Case Dismissed: Judge Throws Out Shiva Ayyadurai's Defamation Lawsuit Against Techdirt

from the the-first-amendment-means-something dept

As you likely know, for most of the past nine months, we've been dealing with a defamation lawsuit from Shiva Ayyadurai, who claims to have invented email. This is a claim that we have disputed at great length and in great detail, showing how email existed long before Ayyadurai wrote his program. We pointed to the well documented public history of email, and how basically all of the components that Ayyadurai now claims credit for preceded his own work. We discussed how his arguments were, at best, misleading, such as arguing that the copyright on his program proved that he was the "inventor of email" -- since patents and copyrights are very different, and just because Microsoft has a copyright on "Windows" it does not mean it "invented" the concept of a windowed graphical user interface (because it did not). As I have said, a case like this is extremely draining -- especially on an emotional level -- and can create massive chilling effects on free speech.

A few hours ago, the judge ruled and we prevailed. The case has been dismissed and the judge rejected Ayyadurai's request to file an amended complaint. We are certainly pleased with the decision and his analysis, which notes over and over again that everything that we stated was clearly protected speech, and the defamation (and other claims) had no merit. This is, clearly, a big win for the First Amendment and free speech -- especially the right to call out and criticize a public figure such as Shiva Ayyadurai, who is now running for the US Senate in Massachusetts. We're further happy to see the judge affirm that CDA Section 230 protects us from being sued over comments made on the blog, which cannot be attributed to us under the law. We talk a lot about the importance of CDA 230, in part because it protects sites like our own from these kinds of lawsuits. This is just one more reason we're so concerned about the latest attempt in Congress to undermine CDA 230. While those supporting the bill may claim that it only targets sites like Backpage, such changes to CDA 230 could have a much bigger impact on smaller sites like our own.

We are disappointed, however, that the judge denied our separate motion to strike under California's anti-SLAPP law. For years, we've discussed the importance of strong anti-SLAPP laws that protect individuals and sites from going through costly legal battles. Good anti-SLAPP laws do two things: they stop lawsuits early and they make those who bring SLAPP suits -- that is, lawsuits clearly designed to silence protected speech -- pay the legal fees. The question in this case was whether or not California's anti-SLAPP law should apply to a case brought in Massachusetts. While other courts have said that the state of the speaker should determine which anti-SLAPP laws are applied (even in other states' courts), it was an issue that had not yet been ruled upon in the First Circuit where this case was heard. While we're happy with the overall dismissal and the strong language used to support our free speech rights, we're nevertheless disappointed that the judge chose not to apply California's anti-SLAPP law here.

However, that just reinforces the argument we've been making for years: we need stronger anti-SLAPP laws in many states (including Massachusetts) and, even more importantly, we need a strong federal anti-SLAPP law to protect against frivolous lawsuits designed to silence protected speech. The results of this case have only strengthened our resolve to do everything possible to continue to fight hard for protecting freedom of expression and to push for stronger anti-SLAPP laws that make free speech possible, and not burdensome and expensive.

You have not heard the last from us on the issue of the First Amendment, free speech and anti-SLAPP laws -- or how some try to use the court system to silence and bully critics. Step one of this is our new Free Speech edition, which we announced just a few weeks ago, where we are focusing more of our reporting efforts on issues related to free speech and anti-SLAPP. We intend to do a lot more as well. For years, we've talked about these issues from the position of an observer, and now we can talk about them from the perspective of someone who has gone through this process as well.

Of course, if you have to face something like this, it helps to have great lawyers--and we're immensely grateful for the incredible hard-work of Rob Bertsche, Jeff Pyle and Thomas Sutcliffe along with the rest of the team at their firm, Prince Lobel Tye LLP.

Finally, I can't even begin to thank everyone who has supported us over the past nine months -- whether by kind words (you don't know how much that helped!) or through our survival fund at ISupportJournalism.com or by becoming a Techdirt Insider. We just passed Techdirt's 20th anniversary and while it's one thing to think that people like and support you, it's another thing altogether to see how people come out to support you when it matters most. And we were overwhelmed by the support we received over the past nine months, and the kind words and help that many, many people offered. It was beyond heartening, and, once again, it reinforces our resolve to continue to speak up for free speech and to do what we can to protect others' ability to speak out as well.


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  1. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 2:33pm

    Congratulations!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  2. icon
    Toom1275 (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 2:36pm

    Qapla'

    If only this decision had arrived a couple weeks earlier, it would have made a fine 20th birthday present for Techdirt.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  3. icon
    Binsky (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 2:40pm

    Woohoo, congratulations! Very happy to learn that the case was dismissed. Hope you guys now get to move on to happier things, and that this really means the last of this chapter.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  4. identicon
    FM Hilton, 6 Sep 2017 @ 2:43pm

    To the victors!

    Congratulations on a hard-won case! Hopefully this is deter others from trying the same type of scam. "I invented the internet!"
    But don't hold your breath..have a glass of bubbly and kick off your shoes. It's been a long fight.
    Time to just enjoy the victory.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  5. identicon
    Eric FJ, 6 Sep 2017 @ 2:43pm

    Dumb question - how did he get the copyrights?

    This may be a dumb question, but when I worked for a University in the 1980s, they claimed copyright for all my work (work made for hire, etc.).

    In addition, as a comp sci student at the time, they claimed copyright for anything created that used their computers. I remember arguing over this (they did not claim ownership for paintings made by art students, etc. even though the art students used university facilities).

    Anyway, if this case is appealed, a check on the policy of the University at the time may make difficulties for the the copyright registration.

    Sorry if I am repeating things, and congratulations!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  6. identicon
    RS, 6 Sep 2017 @ 2:43pm

    This is great news and must be a huge relief. Congratulations on the win and thanks for standing up for freedom of the press and First Amendment rights.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  7. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 2:44pm

    MATTER OF LAW!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  8. icon
    Toom1275 (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 2:45pm

    Who could have predicted that weaving a defamation case entirely out of blatantly misrepresenting both fact and law would could possibly fail? It boggles some minds.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  9. icon
    trystero (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 2:46pm

    Excellent news!

    Really happy to hear of this outcome. I'm still looking forward to voting against defamation-guy in the next Senate race.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  10. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 2:49pm

    Congrats!

    Awesome news!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  11. icon
    Cdaragorn (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 2:51pm

    Congratulations!

    Best news of the month! So nice to see both this liar shut down in court and hopefully a huge relief for you. Thank you for fighting to set this needed precedent on his ridiculous claims!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  12. icon
    stderric (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 2:51pm

    Cool! I can send email again. (My contribution to the cause was more of an empty symbolic gesture than financial.)

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  13. icon
    Roger Strong (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 2:55pm

    Congratulations!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  14. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 2:57pm

    Victory Haiku - True Confession

    I fist-pumped and grinned

    Hey! Something worked as it should!

    This is a good day.

    ***

    Congrats!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  15. identicon
    Shmerl, 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:02pm

    Congratulations! I'm really glad this was resolved.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  16. identicon
    Max, 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:02pm

    Awesome!

    I definitely had better days than the last few, but none of that matters now - this is definitely a good day after all. No, an awesome day! Congrats, Techdirt!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  17. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:04pm

    Break out the champagne!




    Also vaguely surprised the Shiva trolls haven't already posted here.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  18. icon
    ASMonk (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:11pm

    Re:

    It worked last time

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  19. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:11pm

    Re:

    ...they're regrouping under a rock...

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  20. identicon
    Canuck, 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:15pm

    G'day, eh?

    Salutations from the great frozen north. We polar bears are warmed by this good news. Keep fighting the good fight, Mike!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  21. identicon
    Thad, 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:17pm

    Re: Re:

    You mean Ayyadurai v Gawker? No it didn't.

    Gawker went bankrupt following Bollea v Gawker, then sold its assets to Univision. A condition of the sale was that Gawker settle all the outstanding lawsuits against it.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  22. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:18pm

    I was having a bad day till I read this ..

    Now my day has been completely turned around.

    Fuck you Shiva.

    Can't wait till I can say a legit "Fuck you Bob Murray".

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  23. identicon
    Mason Wheeler, 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:21pm

    This is awesome news!

    Any chance of him appealing, though? I know some things can be appealed and some can't, but I'm not too clear on the specifics...

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  24. This comment has been flagged by the community. Click here to show it
    identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:22pm

    Oh, rats! -- Er, I mean, congRATSulation!

    So what was with all the drama for last months? -- And other sour-grapes-ing.

    With your promises last week to allow free speech here, we're all set for some exercise, huh?

    And yes, this is ME, the person who's had thousand of comments here "hidden", not to stint you on the win. Enjoy!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  25. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:24pm

    Re: Oh, rats! -- Er, I mean, congRATSulation!

    And yes, this is ME

    I do not believe that you are you.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  26. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:26pm

    Great news!!
    I have been reading and commenting on techdirt articles for almost 10 years now (under one name or another). I am also looking forward to you continuing for the foreseeable future.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  27. icon
    Rick Battle (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:28pm

    Re: Re: Re:

    From a SLAPP perspective, that means it 100% worked.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  28. icon
    That One Guy (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:32pm

    Better late than never

    While it certainly would have been nice to see this article a couple months back it's still a welcome sight to see now, easily the best news this week.

