India Gearing Up To Fight ACTA; Seeking Other, Like-Minded, Countries

from the good-for-india dept

While the various governments supporting ACTA continue to insist there's nothing wrong with it, clearly more and more people are realizing that there are some massive problems with it, and we're not talking about the usual group of activists. It seems that India -- which is in the middle of reviewing its own copyright law -- is quite worried about ACTA. It's looking to team up with "like-minded countries" to oppose ACTA and to hold talks with countries who agree to ACTA to explain why they're worried about it. India's main concern appears to be over some of the proposals that would continue to allow the seizure of legal generic drugs passing through other countries, something that has been a huge problem for the Indian healthcare system.

Meanwhile, others elsewhere are seeing problems as well. Ray Dowd, a copyright litigator who writes an excellent blog on copyright issues, is getting himself up to speed on ACTA and seems horrified by what he's reading. He admits that he expected that the scare stories online that he'd been reading would prove to be exaggerations, but he now thinks that people aren't concerned enough about ACTA:
So when I finally got around to reading the text of ACTA, I thought that I would find the concerns I'd seen floating around the internet to be a little overblown.

In fact, I think that the concerns of the EFF are understated. I am not so concerned about confidential negotiations to give trade representatives some time to brainstorm. But the text appears to be so one-sided as to appear to have been spoonfed by certain aggressive Hollywood rights-holders who don't think anyone can make fun of Mickey Mouse and that anyone crossing a border should be frisked for a fake Louis Vuitton handbag.

I am surprised that ISP's and technology users seem to have had so little input into the process.
He notes that he's all for a true anti-counterfeiting agreement, but he's surprised that the government is using this to shoehorn in all sorts of things that have nothing to do with copyright:
What is counterfeiting? In my humble estimation, it is knowingly making large quantities of exact copies of a trademarked, patented, or copyrighted good with the intention of selling such large quantities to defraud consumers and the rights holders.

Thus, any anti-counterfeiting treaty would have the elements:

1. exact copies or copies intended to be so similar that a consumer could not tell the difference;
2. protected goods;
3. large quantities (500?) (2,000?);
4. intent to defraud consumers and rights holders.

Some kid copying stuff to his Ipod is not counterfeiting. Even 2,000 songs.

So anyone labeling a treaty "anti-counterfeiting" and that does not have the foregoing elements is trying to pull a scam on me.
His conclusion sums up what many of us have been saying for quite some time:
ACTA appears to be an attempt to tie Congress's hands in terms of domestic copyright legislation, rather than a legitmate attempt to pursue counterfeiting.
But, of course, according to various folks at the USTR and the Copyright Office, now that ACTA's been released, it's proven that all the "fears" from online sources were misguided. Right?


Reader Comments (rss)

(Flattened / Threaded)

  1.  
    icon
    weneedhelp (profile), Jun 1st, 2010 @ 2:23pm

    Evil AC

    I guess this is just all those "copyright" websites again, huh?

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  2.  
    icon
    Nastybutler77 (profile), Jun 1st, 2010 @ 2:56pm

    What now TAM?

    Now that a real life lawyer has reached the same conclusion Mike had, what is TAM going to say? Cue the "Yeah buts" in 3,2,1...

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  3.  
    identicon
    TAM (impersonation), Jun 1st, 2010 @ 3:02pm

    Re: What now TAM?

    India just wants to copy everything the U.S. does. They want to freeload from the U.S. R&D and art and music and whatnot instead of producing their own. What freeloaders. and they do generic drugs as well, which again is freeloading off of those who produced the generics.

    How did I do?

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  4.  
    identicon
    Anonymous Coward, Jun 1st, 2010 @ 3:03pm

    Re: Re: What now TAM?

    Oh, and lets not forget, copying is the same thing as stealing. Remember folks, copying = stealing

     

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  5.  
    identicon
    Fake TAM, Jun 1st, 2010 @ 3:06pm

    Slavery

    Ha! Mike, as usual doesn't know what hes talking about. Get the facts idiot before posting. You just defend pirates while they starve Yoko, Paul and Ringo! You never offer any rational dispute to my objections and this is an excellent example of what I've been saying. THANK YOU for proving my point!

    Everyone knows that the LAW has been going the way of the pirates since the Internet came into being. Finely we get much needed relief, and all you want to do is defend the assholes that enslaved us! THIS IS A HUMAN RIGHTS ISSUE!! where is amnesty international when you need them? Want proof? Just look AT Fiona Apple jackass!

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  6.  
    icon
    Richard (profile), Jun 1st, 2010 @ 3:08pm

    Re: Re: Re: What now TAM?

    "I'm sure there must be something more to this story..."

    Ah, happy days...

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  7.  
    identicon
    IronM@sk, Jun 1st, 2010 @ 3:09pm

    Share To Facebook

    //off-topic: The "Share To"- Facebook isn't playing very nice today. It's not parsing the article title header and article snippet or thumbnail chooser.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  8.  
    icon
    crade (profile), Jun 1st, 2010 @ 3:12pm

    Darnit, if only we were well-represented, we could be a like-minded country!

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  9.  
    identicon
    Anonymous Coward, Jun 1st, 2010 @ 3:25pm

    Re: Re: Re: Re: What now TAM?

