Ford Continues To Slap Down Enthusiast Calendars, Saying You Can't Sell Photos Of Your Own Car
from the seems-like-a-stretch dept
Back in October, Ford got itself into some hot water over plenty of negative attention after it forced a Jaguar enthusiasts' group to stop selling calendars made up of photos of the cars they actually owned. You would have thought that the folks at Ford would have learned from the negative publicity surrounding that debacle. Apparently, they learned nothing, because they've now done the exact same thing to a Mustang enthusiasts' club, and it's getting even more attention than the last time around. What possible rationale does a lawyer give for suggesting slapping down an attempt by a car company's biggest fans (by their own admission!) to celebrate how much they love their vehicles by promoting them to others? Some may claim that you need to enforce your trademark or risk losing it -- but a situation like this is unlikely to be seen as something that needs to have been enforced. No sane judge will rule that allowing enthusiasts to display a calendar is the equivalent of giving up your trademark rights.
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Hopefully money will be lost by PaulT on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 3:26am
From what I've read about this case elsewhere, a lot of the owners are threatening to boycott Ford if they continue with this action. That's right, a Ford enthusiast club is threatening to boycott the very thing that they spend their time doing with their disposable income because Ford is trying to protect their "property".
I'm confused as to why Ford would even think they have a case. We're talking about free advertising and fair use of a person's own property. This would be like Campbells suing Andy Warhol for painting their soup cans - utterly stupid.
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Hmmm, I say Hmmm by August West on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 3:38am
And people wonder why Ford is struggling in the marketplace? Decisions this idiotic are never isolated incidents. It took a committe of idiots to make this decision, and they make other decisions as well.
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Fans? by MadJo on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 3:54am
We don't need no stinkin' fans! We want money! Money, money, lotsa money!
This is exactly what you get when you let the legal department run loose/run the company.
Shortsighted maroons.
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hahahahahahaha by Hellsvilla on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 4:00am
The only thing funnier than giving the business's reins to the lawyers is to give the reins to the sales and marketing department.
Both situations lead to the complete corruption and eventual dissolving of the company, but the lawyers end things too quickly for that long chuckle. The sales and marketing folks take forever to do what the lawyers can do in just one year.
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Only thing I can think of... by Wolfger on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 4:25am
...is that the calendar is being sold as a "Ford Mustang Calendar" or some other name that "could confuse customers" into thinking Ford actually publishes or endorses the calendar. In which case, the best thing Ford could do would be to ask the club to burn the existing calendars and in exchange, pay (out of Ford's pocket) to reprint new calendars under a new name. That would generate *good* publicity and good will, rather than bad publicity and ill will. Or, they could just ignore it, which would be cheaper.
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Re: Only thing I can think of... by John Duncan Yoyo on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 4:35am
How about the license the use of the Ford name in instances like this for a dollar?
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Re: Only thing I can think of... by John Duncan Yoyo on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 4:35am
How about the license the use of the Ford name in instances like this for a dollar?
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The next big lawsuit... by Adimax on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 4:37am
Armani sues actors for wearing their clothing at high profile events with lots of photographers.
"We sold them the clothes, but we never gave the OK for them to put themselves AND our clothing on so many magazine covers!"
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Re: Only thing I can think of... by VoicesInMyHead on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 4:44am
Nope... It's a pseudo internet 'club', made up of only the color black mustangs. Black Mustang Club. Here is their forum, and message thread on this C&D order:
http://www.bmcforums.com/showthread.php?t=42402
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by Vincent Clement on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 4:48am
You know that intellectual property law as we know it is a failure when you have record companies suing their fans, automotive companies sending cease & desist letters to fan clubs, and content creators abuse the DMCA to remove negative reviews on the internet (oddly enough they don't abuse the DMCA to remove positive reviews).
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Trade Mark not being violated? by Doug Robb on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 5:12am
I would have thought the Trade Mark was more to do with protecting the manufacturer from others building cars and sticking a Ford logo on it in the same way you expect Fender Stratocasters for example to me made by Fender and not someone else. It's a simple matter of preventing confusion in the market place between various car makers.
So if you actually own a genuine Ford vehicle and choose to either drive it, sleep in it, take it to a fan club show or make a calendar out of it I don't see how you are infringing the Trade Mark even if they consider the mark extends into other areas?
There is no condition that you are sold the car for the sole purpose of driving it is there? So my point is as long as it's what the maker (Ford) produced you can do what you dam well like with the car - even heaven forbid crash it!