    Now the only question is whether Shiva will have the good sense to slink away after being slapped down, or if his ego will cause him to double-down and try to appeal. Hopefully it'll be the first.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  29. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:32pm

    Re: Oh, rats! -- Er, I mean, congRATSulation!

    lol

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  30. icon
    JMT (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:34pm

    Re: Re: Re:

    Of course it worked! You don't think that was the intended outcome?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  31. icon
    JMT (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:34pm

    Re: Re: Re:

    Of course it worked! You don't think that was the intended outcome?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  32. This comment has been flagged by the community. Click here to show it
    identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:39pm

    Re: Re: Oh, rats! -- Er, I mean, congRATSulation!

    >>> "I do not believe that you are you."

    Well, I'd try to convince you, but I'm certain that you are not YOU.

    What do you want of me beyond RATS? -- I'm devastated. I'm over-wrought. I'm a wreck. I am drenched with, er, anti-schadenfreude. -- Actually I didn't invest much hope, such cases rarely go far and I've no actual stake, just enjoyed while could.

    I do bet that Masnick will be more careful in future with his insulting, though, eh? It's even likely this bit of adversity will actually improve him! -- Yes, that's the line I'll take: Hey, Masnick, remember how you felt when looked like would be silenced? -- Thanks, AC, for prompting me to work through this to a useful tack.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  33. icon
    wshuff (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:39pm

    I've been waiting for this good news. Happy for you Mike and for Techdirt!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  34. icon
    JMT (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:39pm

    Awesome news, and I genuinely hope it receives enough publicity to scuttle Shiva's Senate run. He's exactly the sort of politician nobody needs!

    I wonder what all those who claimed so confidently and gleefully that he would win have to say now...

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  35. identicon
    Dale, 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:43pm

    Delighted to hear this - congratulations!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  36. icon
    Ehud Gavron (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:44pm

    Congratulations!

    It's a well-deserved victory. The exhaustion must be overwhelming!! Best celebratory wishes to you all!!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  37. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:46pm

    Re: Better late than never

    "after being slapped down"

    If only Ayyadurai had been Anti-SLAPPed down as well.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  38. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:47pm

    Re: Re: Re: Re:

    The Hulk Hogan lawsuit "worked." The other lawsuit never got the chance to work or not work.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  39. icon
    roebling (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:48pm

    Woo hoo!

    Great news!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  40. identicon
    Thad, 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:49pm

    Re: Re: Re: Re:

    It was for Thiel, anyway. Ayyadurai mostly just got lucky.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  41. icon
    DocGerbil100 (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:49pm

    That's immensely pleasing news!
    Very well done to Prince Lobel Tye LLP - and my congratulations to everyone at Techdirt.
    :D:D:D:D:D

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  42. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:50pm

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:

    For bogus defamation claims such as this one, I guess "not be laughed out of the clerk's office while trying to file it" counts as a "win."

    My original comment was considering a "win" to be the lawsuit succeeding on its "merits."

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  43. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:50pm

    Re:

    From the Ars article:

    UPDATE 6:15pm ET: Charles Harder, Ayyadurai's attorney, e-mailed Ars a statement on behalf of his client, saying that Ayyadurai would be appealing the ruling.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  44. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:59pm

    Congrats! Wonderful to see that this great site won't be going anywhere. I have learned so many things here that I didn't even know I didn't know!

    Keep up the good work

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  45. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 3:59pm

    CONGRATS!!!

    I guess Ayyadurai needs to go find something new to claim invention of, then. Good riddance to bad rubbish!!!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  46. identicon
    Coffee, 6 Sep 2017 @ 4:00pm

    That's so awesome

    I'm literally sitting here similing and being thankful for Techdirt. Woohoo!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  47. identicon
    JLofty, 6 Sep 2017 @ 4:12pm

    Awesome!!!

    Well congratulations. What a tremendous waste of time and resources.
    Good for you Mike etal.....

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  48. icon
    McGyver (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 4:13pm

    Congratulations!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  49. identicon
    J.R., 6 Sep 2017 @ 4:13pm

    Victory

    Yaaaaaaay!!!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  50. icon
    metalliqaz (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 4:14pm

    The only thing Ayyadurai ever invented was new ways to be an asshole.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  51. icon
    That One Guy (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 4:18pm

    Re: Re:

    So ego wins and he doubles down after all. I'd say I was surprised, but that would be a total lie.

    Yeah, just read the entire ruling, and he's going to have a fun time with that appeal given how totally the judge dismantled him here.

    As noted in the ruling, 'On a motion to dismiss, the Court “must assume the truth of all well-plead[ed] facts and give plaintiff the benefit of all reasonable inferences therefrom.”

    That even under that standard it was still tossed at this stage says a lot, with the ruling basically going through all the claims and dismissing them as based upon protected speech or merely defamation claims under another name(with regards to claims two and three).

    As for why the judge refused to allow him to amend the complaint, I imagine that might impact any appeal he might make, as it doesn't look very good for him and/or his lawyer.

    A request for leave to amend requires a plaintiff to “set forth the factual and legal predicate for the remedy sought.” Silverstrand Investments, 707 F.3d at 107. Here, however, plaintiff’s opposition fails to set forth a single additional fact that would be included in the amended complaint. Accordingly, plaintiff has failed to “do[] the necessary leg work,” id., and the request to amend will be denied.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  52. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 4:18pm

    Re: Re:

    Statement reads as follows:

    "False speech is not protected by the Constitution, and TechDirt’s false and malicious speech about Dr. Ayyadurai should receive no legal protection," Ayyadurai said in the statement. "False speech does harm to readers, who are misled by it; it does harm to journalism, which is weakened by it; and it does harm to the subjects of the speech, whose reputations and careers are damaged by it."

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  53. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 4:19pm

    Re: Oh, rats! -- Er, I mean, congRATSulation!

    What? All the legal things still happened behind the scenes, the ruling didn't make those things like... not happen.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  54. icon
    Anonymous Anonymous Coward (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 4:20pm

    Re:

    Don't give him so much credit. People were assholes long before Ayyadurai was born. Not that he isn't creative in his perspective of his own image.

    I suspect he spends a lot of time looking in mirrors and other reflective surfaces, with a big grin on his face. In my opinion, of course.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  55. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 4:22pm

    Re: Oh, rats! -- Er, I mean, congRATSulation!

    Hey my user name is anonymous coward. I therefore invented it and I'm now going to sue you for making me look like an idiot in all my posts.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  56. icon
    Mononymous Tim (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 4:22pm

    Whew...

    Nice work everyone. Congrats!!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  57. icon
    usul_of_arakis (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 4:23pm

    Congratulations Mike and all the legal team.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  58. identicon
    Thad, 6 Sep 2017 @ 4:23pm

    Re:

    I wonder what all those who claimed so confidently and gleefully that he would win have to say now...

    I know exactly what they're going to say: "He'll win on appeal!"

    And then when he loses on appeal, they'll change the subject.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  59. icon
    JoeCool (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 4:32pm

    Re: Excellent news!

    That's the scary part - this lying egomaniac is running for office, and stands a good chance of winning! You KNOW what his campaign rhetoric will be - "I invented email, and anyone who claims differently is a racist!"

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  60. identicon
    Wendy Cockcroft, 6 Sep 2017 @ 4:35pm

    Shiva Will Appeal

    Uh, guys? I'm glad the case has been dismissed but per Ars Technica, TD isn't out of the woods yet: Shiva plans to appeal. https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2017/09/judge-dismisses-libel-lawsuit-filed-by-self-proclaimed-e -mail-inventor/

    It's a win for the First Amendment now but this is not the last we've heard of it. Good luck, Techdirt.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  61. icon
    Anonymous Anonymous Coward (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 4:40pm

    Re: Re: Re:

    So says Ayyadurai's lawyer, which he is paid to do. Nothing says he believes what his case said.

    If lawyers needed to believe what their clients tell them, no one would ever get a defense lawyer, guilty or not.

    This being a civil case, the lawyer only needs to know that he won't be instantly laughed out of court (which is close to what happened here) because there might be something there, and can the client pay. The lawyer does not need to believe in the case.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  62. identicon
    Thad, 6 Sep 2017 @ 4:41pm

    Re: Re: Excellent news!

    That's the scary part - this lying egomaniac is running for office, and stands a good chance of winning!

    I don't know that I'd call polling at second-place in a primary for a nomination against an incumbent polling at 60% "a good chance of winning."

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  63. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 4:41pm

    Re: Oh, rats! -- Er, I mean, congRATSulation!

    So where's that apology for being demonstrably wrong? And an apology for all the Pretoria gloating. Come on be the big man you say you are and do your mea culpa.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  64. icon
    That One Guy (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 4:42pm

    Re: Re: Re:

    A argument that is nicely undercut by the judge not buying any of it, and when assertions of 'false speech'(is that the new 'fake news'?) and malice doesn't even survive a motion to dismiss, where the plaintiff has all the advantages, you know it's laughably weak at best.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  65. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 4:44pm

    Re: Shiva Will Appeal

    "I'll get you next time Masnick... next time!"

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  66. identicon
    Thad, 6 Sep 2017 @ 4:44pm

    Re: Shiva Will Appeal

    Unfortunate but expected.

    I don't think the case is any likelier to succeed on appeal, but winning in court was never the goal; this was always a nuisance suit to retaliate against a critic. Sorry, but not surprised, to hear that Techdirt will have to spend more time and money dealing with this.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  67. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 4:47pm

    Re: Re: Excellent news!