    Oh, and lets not forget. It's obvious now but it may not have been obvious then. Don't know what that has to do with this argument but I can't understand half of what TAM says anyways.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  10.  
    identicon
    FUTURE ACTA ENFORCER, Jun 1st, 2010 @ 3:26pm

    You'll all pay. Soon enough.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  11.  
    identicon
    Anonymous Coward, Jun 1st, 2010 @ 3:28pm

    In fairness, India has no patents for pharmaceutical drugs, therefore every generic is legal. Pretty frustrating for European and U.S. pharma, as every drug they have spent billions developing becomes instantly available on Indian markets for generic prices.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  12.  
    identicon
    Anonymous Coward, Jun 1st, 2010 @ 3:38pm

    Re:

    Stupid free market.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  13.  
    identicon
    FUTURE ACTA UNDERMINER, Jun 1st, 2010 @ 3:57pm

    No, we won't.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  14.  
    identicon
    DTS, Jun 1st, 2010 @ 4:15pm

    Re: Re: Re: Re: What now TAM?

    You guys forgot to uncap all your capital letters...

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  15.  
    identicon
    Anonymous Coward, Jun 1st, 2010 @ 4:38pm

    Re:

    In opposed to twenty year monopolies (well, the effective life is less + extensions) despite the fact that there is no evidence that patents even promote the progress, especially in pharmaceutical where most of the innovation occurred during a time with fewer patent restrictions and what we have now, with all these patents, are me too drugs with minor modifications of previous drugs, drugs that would be produced perfectly well without patents.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  16.  
    icon
    Wig Poo (profile), Jun 1st, 2010 @ 4:42pm

    Wow

    Sounds to me like they might have a we bit too much spare time on their hands in India LOL

    Lou
    www.anon-posting.at.tc

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  17.  
    identicon
    Anonymous Coward, Jun 1st, 2010 @ 5:07pm

    ACTA will be BRIC(ed) LoL

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  18.  
    identicon
    Anonymous Coward, Jun 1st, 2010 @ 5:16pm

    Re: Wow

    Not enough spare time to stand up for our rights? I think not? Standing up for our rights is a very important endeavor and the time used to do it should hardly be considered spare. It's necessary time used to accomplish a necessary endeavor.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  19.  
    identicon
    Anonymous Coward, Jun 1st, 2010 @ 5:24pm

    BRIC them all!

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  20.  
    identicon
    Shadow Six, Jun 1st, 2010 @ 6:49pm

    I stand with India

    Will someone start an I stand with India group on facebook :) we need some showmanship if were going to force the media to cover ACTA.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  21.  
    identicon
    Anonymous Coward, Jun 1st, 2010 @ 7:31pm

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: What now TAM?

    so did you.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  22.  
    identicon
    Anonymous Coward, Jun 1st, 2010 @ 7:33pm

    Re: I stand with India

    The media has covered it a tiny bit, favorably of course. You mean if we're going to try and persuade the media to cover it fairly. I doubt that will ever happen though, to the extent they cover it they will present it as the savior of humanity.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  23.  
    icon
    Hephaestus (profile), Jun 2nd, 2010 @ 4:03am

    Re:

    "as every drug they have spent billions developing becomes "

    Do you remember how the IP industry contributes 1.8?? trillion dollar to the US economy? Rememner how that number was called into question? I will give you a hint at what I am getting at ... It Doesnt Cost The Pharma Industry Billions To Bring a Drug To Market. You are spouting industry rehtoric

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  24.  
    icon
    BoloMKXXVIII (profile), Jun 2nd, 2010 @ 5:18am

    Re: Re:

    The drug industry spends 10 times as much on advertising compared to R&D. They don't like to talk up that little fact.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  25.  
    identicon
    Anonymous Coward, Jun 2nd, 2010 @ 5:27am

    Re: Re:

    You are confusing copyright with patents. Copyright is a ridiculous duration, while many drug patents enter the public domain every year after the 20 year patent protection ends.

    Impossible to discuss the rest of your assertions. What exactly constitutes "innovation" in pharma?

    Regarding the minor modifications, this seems to be an issue that the market should figure out. If generics are available that are so chemically similar to the new patented drug, than people will gravitate towards the cheaper drug, or the patented drug will be similar in price to the generic.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  26.  
    identicon
    DH's Love Child, Jun 2nd, 2010 @ 6:57am

    Re: Re: Re:

    "You are confusing copyright with patents. Copyright is a ridiculous duration, while many drug patents enter the public domain every year after the 20 year patent protection ends.
    "

    except when the big pharma pay companies to NOT release generics... oops

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  27.  
    icon
    chris (profile), Jun 2nd, 2010 @ 8:22am

    Re: Re:

    Stupid free market.

    Stupid free will.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  28.  
    identicon
    Anonymous Coward, Jun 2nd, 2010 @ 10:15am

    Re: Re: Re: Re:

    That my friend is completely irrelevant to my original point.

    1) Indians don't pay any of the price to develop or create these drugs.
    2) Indians get all of the benefits.
    3) The rest of the world suffers, because overall innovation in the field is stunted, since the incentives to create pharmaceuticals are less.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  29.  
    icon
    Craig (profile), Jun 3rd, 2010 @ 8:49pm

    India FTW

    Are there any like-minded countries out there? Canada isn't one of them...our government just rides the shirttails of the coconuts south of the 49th in terms of laws and policies.

    India++

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  30.  
    identicon
    Born 1965, Jul 8th, 2010 @ 9:41am

    My opinion

    "I wouldn't steal a car, bud I sure as hell would download one if I could"

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]


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