to reap what they can from this loss and live and learn to adapt their business to whatever challenges an industry throws at them.

    I have noticed within 'Step Inside Design' magazine, Letterhead have placed an advert with a discount code for the readers. I don't know much about the company history and it's advertising strategy but maybe this is a new tact to clean out this stigmata they now have and look forwards?

    As a keen typography student I am always reading articles about the industry as a whole and have noticed a common theme throughout with both industry representatives and new-generation hopefuls: design IS business.

    Therefore if you want to stay as an artist (validating work for self-expression rather than income as currency) but also see that you could make money from whatever you produce, simply employ a direction of thorough business education so you know and can hopefully prevent pitfalls like Letterhead have imbued. Even if you don't think you have the head for it, employ a separate business team to handle such things so you can concentrate on the art which, you may value more so over the currency gain, but still realise bills need to get paid.

    None of this is directed personally at anybody, just a message I've realised I need to take on board as a design hopefully and feel it may resound with other aspiring designers too.

    (As a side-note, some fonts can take months to produce because as well as the regular alphabet and numerics some fonts employ another 26 set of characters as 'alternates' and various other characters such as glyphs, swashes, ligatures etc. Of course, some designers can still do this in a manner of weeks/days.)

    I have -hands raised- downloaded pirates of a font by Letterhead I was looking to use. I was going to take my first step towards being a professional designer also after sampling whether it would work within my work and buy the licence (British commenter here!) respecting all parties and artists within. Chuck or whomever has successfully raided many of the files and changed a few characters so that the files do not contain a correct full font as would be purchased. Even if the files were correct and in full working order I would have still purchased the font needed from Letterhead but I am now put off because of this whole ordeal and the impression it has left on the company (what I personally deem as negative for passing on loss costs to new customers like myself).

    I now actually am looking elsewhere for a font of similar calibre or may even just make my own from scratch, which as a lesson in business shows that one potential customer has thus resided to other options of that than simply choosing to buy a Letterhead product.

     

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    G W, Jul 2nd, 2008 @ 9:15am

    You are right Robert

    He should have outlined the font, or had the company purchase a copy themselves.

    GW

     

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  106.  
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    RANDY HOWE, Jul 23rd, 2008 @ 7:58am

    HIDEEHO

    Haven't been here in awhile - just wanted to say hi to everyone

    LOVE, RANDY

     

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  107.  
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    fontlover., Jan 17th, 2009 @ 11:43pm

    fonts?

    for personal use.... many site let you download free... after a succesful sign the 40 bux not too much, so i believe real sign company will pay for all used font...
    and how many hobbyist just wants to make a plate for their friends or for their family without any profit... really they have to pay for? if i copy the gioconda for my passion that is not stealing...
    my opinion this company a little overreact all this copyright issue... on other side if their fonts use elements of wellknown fontfamilies then they might not try to acting like original authors...
    and that is really luckily they did not copyrighted the 26 basic letter, the abc :-))

     

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  108.  
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    You're an idiot., Feb 4th, 2009 @ 10:36am

    Re: Fonts, what a joke

     

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  109.  
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    [VBM], Feb 17th, 2009 @ 10:23pm

    Chuck 'Dumb-Fuck' Davis

    This coke smoking pedophile is totally insane. Guy steals someone elses' artwork and makes a half-assed font from it, then manipulates the patent law so he can claim ownership.

    His fonts suck anyway. Here take a free look for yourselves :D

    http://www.plunder.com/-download-c72d1d63.htm

    "Its been a whole year now Davis and still no luck. Maybe you should try $250,000- [VBM]"

     

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  110.  
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    4thelolz, Feb 26th, 2009 @ 8:21pm

    Found Funny

    Chuck Davis is a slob.
    http://i44.tinypic.com/w1qtdl.png

     

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    TooBad, Mar 7th, 2009 @ 2:50am

    Reward System was a FAIL

    From reading the last couple of posts, I did some digging and yes, it seems that after quite some time his 'Reward System' came up short. In a sulky fit of rejection and failure, he even took down the page from his website. (aww poor baby)

    I guess that means Letterhead has lost the battle with piracy. Though according to some sources, he was never much of a threat to begin with. Funny.