    A very good chance? Realistically, this doofus is running as an R, is endorsed by Curt Schilling in a state that, despite its governor, is still very much blue against a highly popular incumbent. He makes about as much noise in the election as a mouse's fart.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  68. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 4:49pm

    "The case has been dismissed and the judge rejected Ayyadurai's request to file an amended complaint."

    Does that mean it was dismissed with prejudice?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  69. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 4:50pm

    Re: Re: Re: Oh, rats! -- Er, I mean, congRATSulation!

    You're up to bargaining. I suspect we can have you up to acceptence by close of business Friday.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  70. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 4:50pm

    Re: Re: Oh, rats! -- Er, I mean, congRATSulation!

    Pre trial*

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  71. identicon
    DOlz, 6 Sep 2017 @ 4:51pm

    Re: I was having a bad day till I read this ..

    Bob Murray is above the age of consent, so its always legit to say “Fuck you Bob Murray”.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  72. icon
    Toom1275 (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 4:59pm

    Pages 19-21 seem to contain, in my not-a-lawyer opinion, the most important part of the judge's reasoning:

    "The articles at issue provide all of the relevant fact on which defendants rely in reaching the conclusion that plaintiff's claim is false."

    [...]

    "Not every article at issue fully explains the factual basis for the conclusion that plaintiff's claim is false. However, the articles that do not provide a full explanation refer to, and often provide hyperlinks to, the articles that do. Furthermore, as plaintiff has recognized, the articles should be viewed together and are each relevant context for the others."

    [...]

    "By providing the full factual basis for his opinion, the articles cannot reasonably be interpreted to suggest that the author had information about plaintiff's claim that was not accessible to others."

    [...]

    "Furthermore, and significantly, it appears that the core underlying facts are not disputed."

    [...]

    "In addition, plaintiff has not challenged the accuracy of the factual statements relied upon in reaching the conclusion that his claim is false.

    [...]

    "Thus, while the complaint challenges the conclusions drawn from the available facts, it does not challenge the underlying facts themselves."

    [...]

    "In short, the articles disclose the non-defamatory facts on which they rely; make clear that the conclusions drawn from those facts are simply an interpretation of them; and do not rely on other, undisclosed and potentially defamatory facts that are not available to others."

    [...]

    "Furthermore, by providing hyperlinks to the relevant information, the articles enable readers to review the underlying information for themselves and reach their own conclusions. See Riley, 292 F.3d at 289. Accordingly, the statements are not actionable. [bold added]

    [end of quotations]

    That part, I think, establishes that nothing published on Techdirt was defamatory in the first place.

    And even if Ayyadurai were to try to prop up his proposed appeal by shoveling in lies about the factual sources Mike's articles were based on, it would do nothing to change the situation. This ruling clearly reiterates that merely providing one's conclusions based off of disclosed facts regardless of how much hyperbolic language is used to do so, is not defamation. Ayyadurai would have to attempt to argue that not only are a few decades of factual record from multiple independent and unbiased sources false, but he would also have to prove that Mike knew his sources were false when he wrote the articles and decided to use them anyway. While Ayyadurai may believe any history of email he hasn't wormed his way into is false, a reasonable and knowledgeable person would not, and I don't see one scintilla of evidence that Mike was thinking "well these guys are total liars but I'll quote them in my articles because fuck Shiva." And no, Shiva, your hallucinations about Mike's motivations don't count as evidence.

    On a final note, the judge's statement that "a settlement is not a direct reflection of the merits of a claim" is something that bears repeating often, not just in this case, or even just for defamation cases, but also in copyright/patent/porn trolling cases as well.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  73. icon
    That One Guy (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 5:04pm

    Re:

    Don't believe so, I think all that means is that the judge ruled on the current case presented and dismissed it, rather than allowing Shiva's team to amend the complaint and requiring the judge to decide whether or not the amended complaint was also justified in being dismissed.

    Funny thing though, reading the ruling it sounds like the 'amended' complaint was completely lacking in substance, making it basically the same filing, just slightly changed, such that dismissing this one is dismissing both.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  74. icon
    Anonymous Monkey (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 5:11pm

    Re: Re: Shiva Will Appeal

    more like...

    "I'll get you Masnick.. and your little dog..er... blog too!"

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  75. identicon
    TripMN, 6 Sep 2017 @ 5:12pm

    Just heard the news

    I was on a transatlantic flight today and just landed. Saw this on my news feed before I had a chance to come to TD and was so happy this thing was shot down. Hopefully this is the end of this ordeal.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  76. icon
    Anonymous Monkey (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 5:15pm

    WooT!

    Congratulations!!!!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  77. identicon
    Zem, 6 Sep 2017 @ 5:16pm

    Inc New T-Shirt

    so like can you now make a "I didn't invent email" t-shirt and put it up in the store?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  78. identicon
    dormito, 6 Sep 2017 @ 5:18pm

    Congratulations. If you'll pardon my ignorance: Does he still have a right to appeal this decision, or is this issue over for you?

    Also I hope that the cost(not just monetary) of this litigation will not have a lasting negative impact on Techdirt's ability to operate (and provide another small corner of sanity :p ).

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  79. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 5:20pm

    Re: Re: Excellent news!

    We need to make sure he doesn't win.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  80. identicon
    ryuugami, 6 Sep 2017 @ 5:26pm

    Congratulations! This was a wonderful news to start my day with!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  81. icon
    Ryunosuke (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 5:28pm

    Re: Re: Re:

    Let's let him go ahead with that.

    We can then apply that to politicians in general, but more specifically the current POTUS administration! :)

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  82. icon
    bobmorning (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 5:28pm

    Congrats, best investment I ever made

    I donated to your fund and I'm so glad to hear of your win.

    I pray I never have to come to you for help....

    Bless you.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  83. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 5:32pm

    Re: Dumb question - how did he get the copyrights?

    He was a student at the time.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  84. icon
    Stephen T. Stone (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 5:44pm

    Two things.

    One: Congratu-fucking-lations on winning this.

    Two: SUCK IT, SHIVA.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  85. identicon
    Pixelation, 6 Sep 2017 @ 5:45pm

    Congratulations! Woot!

    Glad to see it!

    Other new T-shirt:
    "I invented Shiva Ayyadurai, someone please shoot me"

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  86. icon
    Stephen T. Stone (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 5:51pm

    Re: Shiva Will Appeal

    He can appeal; that doesn’t mean he stands a chance in hell of winning, though. The judge in this case seems to have dismantled both his original suit and the attempt to amend it, so an appeal at this point seems like an attempt to further drain Techdirt of resources and win by attrition.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  87. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 5:52pm

    I hope you bought your lawyers a nice congratulatory dinner...

    Congrats to Techdirt and to the lawyers for arguing the case successfully!

    Keep up the good work, both in the courtroom and on the website!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  88. icon
    Anonymous Anonymous Coward (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 5:53pm

    Re: Re: Shiva Will Appeal

    Maybe one of the lawyers here will know: Is there any chance an appeals court could uphold the dismissal yet also reverse the trial court judges denial of the California SLAPP issue?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  89. icon
    JoeCool (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 5:55pm

    Re: Re: Re: Excellent news!

    It's still early, and he's shown he's not just willing to lie in court, but to play the race card at every turn. Most elections turn dirty in the end, and he's very willing to get as dirty as you can. Remember the general rule of thumb - he who slings the most mud, wins.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  90. icon
    Stephen T. Stone (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 5:59pm

    Re: Re:

    Any amended complaint would have to provide facts that could counter the assertions made by the Techdirt articles. Since Shiva and Harder could not do that, the judge did not allow them to amend the claim.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  91. icon
    Johan (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 5:59pm

    Congratulations on the solid win! May the inevitable appeal be stricken even quicker!


    Happy day for free speech!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  92. icon
    That One Guy (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 6:00pm

    Re: Re: Shiva Will Appeal

    The judge in this case seems to have dismantled both his original suit and the attempt to amend it, so an appeal at this point seems like an attempt to further drain Techdirt of resources and win by attrition.

    He was never winning on the merits, so it's hardly a surprise that he would continue with the attrition tactic. One would hope that any judge that might be presented with his appeal will take a good look at this current ruling and see his attempt to silence/punish TD as just that, and act accordingly.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  93. icon
    Stephen T. Stone (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 6:05pm

    Re: Oh, rats! -- Er, I mean, congRATSulation!

    Eat all of the shit, Shiva.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  94. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 6:11pm

    Obligatory response below:

    Hey Hamilton - did Melania Trump tell you this would happen in a dream?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  95. identicon
    gpp, 6 Sep 2017 @ 6:14pm

    Congratulations! Money well spent.

    I didn't know this guys was running for senate, so I go to his campaign page and find this: "Defeat #FakeIndian Elizabeth Warren." Unbelievable. He'll fit right in with the rest of the nut cases.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  96. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 6:35pm

    Re: Oh, rats! -- Er, I mean, congRATSulation!

    Sucks to be you, doesn't it? You'll just have to keep visiting a site... which you hate...

    How does your brain operate after so many logic bombs?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  97. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 6:39pm

    wonderful news. very, very pleased. the fight must go on to stop this sort of abuse of the system.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  98. icon
    Alphonse Tomato (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 6:48pm

    Re: Re: Excellent news!