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Re: by Chronno S. Trigger on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 5:14am
Why is it that only the gaming companies seem to get this? Bungie and Red vs. Blue come to mind. Bungie didn't sue, they helped, they understand the value of user generated content.
Why is it when I try to link to the rvb page (www.redvsblue.com) it comes up as "Http://www.techdirt.com/www.redvsblue.com"?
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Re: Hopefully money will be lost by Mmmm Mmmm Good on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 5:18am
PaulT said:
"This would be like Campbells suing Andy Warhol for painting their soup cans - utterly stupid."
I thought they did. Can anyone confirm this ?
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by Eric Aitala on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 5:33am
Something similar is messy up my hobby, scale model building. Companies are going after aftermarket decal makers who sell decals to accurately represent sponsor decals for race cars. Its virtually impossible to get licensing to produce the decals - either the cost is too high for such a small market or finding who to contact in not possible.
I've suggested that some of the major model builders - one fellow gets about $15k for his finished kits - start contacting the companies to get money from them or leave those sponsor decals off.
Dr. E.
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Re #5 by Killer_Tofu on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 5:39am
You would think Ford would Want to endorse this.
It is peolpe who love their cars.
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slashdot by Joel Coehoorn on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 5:40am
The slashdot brief I read previously talked about Ford claiming ownership (copyright) over the photos, but that is misleading. The trademark issue mentioned here makes a lot more sense, at least from a legal standpoint. The business case is still puzzling.
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hate to say it but... by matt on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 5:43am
honestly, take them to court, countersue for large sums of money, demand an injunction against ford. If they have the resources to do this (or a smart enough lawyer to take it on), that is probably the only way ford will recognize this. Of course they'll try to drop it before that so that they can try the case with other people first.
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Re: Fans? by Cixelsid on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 5:59am
"Shortsighted maroons."
Hehe...maroons...
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Insane Judges by Jeffry Houser on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 6:07am
There seem to be a lot of insane judges and crazy rulings these days..
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real stupidity by Eterion on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 6:19am
One person can make a stupid decision but it takes a committee to make a really idiotic one.
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Re: Re: Hopefully money will be lost by PaulT on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 6:44am
Thanks to work filters, I haven't been able to look it up, but yeah I think they did sue. That's the half-assed point I was trying to make in a way - Campbell's didn't gain anything if they did sue, and the indirect promotional value of Warhol's paintings did nothing but good for them.
The same here - Ford would never get damaged by this calendar but could indirectly help interest people in their products without any cost to them. Instead, they're suing and potentially losing themselves some of their best customers while doing nothing would cause them no damage...
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Trademark? by jasna on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 6:48am
I work in TV and films. Recently we were instructed to hide the logo on some cars to avoid showing brands. I'm not talking James Bond in a car front and center. I'm talking a medium budget family film where the scene is on the street. To be fair this came from producers as they are increasingly afraid of being sued.
It's just easier to "dress" the street with cars from companies not so anal retentive.
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by Overcast on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 6:56am
So now - Ford, like the RIAA - wants ownership of an item AFTER they sell it??
A new law would help - how about one - where, when a consumer buys something... it's THEIRS.
Ford better get on suing the movie companies too.
That's ok - I'll keep in mind that I can't take pictures of my own car if I buy a Ford - and I'm buying in a couple months.. I figured with how their stock is doing, they would be more friendly...
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Ford Fiasco by Chuck on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 7:00am
If the pictures that are taken by the owners of the afore mentioned Mustangs are the intellectual property of Ford then why hasn’t Ford complained about every picture taken by Auto Trader of any other mag that advertises cars for sale? There is money being made from these as well, I think Ford should get their heads out of their wallets and start working on ways to promote their products and build better cars so that they might get back the sales they have lost to Toyota and Honda.
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by Anonymous Coward on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 7:07am
"No sane judge will rule that allowing enthusiasts to display a calendar is the equivalent of giving up your trademark rights."
A sane judge might rule that enthuiasts can't SELL calendars though. That is what the suit is about, not displaying.
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Car Companies easier to understand... by Daniel on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 7:09am
If you watch the movie, "Who Killed the Electric Car". Netflix has it.
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Ford by Bill Snyder on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 7:10am
Why don't we just let Ford die out as it should. This Corp. has never listened to the public, (its customers), and evidently is to constipated to see it's mistakes. We don't need them any more. Good bye Ford, now realistically known as, Found On Road Dead, of business suicide!