     

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  112.  
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    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Oct 12th, 2009 @ 4:56pm

    Letterhead Page Gone

    But saved at archive.org.

     

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  113.  
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    Larry White, Dec 19th, 2009 @ 7:55pm

    Chuck Davis is a jerk, to the highest degree...

    I was a contributing artist to LHF, until I was deemed "unhappy" by Chuck, and since he didn't "like my tone" on a phone call he made to me, he deleted me and my fonts right off his site. I wrote him a letter to see if I could get him to reconsider. I received a very rude reply back, with his closing statement of, "Lay off the pot Larry, it's making you paranoid." Shows you how much he knows, I don't smoke pot. He's just a diminutive little weasel, that has no clue on how to discuss any issue with anyone. It's his way, or the highway. What a total ass! Please, don't buy anything from that jerk!

    Sincerely,
    Larry White

     

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  114.  
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    Anonymous Coward, Jan 20th, 2010 @ 12:15am

    That's really sad Mr. White. Bill Blake was probably the best font that place ever had.

    You would have better luck at Myfonts.com. More exposure, better people. Chuck Davis is a pathetic little man who will die a slow and painful death one day. Probably from ass cancer. You should post up his personal e-mail and website FTP logon. I'm sure someone will screw him over on your behalf.

     

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  115.  
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    Steve, Apr 5th, 2010 @ 7:08pm

    LETTERHEAD FONTS

    After merely inquiring about an error in my purchase my account was (by the website owner) falsely marked as TOO MANY UNPAID ATTEMPTS. They received payment via a registered account credit card. Additionally, the service(s) I paid for I have now been blocked from receiving. I emailed the President of the company (Chuck Davis) and he refuses to respond or correct the problem.

     

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  116.  
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    David, Apr 25th, 2010 @ 5:40pm

    LetterheadFonts

    You all sound like a bunch of little crying babies.
    Letterhead fonts has some of the best quality made fonts that you can find. Thats because the designers spend hours creating this Unique Art and you little punks want to bitch about not being able to steal from them. We will always do business with Letterhead fonts because of the greatness of their Fonts. Keep in mind that if you want quality goods then you have to pay for it. If you little shit heads have noticed. Letterhead fonts is still in business; And a great looking website. You sound like a bunch of jealous assholes who wish that they could create great fonts. If you don't like the way Letterhead fonts is doing business, why not just buy your fonts someplace else.
    And stop bitching about it. It sounds like you have a serious mental problem and probably devote all your time complaining about most everything.
    Your lives must be in constant turmoil. Why would Letterhead fonts waste their time in replying to angry people.
    We are glad that there is a company like Letterhead fonts.
    Our company has benefited because of them.

     

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  117.  
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    David, Apr 25th, 2010 @ 5:52pm

    LetterheadFonts

    You all sound like a bunch of little crying babies.
    Letterhead fonts has some of the best quality made fonts that you can find. That's because the designers spend hours creating this Unique Art and you little punks want to bitch about not being able to steal from them. We will always do business with Letterhead fonts because of the greatness of their Fonts. Keep in mind that if you want quality goods then you have to pay for it. If you little shit heads have noticed. Letterhead fonts is still in business; And a great looking website. You sound like a bunch of jealous assholes who wish that they could create great fonts. If you don't like the way Letterhead fonts is doing business, why not just buy your fonts someplace else.
    And stop bitching about it. It sounds like you have a serious mental problem and probably devote all your time complaining about most everything.
    Your lives must be in constant turmoil. Why would Letterhead fonts waste their time in replying to angry people. Regarding the unhappy font designer who was fired from Letterhead fonts, There's always two sides to every story. Why would they want to lose a good font designer for no reason?
    We are glad that there is a company like Letterhead fonts.
    Our company has benefited because of them.