    A good chance of winning?

    Nah, the pool of people who would be his supporters against Elizabeth Warren is not going to be favorable to candidates who (if they aren't white) complain about racism. Nor does Shiva sound like somebody anyone would want to have a beer with, he sounds like a spoiled brat with a sense of entitlement. And the saner ones are going to be saying "what does that have to do with cutting taxes and getting the government off my back?", unless Boston gets clobbered by a Force 5 hurricane (in which case, they'll be standing in line for govt aid).

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  99. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 6:49pm

    Well yee-freakin-haw folks! I'm so happy that this is over for you guys.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  100. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 7:08pm

    Re:

    He would have to prove an entire alternate reality at this point to not be legally found to be full of shit.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  101. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 7:09pm

    Re:

    The lawyers were awesome... but their firm name sounds like the name of either a book-only Star Wars character, or a shounen anime character ;)

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  102. icon
    JoeCool (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 7:16pm

    Re: Re: Re: Excellent news!

    Oh, he'd be facing Warren? That's different - he hasn't got a prayer. :)

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  103. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 7:43pm

    Congratulations on the victory! Since it was dismissed at an early stage meant you didn't have to go through a full trial. Is there a chance of an appeal or is this the end of it?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  104. icon
    Discuss It (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 8:20pm

    I'll bet...

    I'll bet that since they didn't post anything after this that they all went out for a pint. Big heads tomorrow!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  105. icon
    Anonymous Anonymous Coward (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 8:24pm

    Re: I'll bet...

    I was just thinking the same thing. Anyone live close enough to drop off a case of aspirin at Floor 64 early tomorrow?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  106. icon
    trollificus (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 8:25pm

    Re: Re: Re:

    "...it doesn't look very good for him and/or his lawyer."

    Well, it looks like billable hours to his legal firm, so, no problem there.

    Anyway, congrats on the win. Just wondering how this never got to the part where it became relevant to the case that he IS delusional, IS a liar and IS a race-baiting reprobate. That should all be put on public record somewhere, I think.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  107. icon
    Roger Strong (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 8:25pm

    Re: Re:

    UPDATE 6:15pm ET: Charles Harder, Ayyadurai's attorney, e-mailed Ars a statement on behalf of his client, saying that Ayyadurai would be appealing the ruling.

    It takes mere dishonesty to claim other peoples' inventions as your own. But it takes a special blend of stupidity, self-denial, dishonesty and arrogance to do it for an invention whose real development is well documented, AND to keep doing it for years after your lies are publicly shot down.

    That special blend makes for lucrative clients for dishonest attorneys to loot.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  108. icon
    Stephen T. Stone (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 8:27pm

    Re:

    Ayyadurai’s lawyer said they will appeal the ruling. I imagine that if the appeal fails, said failure will be the end of the matter.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  109. icon
    Roger Strong (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 8:29pm

    Re: Re: Shiva Will Appeal

    "And I would have gotten away with it if it weren't for those meddling... well, anyone capable of doing 30 seconds of research on the matter."

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  110. icon
    Roger Strong (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 8:36pm

    Re: Re:

    Cannot confirm. I got my Oculus Rift on Thursday. And set up a virtual desktop with a web browser on Friday.

    Turns out he's full of shit in alternate/virtual reality too.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  111. icon
    trollificus (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 8:45pm

    Re: Oh, rats! -- Er, I mean, congRATSulation!

    You comments are available, and considering they have about as much value as the "Click here to see how I earn $3487.32 per week!" posts that are so ubiquitous on the internet, I appreciate the option to pass over them.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  112. identicon
    kallethen, 6 Sep 2017 @ 8:50pm

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:

    It did in a way. It was yet another burden that they had to handle. Would Hogan's suit have ended Gawker if there were no other lawsuits for them to worry about? Probably, but the extra pressure ensured it.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  113. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 8:50pm

    Re:

    He has the right to appeal, and word is he is appealing.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  114. icon
    David (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 8:51pm

    Re: Dumb question - how did he get the copyrights?

    He copyrighted his EMAIL code. Which is completely legit thing to do. However, he conflates getting the copyright with proof that his code is the first.

    We can each write an email program today and they are all copyrighted. Thus his claim is BS and clearly from someone of a lower caste (snort).

    He doesn't understand how copyright works, much like he doesn't understand that the RFC were the basis of the internet and email protocols came from them. In fact, if you wanted to be funny, you could write anything down labeling them all as EMAIL and be perfectly valid even if they are pictures of dicks. Or Shiva.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  115. icon
    trollificus (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 8:51pm

    Re: Re: Shiva Will Appeal

    Well, if this is also draining Shivas' resources that might otherwise go towards his political ambitions, it cuts both ways.

    Also, fingers crossed that he ends up paying the TD legal fees. That would be a wonderful reward for his persistence, aight?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  116. identicon
    kallethen, 6 Sep 2017 @ 8:52pm

    Re: Re: Re:

    I would have been surprised if he didn't appeal.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  117. icon
    trollificus (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 8:57pm

    Re:

    Our legal system seldom closes off avenues for lawyers to make money. Just sayin'...

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  118. icon
    Dave Cortright (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 9:05pm

    Please write another article about how Shiva didn't invent email

    In fact, you should write one every week. Just like Bruce Schneier has his Friday squid blog post, you should have a weekly "Shiva STILL didn't invent email" post. You could crowdfund some of the writing. I'd pay $20 to get a particularly purple descriptor published:

    Shiva—who even narcissists refer to as a completely delusional, self-absorbed waste of his constituent atomic elements…

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  119. icon
    Karl (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 9:06pm

    Re: Excellent news!

    Here's a fun little fact: He was an invited speaker at the so-called "Free Speech Rally" here in Boston.
    https://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/2017/08/14/senate-candidate-plans-address-free-speech-rally -common/CzFnJ4c4u1wOjojtdeLUzM/story.html

    You may wonder, "why would the organizers of a free speech rally invite someone who is so clearly anti-free speech?" Well, because it was pretty transparently using "free speech" as a cover for another alt-right rally, and Ayyadurai is quickly becoming the alt-right's token minority representative.
    http://www.bostonmagazine.com/news/article/2017/07/09/shiva-ayyadurai/

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  120. identicon
    FM Hilton, 6 Sep 2017 @ 9:24pm

    Appeals

    He can appeal all he wants-the rule of thumb is that the next judge to see it will have the ruling of the previous court and all the paperwork from that.

    He has to come up with another set of lies to set it up with. I'm sure he'll be creative.

    Judges don't usually like to go against one another, and if he keeps this kind of thing up, he can get cited for wasting the court's time with a 'frivolous and unmerited' appeal based on a case that the previous judge had patiently and carefully explained was a total waste of his time, too.

    The only people getting anything out of this will be the lawyers. Their fees will depend on churning out the paperwork.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  121. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 6 Sep 2017 @ 9:31pm

    Congratulations!

    It is excellent news. I would have been very sad if Techdirt had lost this fight. Most of us had no doubt that you all deserved to win, but you never know anymore.
    You are probably and understandably out to celebrate, but it is still kind of sad that you are. It means that this great burden has been lifted that threatened to destroy your life and work, but in a case like this, it never should have become such a burden in the first place.
    It should have been something for you to tell your pals to have a laugh - "You know what this guy tried to do?" and not feel like "Holy cow... we just dodged a bullet here".

    Despite the negativity in this post, my day got better as well from this news. So may you celebrate into the morning and suffer no hangovers.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  122. icon
    That One Guy (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 9:51pm

    Re: Re: Excellent news!

    A banner beaming “Shiva 4 Senate: Be the Light,” complete with a torch, is plastered on the side of his vehicle. Neatly dressed in a white shirt with French cuffs and a gold-colored tie, Ayyadurai presses play, flings open the doors, and—to an audience consisting of myself and his three assistants—pumps his fist to the music in the otherwise quiet lot.

    Oh yeah, that is exactly the sort of person who should be in government... I'm not sure if I should be laughing or feeling sad that he was apparently so eager to give a good 'first impression' that he went through that song and (almost literal) dance for four people.

    At the front of the room, the de facto emcee asks Ayyadurai how to pronounce his last name. “Like, ‘I adore you,’” he replies. Then the former MIT lecturer begins his stump speech like a classroom lecture. “I want to start off by asking everyone, how many of us really want to beat Elizabeth Warren?” Every hand in the room shoots up. “Can we use weapons?” shouts the woman sitting next to me, both arms high above her head. “You said beat her.

    Ayyadurai doesn’t flinch—probably because his candidacy is rooted in the same right-wing bluster that’s made Breitbart News a household name and catapulted Donald Trump to the White House.

    And that is just all sorts of disturbing. If that's the kind of person he's trying to garner support from I dearly hope they are in the minority in that state.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  123. icon
    That One Guy (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 9:58pm

    Re: Re:

    You'd like to think so, but I'm honestly not sure if his ego and the self-image he seems to have built up would allow him to drop it.

    I imagine the 'best case scenario' will have him drop the legal angle as not getting him anywhere and moving back to 'just' whining about that pesky 'history' and how clearly anyone who disagrees with him is doing so because they're racists who just can't stand the idea of a 'darkie' having 'invented' email.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  124. identicon
    Thad, 6 Sep 2017 @ 9:59pm

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Excellent news!