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by Gurney on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 7:12am
Next Ford will be baring them from using there cars in public performances (aka driving in the streets)
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Re: Only thing I can think of... by Anonymous Coward on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 7:20am
...is that the calendar is being sold as a "Ford Mustang Calendar" or some other name that "could confuse customers" into thinking Ford actually publishes or endorses the calendar.
I think you're making stuff up now.
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Re: hate to say it but... by Anonymous Coward on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 7:24am
honestly, take them to court...
Who's supposed to pay for that?
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Re: by Anonymous Coward on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 7:30am
A sane judge might rule that enthuiasts can't SELL calendars though.
You left out the "in" and misspelled "enthusiasts". Here, let me fix it for you:
An insane judge might rule that enthusiasts can't SELL calendars though.
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Let'em die off... by SeattleGuy on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 8:13am
...cuz they don't deserve to live. Ford is the company that promotes (maybe started?) a legal defense fund for Alberto Gonzales.
I'll never buy another Ford, aside from supporting a lying thief, they can't (or won't!) make a car that has what I consider to be good gas mileage. In fact, Explorer sales are down 26%, while Prius sales are up by at least the same amount.
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I DO NOT BELIEVE IT! by George Heindel on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 9:34am
As an avid Ford Fan and collector for over forty years, I am appalled at what I have read here and elsewhere concerning this issue.
WAKE UP FORD...the corporation with the most Collectible Automobiles on the planet. Why can only Carroll Shelby and Jack Roush depict your products in every publication in the US?
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Re: by George Heindel on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 9:43am
Hoping you are incorrect!
Many of the collector car community may choose to challenge
that freedom en masse.
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by Mojo on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 11:28am
While I still think Ford is a little nuts, you have to try and see it from the other side - I'm guessing there *IS* an official Mustang calandar out there, and if the fan club is selling an unauthorized one, that directly competes with a licensed product; that can easily be demonstrated as potentially digging into the sales of a company that has paid a fee to sell a Mustang calandar.
If Ford lets that slide, then I could see the calandar company having a legit case to sue Ford for not protecting the license they paid for. And if the fan club is allowed to sell their calandar, can another fan club sell keychains too? Where do you draw the line?
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by Terry on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 11:44am
Yeah, I sent an email to ford's customer service and I have been bounced to 8, yes EIGHT different departments trying to get info on this situation.
Personally I own a ford, I have always owned fords. I work for another medium and heavy duty manufacturer and we promote things like this. We want to see what the customers are doing to THEIR own vehicles. We have sold untold amounts of parts to customers when they bring a picture in of a truck and say "make it look like that".
But if Ford wants to tell me that I can't make money off of the truck that I own, I will be asking for royalties back for me to stay loyal...
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by Pathetic on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 12:40pm
Bottom line - another company is profiting from the sales of calendars that contain Ford deemed "intellectual property", without their consent (aka piece of the pie).
It's a constant reminder of the direction that society has been headed down for quite some time, "when in financial difficulty, seek legal sources for income". It's no different for companies as it is for individuals.
As a major US corporation, you need to pick and choose your battles wisely, after-all, you have a reputation to maintain, right? This perhaps, will undoubtedly cost the company far more than the "few" enthusiasts that were directly effected.
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by James on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 1:48pm
When Ford's name appears as owner on the car's title, then and only then can they have a say in what happens with a picture of the car. Period.
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Re: Re: Only thing I can think of... by John Duncan Yoyo on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 1:53pm
Ford would prefer that you bought a Dodge calendar.
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Re: by Anonymous Coward on Jan 15th, 2008 @ 4:46pm
I'm guessing there *IS* an official Mustang calandar out there, and if the fan club is selling an unauthorized one, that directly competes with a licensed product;
So? What's wrong with competition?
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BMC Calendar Approved by Timmy on Jan 16th, 2008 @ 9:54am
If anyone read the forum you would find out that the calendar was approved by Ford. Cafe Press would not print the calendar because they have had trademark issues in the past.
Please read this thread:
http://www.bmcforums.com/showthread.php?t=42820
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Re: BMC Calendar Approved by Anonymous Coward on Jan 16th, 2008 @ 2:22pm
So Ford had a change of heart, eh? It's amazing what publicity can do sometimes. Still, they were wrong in the first place.
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