     

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  118.  
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    Irma, Apr 25th, 2010 @ 10:35pm

    LetterHeadFonts (Thank You Chuck Davis & your Team)

    I have been reading the complaints about Letterhead Fonts and I think its ridiculous that you can't appreciate and respect other people's talent and devotion to their product. I have purchased Fonts from Letterhead Fonts a few times and received friendly service each time. I think that Fonts should be copyrighted. I have been a Graphic Artist for several years and can appreciate the hard work that goes into creating quality work. Letterhead Fonts has been around a long time and I think they will continue to grow.
    I find it difficult to understand why a few of you would be so determined to spend so much time and effort to run someone down. I think it only shows your lack of skills of being successful in life. Those of you who are so angry should move on and get a life. Why not take that negative energy and put it towards something positive in your lives. As an experienced person in life, I have witnessed that whenever you are busy wallowing in self pity and complaining about someone,that someone is usually
    growing stronger. I do believe that's what happening here.
    Because I don't see any reply's from Letterhead Fonts here, I can assume that's because Letterhead Fonts are professional and successful people and don't waste time answering to negative people who have nothing better to do but complain about things.
    Writing this has made me realize that I need to buy two more Fonts from Letterhead Fonts.

     

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  119.  
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    Rose, Apr 26th, 2010 @ 12:24pm

    Great Advertisements for Letterhead Fonts

    A friend of mine told me about this blog and after checking it out and reading the complaints about Letterhead Fonts I decided to check out their website and WOW! they do some outstanding work there. The fonts are wonderful. I haven't designed fonts but would like to learn. The company that I work for will be interested in buying fonts from them.
    This blog is a great way to advertise.

     

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  120.  
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    4thelolz, Apr 28th, 2010 @ 9:33pm

    Found Funny
    by 4thelolz

    I am a slob.
    http://i44.tinypic.com/w1qtdl.png

    (reply to this comment)(link to this comment)

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  121.  
    identicon
    TooBad, Apr 28th, 2010 @ 9:40pm

    ATTENTION! THE AWARD SYSTEM IS REAL!!!

    I've been a real jerk and want to take back everything I said.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  122.  
    identicon
    David, May 9th, 2010 @ 12:13am

    Upon checking back in and reading a few of the blogs. I have discovered that "4thelolz" and "TooBad" are the same person.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  123.  
    identicon
    Richard, Jun 14th, 2010 @ 1:23pm

    Chuck Davis..the elite moron

    One only has to look at the Letterhead font......"walmart people" to see where chuckie boy is coming from.......well chuck ole boy you might want to model your font foundry after the walmart one.........lol

     

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  124.  
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    steve, Sep 14th, 2010 @ 1:54am

    hes mormon

    this explains everything................................

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  125.  
    identicon
    Chuck Slayer, Dec 29th, 2010 @ 1:14am

    Chuck's lame idiot son comes to rescue

    Upon checking back in and reading the blogs, I have discovered that 'David', 'Irma', and 'Rose' are all from Chuck's stupid son John and his wife. Sucks to not have any friends eh Chuck, and to drive your business so far down to the dirt, that you have to make up posts of non-existent happy customers to try and get sales. Like I've said to all the other designers who've foolishly sold through LHF, You guys are getting ripped off. Try Myfonts, or Fontshop instead. This guy won't make you any money.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  126.  
    identicon
    TooBad, Dec 29th, 2010 @ 1:17am

    Re: ATTENTION! THE AWARD SYSTEM IS REAL!!!

    No I'm not. Fact is, anyone can post with whatever name they want. Right Chuck, er I mean Irma, er I mean David.

    You CAN'T AFFORD TO PAY FOR PIRACY TATTLING! lol that's why you took the page off. You're broke because you're a failure chuck, and your family is just as stupid.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  127.  
    identicon
    Old Man Harris, Jan 3rd, 2011 @ 4:51am

    Whippersnapper

    That Chuck Davis. He is punk from Palmdale,CA. A vandal. Used to vandalize the whole neighborhood with graffiti. Spray paint people's garages, school hallways, and even broke out one of my windows. I cannot believe that anyone would do business with such a white trash miscreant.

    http://4yeo.com/freefonts/cd/chuck.html

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  128.  
    identicon
    Randy Howe, Jan 7th, 2011 @ 1:07pm

    MUNNEY

    ... anyone that uses my name on this site, or any other for that matter, must send me . . . hmmmmmm . . . $1700 - K?