    Remember the general rule of thumb - he who slings the most mud, wins.

    Might I suggest another rule of thumb: Republicans don't win Senate seats in Massachusetts. The last time one did, it was because a long-serving senator died of a brain tumor, the Democratic nominee to replace him ran a truly terrible campaign, and it was at the outset of a year that would prove to be massively Republican-leaning -- and even then, the Republican victor in question won by less than five points and was voted out in less than two years. (The last time before that that a Republican won one of Massachusetts' Senate seats was 1972.)

    Even assuming Ayyadurai wins the primary, he'll be going up against one of the most popular Democratic senators in the country, in one of the most Democratic states in the country, in a midterm election where the President is an extremely unpopular Republican.

    There is a chance he'll win -- never say never, 2016 proved that -- but I'm not going to call it a good chance.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  125. identicon
    the ghost of Raymond Tomlinson, 6 Sep 2017 @ 10:12pm

    shiva

    gosh darn it, I got some Siva on my shoes going through the rye...

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  126. icon
    timlash (profile), 6 Sep 2017 @ 11:02pm

    Great News!

    Congrats to Mike and the entire Techdirt team!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  127. identicon
    Indian IT PTSD Survivor, 6 Sep 2017 @ 11:35pm

    Good show old Techdirt chaps.

    Been rooting for you guys. Congrats, and thanks for taking a stand for free speech. May you be blessed with a relative drought of libel-induced stress for as long as possible.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  128. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 12:09am

    And on seventh day they rested.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  129. icon
    GristleMissile (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 12:14am

    HOORAY!

    CONGRATULATIONS!

    Now to shit on that fraud's senate run...

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  130. icon
    bosson (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 12:21am

    Thank You!

    Its wonderful that you got trough this b.s., so that we can continue to read your awesome reporting on things that really matter. You deserve the best.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  131. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 12:28am

    Celebrate

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  132. identicon
    David, 7 Sep 2017 @ 1:00am

    Not a win for free speech

    as long as there are legal costs to be paid of which the court costs are a minor fraction.

    Anti-SLAPP laws are really only a fig leaf (not that they would be a bad idea): "loser pays" should become the rule at least for cases that are so clear that they should not even have required a court, and of course with limits in billable costs either way, like it is done in civilized countries with "loser pays" rules.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  133. icon
    sciamiko (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 1:02am

    Well done!

    You deserve this win.

    I come here because you report based on verifiable information, and provide considered opinions.

    Keep doing that.

    s.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  134. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 1:09am

    Re: Re: Re: Shiva Will Appeal

    >Well, if this is also draining Shivas' resources that might otherwise go towards his political ambitions

    Unless someone is funding him to try and do a Gawker on Techdirt.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  135. icon
    PACook (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 1:18am

    This is a great victory for not just for Techdirt, but for all 1A advocates. I'm so very thrilled that this ridiculous SLAPP case was dismissed. As "sciamiko" says, we come here cuz Techdirt provides well researched reporting. I will continue to support Techdirt and any deserving Internet "voice" in the anti-SLAPP fight. Well DONE! Kudos to legal team and glad our modest contributions helped.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  136. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 1:23am

    Re: Re: Re:

    >"False speech does harm to readers, who are misled by it; it does harm to journalism, which is weakened by it; and it does harm to the subjects of the speech, whose reputations and careers are damaged by it."

    So says every scam artists when their scam is revealed, because it damages their ability to continue the scam.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  137. This comment has been flagged by the community. Click here to show it
    icon
    MyNameHere (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 1:26am

    Congrats Etc

    Congrats to the whole Techdirt team for dodging a bullet, and a reasonably well aimed one at that. You should count yourselves very lucky that you ended up in front of a judge who was willing to review the claims and decide before sending you to trial. it's not unusual for this sort of case to go that way.

    That said, perhaps some lessons could be learned from all of this. The most important one is that mockery and taunting is not the best way to get things done. You can take the time to figure out the billable hours on one of these things, and consider it carefully before you go down the same road again. Even if you keep winning, it can get very expensive to get there.

    As for the mythical question for anti-SLAPP, I wish you luck. The power of anti-SLAPP is perhaps a little too strong at times, and I would not be shocked to see it challenged as a legal concept at some point in the future. You may think of it as a free speech utopia, but it may not work out quite that way.

    So keep up the good work, cut out the pointless nastiness, and FFS fix the flagging system, it sucks!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  138. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 1:36am

    Re: Congrats Etc

    _mockery and taunting is not the best way to get things done_

    Do you... read the things you post? Anyone can look up your post history. It's not particularly flattering.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  139. This comment has been flagged by the community. Click here to show it
    identicon
    moderation domination, 7 Sep 2017 @ 1:50am

    moderation of black indian slave liars

    stop moderating posts of black indian liars who lie like black indian liars. all black indian liars are totally black indian liars of liars. the liars.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  140. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 2:06am

    Great news! Good on ya!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  141. icon
    Narcissus (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 2:30am

    Congrats!

    I just wanted to give my heartfelt congratulations!

    A world without Techdirt would be a bleaker place so I'm happy we're not venturing into that alternative timeline.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  142. icon
    Stephen T. Stone (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 2:45am

    Re: Congrats Etc

    The most important one is that mockery and taunting is not the best way to get things done.

    When a person has proven themselves worthy of mockery, letting them go unscathed seems like dereliction of duty.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  143. icon
    MyNameHere (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 2:46am

    Re: Re: Congrats Etc

    I disagree with people. I tell them what I think. I don't taunt or mock people randomly for fun. Mostly I point out that certain people (like PaulT) are a bit daft.

    Go look at my post history - and look at why I posted. You might see what taunting and mockery looks like (and good job yourself on that!)

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  144. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 2:58am

    Re: Re: Re: Congrats Etc

    Uh huh. I looked, and my opinion hasn't changed. It seems you have a personal beef with other posters, especially when called out on inaccuracy.

    What was the phrase? Physician heal thyself?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  145. identicon
    Nop, 7 Sep 2017 @ 3:23am

    Congratulations!

    Great to see the lying fuckweasel Shiva Ayyadurai get the slapping down he deserved for his egregious bullshit.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  146. icon
    cKarlGo (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 3:40am

    Is a douchebag...

    and a charlatan and a liar still a douchebag and a charlatan and a liar after his nuisance lawsuit dismissed?

    Is he still a douchebag and a charlatan and a liar now that everyone with access to Google knows to avoid him either for employment or business dealings?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  147. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 3:52am

    Re: Re: Re: Congrats Etc

    So your comment in the Al Jazeera thread isn't taunting or mocking:

    I love people like you. Poor readers, and even poorer at snark. You make Leigh look like a pro!

    https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20170830/12084138115/al-jazeera-gives-voice-to-voiceless-killi ng-news-comments.shtml#c1700

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  148. icon
    Jajo (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 4:02am

    Congratulations!

    I am so happy - both for You and for me(us), your reader(s).

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  149. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 4:13am

    Re: Re: Dumb question - how did he get the copyrights?

    Is that what they call dick pics now? Shiva?

    Look at my boyfriends Shiva


    It does sound better!
    I assume Shivan is groomed?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  150. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 4:22am

    Re: Re: Re:

    > TechDirt’s false and malicious speech about Dr. Ayyadurai

    I wonder if Techdirt could sue Ayyadurai now.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  151. identicon
    AngryPrimate, 7 Sep 2017 @ 4:44am

    Re:

    nothing wrong with belated birthday presents. I do it all the time.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  152. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 4:48am

    This is really good to hear. I was real hopping he would not prevail again.

    You win some, you lose some but if you had to choose which one of those to win, I think you got the good end of the stick.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  153. icon
    Mark B (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 4:53am

    Congratulations Mike. This is fantastic news.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  154. icon
    Doug (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 5:09am

    Costs

    So, did our support cover the costs, or are you behind?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  155. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 5:24am

    Re: Re: Re: Excellent news!

    That's way too closer of a chance than he deserves. Don't forget about what people said about Hillary vs Trump's possible outcomes early on.

    "He'll never be nominated"

    And then he was.

    "He'll never be president"

    And then the world weeped.

    The moment you underestimate the power of a sociopathic imbecile to get himself elected is the moment you open the door for allowing sociopathic imbeciles to be elected.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  156. icon
    MyNameHere (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 5:26am

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Congrats Etc

    I replied to someone who attacked me in the same tone and manner they did. I didn't start it, but clearly I ended it. After that, you can see someone trying to troll some more and failing.

    Perhaps you might consider that what you are doing right now is trolling as well, and certainly and totally 100% off topic?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  157. icon
    DannyB (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 5:43am

    I wish you could recover your costs

    I wish you could move to get the costs of this pointless costly lawsuit. He knew, or should have known, before filing that there was no substance to his complaint.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  158. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 6:01am

    I hope this Shiva person gets all the publicity and notoriety for the liar that he is.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  159. icon
    XcOM987 (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 6:10am

    Re: Please write another article about how Shiva didn't invent email

    Noooo,

    I would go one better, every friday write a new post, about something else that Shiva didn't invent, something like this:

    How Shiva didn't invent Microsoft
    How Shiva didn't invent Outloook
    How Shiva didn't invent Cars
    How Shiva didn't invent Water
    How Shiva didn't invent IBM

    Something like that would be much better.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  160. icon
    Karl (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 6:20am

    Re: Re: Re: Excellent news!

    Yeah, this quote is pretty revealing too:

    > The Establishment creates and funds groups like Antifa, KKK and Black Lives Matter with the aim of dividing everyday poor black and white Americans.

    I'm not sure which is more laughable, the false equivalency of comparing Antifa or BLM with the KKK, or the notion that he thinks they're *created and funded* by the people in power.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  161. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 6:49am

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Congrats Etc

    You may feel you ended it but you definitely tried taunting, which you claim you don't do when, in fact, you do that a lot. And yes, I'm trolling you. If you have a problem with that, maybe you should stop trolling every post you show up in.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  162. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 6:58am

    Re:

    "I hope this Shiva person gets all the publicity and notoriety for the liar that he is."

    Well that is probably partly why he did it. He was running for office. My hope is that a counter suite for damages is in the works, and that other SLAPP victems of this guy will now pile on.

    It is my belief that he was probably acting as proxy for other interests in this matter. It would be nice to make him squeal and find out who was actually backing this litigation. My guess is it is some kind of quid pro quo for political donations. Probably a telecom.

    The cats paw parable comes to mind.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  163. icon
    profssrfink (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 7:00am

    yes!

    all I have to say is fuck yea! Glad this asshole is dismissed. Long live Tech Dirt!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  164. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 7:04am

    Re: Inc New T-Shirt

    "I (also) didn't invent email!"

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  165. identicon
    Paul Resnikoff, 7 Sep 2017 @ 7:26am

    Important Victory

    Mike, congratulations to you and the team for prevailing. You have always advanced the interests of free speech and journalistic integrity. And despite the draining nature, this was a victory well fought, and importantly won. It's a 'reverse chilling effect' for journalism.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  166. identicon
    Anon, 7 Sep 2017 @ 7:29am

    Better way...

    In Canada, most of the time barring unusual circumstances - the losing party must pay the winner's (reasonable) legal bill. This makes filing lawsuits a much less trivial business. I suggest the USA adopt this standard, instead of making legal costs the rule rather than the exception.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  167. icon
    Gwiz (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 8:13am

    Congrats.

    I hope the appeal gets tossed quickly so you can put this all behind you.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  168. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 8:16am

    Re: Re: Dumb question - how did he get the copyrights?

    I don't think you or the other poster understand the point Eric is making.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  169. icon
    JustMe (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 8:25am

    Keep fighting the good fight guys

    We need you!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  170. identicon
    Thad, 7 Sep 2017 @ 8:30am

    Re: Appeals

    I'm sure he'll be creative.

    Nah. He's been at this a year and a half and still hasn't come up with anything better than "false speech is not protected."

    It's not about winning the case on its merits. It's about doing financial harm to his critics.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  171. This comment has been flagged by the community. Click here to show it
    identicon
    Vijay, 7 Sep 2017 @ 8:30am

    Race is Everything

    Gentleman / Ladies,
    This appears to be a forum of all white people. I can tell by the tone. What you fail to understand is that despite the workings of Babylon to rebuild that race is everything. The DNA that makes up a person closely resonates with the others of the tribe and that's why voter blocks exist. So other Indians will vote for the "Email Inventor" based on the fact that they can relate to many things about him. They won't listen or care about the email case. After race then ideals comes next and the white Trumpsters & Repubs will then vote for him. The other peoples of color will not vote for him. As usual the real issues (dishonesty / megalomania) don't matter nearly as much as the public hope / perception of the person.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  172. identicon
    Thad, 7 Sep 2017 @ 8:32am

    Re: Re: Congrats Etc

    In every conversation, there are always guys who blame Techdirt for being so mean, as if being mean were illegal, and if they'd only been nicer in their totally accurate criticism of Shiva Ayyadurai, he wouldn't have brought a frivolous, meritless suit against them.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  173. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 8:55am

    Cgrats. Awesome news.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  174. identicon
    Thad, 7 Sep 2017 @ 8:55am

    Re: Race is Everything

    Is that why so many African-Americans voted for Ben Carson?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  175. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 8:56am

    Re: Dumb question - how did he get the copyrights?

    The University he attended may have had a different policy to yours.

    Alternatively, if they had the same policy, it perhaps says a lot that they didn't feel the need to claim copyright on his 'invention'.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  176. icon
    MyNameHere (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 8:58am

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Congrats Etc

    Sorry, not getting dragged into an off topic discussion with a troll.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  177. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 8:58am

    Congrats on the win. Can you give some details as to the financial cost to combat a lawsuit like this? How many hours did you waste trying to defend yourself?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  178. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 9:04am

    Re: Race is Everything

    This appears to be a forum of all white people. I can tell by the tone.

    Hi, Shiva.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  179. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 9:06am

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Congrats Etc

    Typical bully - can throw punches, but can't stand to be on the receiving end.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  180. icon
    DaveL (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 9:08am

    Congratulations everyone at TD.... that's the best news I've heard all week...

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  181. icon
    Roger Strong (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 9:19am

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Congrats Etc

    Give him credit: He's an ISO 9000 Certified bully. His fallacies and false accusations are entirely consistent in every post.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  182. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 9:28am

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Congrats Etc

    Your entire post history is off topic trolling. Maybe take your own advise for once. But we all know you won't and how you hate the first admendment except when it pertains to you. And yet you seem to be impervious to the cognitive dissonance that would lay low a lesser troll.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  183. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 9:29am

    Re: Race is Everything

    <----- WND.com is that way pal. You're lost.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  184. icon
    orbitalinsertion (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 9:32am

    Re: Re: Dumb question - how did he get the copyrights?

    Actually part of his story is that the guy (who still supports Shiva's position) who was his mentor, advisor or something, encouraged him to file for patents and all in the first place.

    Yeah it depends on the institution. Lots of public sector IP and even companies spring right out of uni woodwork.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  185. icon
    orbitalinsertion (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 9:47am

    Re: Re: Re: Congrats Etc

    Tone trolls come in a surprising variety of shapes with a wide array of motivations. There is an environmental nice for tone trolling, it seems.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  186. icon
    orbitalinsertion (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 9:48am

    Re: moderation of black indian slave liars

    the hell?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  187. identicon
    Hans, 7 Sep 2017 @ 9:48am

    Thanks Mike

    Thank you Mike for fighting this fight. I'll bet there were times you wondered whether you were doing the right thing. You were. I'm glad I contributed and hope it helped. If we ever meet, I'd like to buy you a drink.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  188. icon
    orbitalinsertion (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 9:53am

    Re: Race is Everything

    Sure. I've seen otherwise seemingly reasonable people support Ayyadurai's email claims even, just because they relate to him culturally or because they buy his "i'm being held down by the Man" shtick. Of course plenty of people will vote along identity lines. Not buying into the opening pseudosciencey statements there, though.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  189. identicon
    Thad, 7 Sep 2017 @ 10:27am

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Congrats Etc

    I like "tone troll" a lot better than "tone police"; thanks, I'll keep it in mind for next time.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  190. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 10:29am

    Congratulations! I'm posting here, because

    I don't want to use that poseur's invention: email.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  191. icon
    NeghVar (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 10:42am

    Smackdown

    Shiva gave shiva the smackdown

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  192. icon
    Scott S. (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 11:02am

    strong anti-SLAPP laws

    CONGRATULATIONS!!!

    But anti-SLAPP laws that only include legal fees are WEAK, not strong or effective deterrents against deep-pocketed SLAPP suit filers.

    To be truly strong and effective deterrents, anti-SLAPP laws must also include significant punitive damages, including against the attorneys who filed the SLAPP suit.

    The only ones who really benefit from weak anti-SLAPP laws that only include legal fees, are the attorneys on BOTH sides.

    If anti-SLAPP laws include legal fees, plus significant punitive damages against the SLAPP suit filer and their unethical attorneys, SLAPP suits would likely drop by well over 90%.

    But that may never happen since attorneys and judges are so resistant to supporting laws that penalize bad attorneys.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  193. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 11:12am

    I think this was a pretty simple, open and shut case. Seriously, why were lawyers needed?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  194. identicon
    David, 7 Sep 2017 @ 11:34am

    Re: Re: Dumb question - how did he get the copyrights?

    Well yeah, it's like Microsoft copyrighting Windows and then suing Algeria (or whoever) because they claim the Phoenicians (or whoever) invented glass.

    And then somebody from China or India claims they had it 2000 years earlier anyway. Apropos India.

    Probably Email was mentioned in the Upanishads.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  195. icon
    Madd the Sane (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 11:40am

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Shiva Will Appeal

    I wouldn't put it past the cable companies.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  196. icon
    Matthew Cline (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 12:11pm

    Re: Congrats Etc

    You think that if the Techdirt articles on Ayyadurai had left out all the mockery, that while he still would have been pissed off at Techdirt he wouldn't have been pissed off enough to file the lawsuit? If so, what do you base that on?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  197. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 1:11pm

    Does this mean trolls will continue to thrive on Techdirt? :(

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  198. identicon
    JaDe, 7 Sep 2017 @ 1:44pm

    Congrats!