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  129.  
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    nawheeja kalumba, May 14th, 2011 @ 12:17pm

    Re: Fonts, what a joke

    Typographers, how silly. All functional typefaces are derivative works. Decorative typefaces have long historical precedents as well. The Letterheads font series represent the pirated works of long dead anonymous sign painters. A handful of modern artists claiming copyright on all that prior art is a big joke. If you make a big deal out of computer font parameters like kerning and linespacing, and argue whether one company has better quality fonts than another, then you deserve to pay for fonts. Better go find a real artist who can paint a real sign for you.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  130.  
    identicon
    travis, Jul 17th, 2011 @ 6:43pm

    I had a bad experience with LHF

    I actually purchased a font from them once and I later received an email that they wouldn't sell me the font so they credited my card back. I replied asking why and never got a response. Guess the owner is doing so well he doesn't even need our money.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  131.  
    identicon
    haha i got 20, Sep 2nd, 2011 @ 9:05pm

    lhf font...

    i got over 20 lhf fonts for free....just look an from time to time they appear on many font sites...

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  132.  
    identicon
    Anonymous Coward, Jan 24th, 2012 @ 5:28pm

    Re: Re: Re: Fanatic, much?

    why even comment about something you are taking out of context? As a christian we are not called or expected to give up all material things, the"part of the Bible" refers to only seeking material things & allowing them to rule your life. It is hard to help others when we have so much stuff to take care of ourselves.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  133.  
    identicon
    Anonymous Coward, Jan 24th, 2012 @ 5:30pm

    Re: Fonts, what a joke

    ignorant. cant see real art when it is right in front of your face.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  134.  
    icon
    Mac (profile), Mar 27th, 2012 @ 5:29pm

    Re: Fonts

    G W I agree with you completely it was the sign company at fault.

    I do find it interesting how all of these marketing experts have predicted that the company would be out of business soon.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  135.  
    icon
    Mac (profile), Mar 29th, 2012 @ 8:18pm

    Re: Re: Re: Fanatic, much?

    Clearly you are no Nostradamus.

    4 Years later & his business is thriving.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  136.  
    icon
    Mac (profile), Mar 29th, 2012 @ 8:23pm

    Re: Is this guy trying to get free publicity off this or is he really that dumb?

    Hmmmm, how much did it crumble Einstein?

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  137.  
    icon
    Mac (profile), Mar 29th, 2012 @ 8:28pm

    Re:

    Wow another Einstein predicting the business to fail.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  138.  
    icon
    Mac (profile), Mar 29th, 2012 @ 8:29pm

    Re: who the hell pays for a font?

    "Re: who the hell pays for a font?"

    Honest People do.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  139.  
    icon
    Mac (profile), Mar 29th, 2012 @ 8:33pm

    Re: Write Off

    LOL, write you. I am simply amazed at how many wannabe Techie/Marketing geniuses gather in 1 place and predict a business to fail, then disappear when they realize how foolish they were.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  140.  
    icon
    Mac (profile), Mar 29th, 2012 @ 8:46pm

    Re: Re: Techdirt

    "I never said they'd go out of business immediately.

    But wait and see."

    Mike, is 4 years later still considered immediately?

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  141.  
    icon
    Mac (profile), Mar 29th, 2012 @ 9:10pm

    Re: lhf font...

    haha say's "i got over 20 lhf fonts for free....just look an from time to time they appear on many font sites"

    Well congratulations, maybe you can be a professional thief when you grow up.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  142.  
    identicon
    Mac, Jul 7th, 2012 @ 12:22am

    About those 20 lhf fonts!

    I just discovered that those free fonts didn't last long.
    After using them and passing them around to my friends, the fonts became unusable. there must have been a code embedded into them because all my other fonts that I stold are also acting strange.
    What do I do now? Please help!
    Any suggestions?

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]


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