    I'm super happy to hear the news! I'll proudly wear my "Nerd Harder" t-shirt tomorrow.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  199. identicon
    Kronomex, 7 Sep 2017 @ 4:02pm

    Re: Shiva Will Appeal

    Of course he will appeal, his hot air balloon ego has suffered a puncture and he must do something to reinflate it. All this is going to do is to prove, yet agin, he's as big an grudge bearing idiot as everyone thought.

    This is from his senate web site (https://shiva4senate.com/) for 06 September 2017 -

    "Groton Republican Town Committee Meeting

    This month marks the 35th anniversary of the invention of email by Dr. Shiva Ayyadurai. To commemorate this, following the event and separate from the event, he will be offering signed copies of his book, The Future of Email, for those who want to help support his campaign on the campaign bus."

    Strange there's no mention of his court case being thrown out...must have forgotten to mention it. Can't have inconvenient facts and truth cluttering up a confection of fantasy.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  200. icon
    MyNameHere (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 4:11pm

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Congrats Etc

    Again, you can troll if you like, but I am not falling for it. Perhaps your "friends" will realize what you are up to and flag your abusive posts.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  201. icon
    Stephen T. Stone (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 4:13pm

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Congrats Etc

    You’re a bit late for that!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  202. icon
    stderric (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 4:22pm

    Re: Re:

    People were assholes long before Ayyadurai was born.

    Sort of: people have behaved in an asshole-like manner for a long time, but it wasn't until 1980 that Siva came along and developed the feature-set that, when taken as a whole, define a true asshole as one would be recognized in modern society. Furthermore, he copyrighted his bulleted list of these specific, personally assembled and implemented features under the title ASS-HOLE.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  203. icon
    stderric (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 4:38pm

    Re: Re:

    In Siva's case, we really need to stick to 'asking a higher court to review a lower court's decision'. Otherwise, TD'll be inundated with 'He's only appealing in his own mind!' puns. Or was one enough?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  204. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 4:49pm

    Re: Re: I was having a bad day till I read this ..

    Just put a question mark at the end.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  205. identicon
    bob, 7 Sep 2017 @ 5:01pm

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Congrats Etc

    Nope, calling out your BS is not abusive.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  206. icon
    JMT (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 5:59pm

    Re: Re: Re:

    "False speech is not protected by the Constitution..."

    Actually in some cases it is, as any competent lawyer should know.

    "False speech does harm to readers, who are misled by it; it does harm to journalism, which is weakened by it; and it does harm to the subjects of the speech, whose reputations and careers are damaged by it."

    On this I think we all totally agree. I think we can probably also agree that knowingly making false accusations can also do a lot of damage to journalism, reputations and careers, and anybody who makes them should be firmly slapped down both legally and financially.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  207. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 6:51pm

    https://rtb.techdirt.com/products/silence-techdirt/

    https://rtb.techdirt.com/products/silence-techdirt/

    There's already an option if they just want to shut TechDirt up...

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  208. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 6:57pm

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Congrats Etc

    Meanwhile your friend Hamilton seems eerily silent. Almost like he's not just some mere acquaintance of Shiva as he claims. Probably deeply involved in the case at its core.

    Maybe you should write him a few more fantasies of masturbating to Donald Trump. That would cheer him up.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  209. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 7:06pm

    Congratulations!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  210. icon
    Atkray (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 8:15pm

    Gratz Mike et.al.

    Now to get the appeal tossed.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  211. icon
    David Sanger (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 9:36pm

    Congrats

    Congratulations Mike. Glad not to see them get away with it.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  212. icon
    Toom1275 (profile), 7 Sep 2017 @ 9:37pm

    Re: Re: Re:

    That's pretty much what the jusge said too. At the stage of litigation Ayyadurai's case died at, the judge is pretty much required to pretend that the plaintiff's claims are 100% truthful. Even under such conditions, there was no merit to be found.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  213. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2017 @ 11:08pm

    Re: Re: Re:

    So my "I Invented Email" t-shirt is still current, then?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  214. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 8 Sep 2017 @ 1:43am

    Re:

    The intent was never to win, not even with the incredibly tortured definitions of email Ayyadurai later offered up.

    The intent was to make the case so long and drawn out that Techdirt would run out of money before a verdict was reached. This, as with Gawker, would have a chilling effect on others, especially those without a billionaire benefactor, lest they too see their organisation go down the tubes.

    That's why lawyers were needed.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  215. identicon
    William, 8 Sep 2017 @ 1:43am

    Re: Better way...

    That isn't going to happen. I believe one of the main reasons we have so many complicated laws in the US is to keep the lawyers living "high on the hog".

    The winners and losers in lawsuits do not matter, as long as the lawyers get their payola.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  216. identicon
    William, 8 Sep 2017 @ 1:53am

    Re:

    I am assuming that if enough people get tired of the trolls and report them with that red button, that their posts will be removed.

    But if most readers don't do anything except possible respond to the trolls, then nothing is likely to change.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  217. identicon
    Wendy Cockcroft, 8 Sep 2017 @ 2:27am

    Re: Re: Appeals

    There's also the matter of the judge appearing to believe that "who invented email" is a matter of opinion, per the ruling.

    If this does go to appeal, I hope the next judge settles the matter and dismisses the case with prejudice so Shiva can't keep dragging Mike back into court to demand that Techdirt upholds his fantasy.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  218. identicon
    patrick, 8 Sep 2017 @ 8:41am

    Re: strong anti-SLAPP laws

    That's brilliant. Let's threaten people with outrageous costs if they want to bring their constitutionally protected right to a lawsuit.
    Are you also on the side of a soda tax or tobacco tax to make it painfully expensive for people to enjoy a drink or a smoke?
    Monetary deterrents should not be used for things that some people have decided are bad.
    There is always a group of people out there who are looking to be offended by things that are really non of their business.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  219. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 8 Sep 2017 @ 9:06am

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Excellent news!

    Scott Brown didn't so much "win" the seat as he was just a vaguely plausible-looking newbie candidate without much background to define him, and who was in the right place at the right time. That race was Democrat Martha Coakley's to lose and lose it she did, as she assumed it was hers by right of fiat (it had been Ted Kennedy's seat) and her political stance swings center-right (for a Democrat). Almost anyone who ran against her would have won.

    Elizabeth Warren destroyed Brown a couple of years later with her earnest progressive stance. People all over the country adore her, but esp. Massachusetts voters. Republicans try hard to insult her mostly they just call her "Pocahontas" and try to get her to shut up.

    Then, not learning a thing, the Democrats ran Coakley for governor and she ran the same stiff, fake-smile race as before, and lost to Mitt Romney of all people, who would not have won if she'd been just a slightly better candidate.

    When HRC ran, as I watched, I kept thinking, "OMG! Less Coakley!!! More Warren!!!"

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  220. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 8 Sep 2017 @ 9:08am

    Congratulations, TechDirt!

    I only wish Shiva had been forced to foot the bill for your legal defense.

    We need more and stronger SLAPP laws, as Shiva was caught on tape during the Boston rally giving tips to Nazis about how to go about suing news outlets that dare to call them "Nazis".

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  221. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 8 Sep 2017 @ 10:23am

    Re:

    I like how most of Hamilton's recent rants involved comparing Techdirt to Nazis.

    Turns out his hero supports them. Maybe that's why he hasn't showed his face around - either he's too ashamed or his brain overheated from the logic bomb. Probably the latter. Hamilton, by all appearances, seems to be utterly shameless.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  222. identicon
    Thad, 8 Sep 2017 @ 10:45am

    Re: Re: Re: Appeals

    There's also the matter of the judge appearing to believe that "who invented email" is a matter of opinion, per the ruling.

    That's because, legally, it is; that was Techdirt's own legal argument, in fact. Here's from one of their legal filings (pardon the formatting on the copy-paste job):

    The debate over who “invented” email is inherently incapable of objective proof. With respect to email, “‘there seems to be little disagr eement over who wrote what, and approximately when.’” (Compl., Ex. F. at 4 (quoting Tom Van Vleck ).) The argument, instead, “‘is over what to call things.’” (Id.; see also Compl., Ex. E at 2 (o bserving that the origins of email are “not exactly a cut-and-dried case”).) Writers such as Ma snick argue that all of the core features of email were in place by the mid-1970s. Plaintiff and his supporters, by contrast, advocate for a narrow definition of email; they insist that to con stitute email, a program must “contain[] all the features we experience today in every email program ,” and they rely on an 87-item list of features that they say must be satisfied for a prog ram to qualify. (Compl., Ex. D at 7; V.A. Shiva Ayyadurai, Definition of Email , available at http://www.inventorofemail.com/definition_of_email.asp (see Table 2).) It is like a debate over the preci se moment when the civil rights movement began, or a quarrel about the essential at tributes of a perfect cheesecake. These are matters of “personal judgment.” See Gray, 221 F.3d at 248. Neither position can be factually proven; one’s conclusion depends on what one consid ers to be the defining attributes of the matter in question.

    The legal system has no business weighing in on the definition of "e-mail" and determining the moment it was invented; allowing judges to define computer terms is a legitimately terrible idea. The question of who invented e-mail is not one for the law to decide, it's a matter for the court of public opinion.

    What the judge decided is that we can look at Ayyadurai's arguments for why he should be considered the inventor of e-mail, and we can look at Techdirt's arguments for why he shouldn't be, and we can draw our own conclusions; that the question of whether or not Shiva truly invented e-mail is up to our personal judgement, not his legal judgement. That is the correct decision.

    The definition of "e-mail" is subjective; who invented it is therefore a matter of opinion. Techdirt's opinion, based on cited public facts, is that he is not. I agree with Techdirt, and I daresay everybody else in the comments here does too, except the trolls who still insist that Prenda didn't break any laws.

    And the more sites report on this, the more people are going to agree with Techdirt's conclusions, because they cite facts and argue persuasively. That's the marketplace of ideas working the way it's supposed to. It's also what Shiva is most afraid of, and the reason he's trying to intimidate news sites into not criticizing him.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  223. identicon
    Thad, 8 Sep 2017 @ 10:53am

    Re: Re: strong anti-SLAPP laws

    That's brilliant. Let's threaten people with outrageous costs if they want to bring their constitutionally protected right to a lawsuit.

    Anti-SLAPP laws do not affect good-faith lawsuits, only lawsuits that are self-evidently brought to chill free speech. Anti-SLAPP laws do not infringe the constitutional rights of plaintiffs, they protect the constitutional rights of defendants.

    Are you also on the side of a soda tax or tobacco tax to make it painfully expensive for people to enjoy a drink or a smoke?

    What the fuck does that have to do with anything?

    Monetary deterrents should not be used for things that some people have decided are bad.

    That's...an interesting legal theory. So do you think the penalty for parking in a loading zone should be jail time, or should they go straight to execution?

    There is always a group of people out there who are looking to be offended by things that are really non of their business.

    Seriously, what the fuck are you talking about?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  224. This comment has been flagged by the community. Click here to show it
    identicon
    patrick, 8 Sep 2017 @ 1:39pm

    Re: Re: Re: strong anti-SLAPP laws

    Sorry Thad, I didn't mean to upset anyone. Maybe this site is a little too advanced for you, seriously.
    May I suggest a video game chat room might be more to your liking.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  225. icon
    Scott S. (profile), 8 Sep 2017 @ 2:25pm

    Re: Re: Re: strong anti-SLAPP laws

    I second Thad's terrific point-by-point reply!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  226. icon
    Scott S. (profile), 8 Sep 2017 @ 2:35pm

    Re: Re: Re: Re: strong anti-SLAPP laws

    BTW, I wonder if attorneys like Marc Randazza will ever start pushing for anti-SLAPP laws that do more than make sure the attorneys get paid. If an anti-SLAPP attorney truly cares about their clients, shouldn't they be advocating for compensation for the victims of SLAPP suits?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  227. This comment has been flagged by the community. Click here to show it
    identicon
    Dave, 8 Sep 2017 @ 2:48pm

    Re: Re: Re: Re: strong anti-SLAPP laws

    Some people just have too much time on their hands. Lazy people with no job who are content with living in someone else's home, using someone else's electricity and air conditioning, sitting in someone else's chair in their dirty underwear spewing out hate-filled rants. Just to give self-admiration to one who craves attention in their grandiose view of themselves.
    Besides we all know who "Thad"is !!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  228. identicon
    Thad, 8 Sep 2017 @ 2:52pm

    Re: Re: Re: Re: strong anti-SLAPP laws

    Oh, I get it: you're an idiot.

    Blocked.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  229. identicon
    Thad, 8 Sep 2017 @ 3:03pm

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: strong anti-SLAPP laws

    Besides we all know who "Thad"is !!

    Of course everybody knows who I am. I post under my real name. With a link to my blog at the top of each post. If I were trying to hide my identity, that'd be a pretty dumb way of doing it.

    Speaking of dumb ways of trying to hide your identity, I'm guessing you didn't know that we can tell when two posts are written by the same guy because of the icon up above them, huh, "Dave"?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  230. This comment has been flagged by the community. Click here to show it
    identicon
    Dave, 8 Sep 2017 @ 3:07pm

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: strong anti-SLAPP laws

    Wipe your nose Thaddeus! Your getting snot all over mommy's
    computer.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  231. This comment has been flagged by the community. Click here to show it
    identicon
    Steve, 8 Sep 2017 @ 3:17pm

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: strong anti-SLAPP laws

    Do you go by "Thad" just because it is easier for you to remember the spelling or do you actually like it?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  232. identicon
    Thad, 8 Sep 2017 @ 3:28pm

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: strong anti-SLAPP laws

    You're the only guy here who has trouble spelling his own name, Johm.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  233. This comment has been flagged by the community. Click here to show it
    identicon
    Jeff, 8 Sep 2017 @ 4:23pm

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: strong anti-SLAPP laws

    Interesting, Scott and Thad both respond about 11:00am on the 7th and 8th. I guess they both stay up late filling out resumes.
    I can't seem to find Thad's website that he speaks of.
    Maybe it was taken from him Scott or maybe it's just a big coincidence.
    I guess you "guys" can sit around and praise each other if nothing good is on TV.
    Take care,
    Entrepreneurmen

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  234. This comment has been flagged by the community. Click here to show it
    identicon
    Jon, 8 Sep 2017 @ 4:41pm

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: strong anti-SLAPP laws

    You right. I am the only guy here.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  235. icon
    Scott S. (profile), 8 Sep 2017 @ 5:02pm

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: strong anti-SLAPP laws

    Besides being a paranoid troll, you sure must have a lot of extra time on your hands. I have no idea who Thad is or what's up with his website, whatever it is. But I do know this thread is supposed to be about anti-SLAPP laws. And since you're making wild accusations about others, why won't you ever admit who you are or what your website is? I don't know about Thad, but I see no reason to waste anymore time on a troll who's too afraid to come out of the shadows.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  236. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 8 Sep 2017 @ 5:51pm

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: strong anti-SLAPP laws

    I can't seem to find Thad's website that he speaks of.

    Click his name, genius.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  237. identicon
    Fredric L. Rice, 8 Sep 2017 @ 7:24pm

    I was using email since 1972

    When I read that asshole's demands that he invented email, I read it decades ago and I emailed him informing him that he was full of shit and that I had been using email since 1972.

    Now I see that the "doctor" asshole has continued to lie about "inventing email" in 1978 which is pure bullshit.

    I was wire-wrapping my own computers when I was 12 years old, using 4 bit CPUs and television screens for output, back when the DARPANet was not yet opened up for public access. That was before the MSI8080, the Ohio Scientific, Prolog, Datalog, Xerox 820, TRS-80, and everything else in the 6800 / 6802 / Z80 arena started.

    I have been in computer hardware and software -- toggled in using assembly op codes! using toggle switches -- and myself and my fellow Heath kit users sent and received email back in the early 1970s.

    We stored our data on 8 inch floppies and before that on rotating drums -- literally Quaker Oats cardboard plated with magnetizing materials which separate data read and data write heads accessed.

    The ass clown's lies are outrageous, he did not invent email, people like me -- old assholes in our own rights -- were sending emails among ourselves long before that asshole got a commercially-available computer. We made our own, we created our own software.

    By the way, that was before the first "killer application" was ever created, a decade before the first "killer app" -- which was a spreadsheet.

    I'm glad to see that the courts recognize the fact that the lying sack of shit is a lying sack of shit.

    Also by the way: The guy who created the first BBS could not be identified, either, because the dial-up BBS was a world wide effort, it developed over the course of years through several hundred people's work. Email was the same thing, many people developed email which has undergone change over time.

    That was before Planet Connect came on board, LONG before AOL opened up things, long before DARPANet opened up public access.

    My opinions only, and only my opinions, as always.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  238. icon
    Stephen T. Stone (profile), 8 Sep 2017 @ 11:18pm

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: strong anti-SLAPP laws

    Some people just have too much time on their hands. Lazy people with no job who are content with living in someone else's home, using someone else's electricity and air conditioning, sitting in someone else's chair in their dirty underwear spewing out hate-filled rants. Just to give self-admiration to one who craves attention in their grandiose view of themselves.

    Well, we can’t all be like you.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  239. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 9 Sep 2017 @ 5:15am

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Appeals

    and they rely on an 87-item list of features that they say must be satisfied for a program to qualify.

    Has anybody been able to examine at his program to see if it qualifies?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  240. icon
    Tanner Andrews (profile), 9 Sep 2017 @ 6:28am

    Re: Re: Shiva Files Notice of Appeal

    That sounds to me like a suggestion for a cross appeal, on the issue of whether the California anti-SLAPP law should be applied to award fees, where speaker is located in California and speech is uttered in that state.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  241. icon
    Tanner Andrews (profile), 9 Sep 2017 @ 6:33am

    Re: Re: Re: Shiva Will Appeal

    Is there any chance an appeals court could uphold the dismissal yet also reverse the trial court judges denial of the California SLAPP issue

    Sure. The normal vehicle would be that Techdirt files a cross-appeal, raising the issue of whether the Cali anti-SLAPP statute should apply. While it might not, initially, have been worth an appeal to decide the issue, you are already in for an appeal since Mr Email has filed his notice. Someone will have to write a brief anyway.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  242. This comment has been flagged by the community. Click here to show it
    identicon
    dave, 9 Sep 2017 @ 8:28am

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: strong anti-SLAPP laws

    You obvious don't realize that you can start a new profile in a couple of minutes with a different name. Like was done starting a few days ago. But a bit of FireEye tells me they came from the same ip address in the Orangevale/Citrus
    Heights area of Sacramento. Also the house address does not have your name on it. So stop trying to be sly and change your underwear.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  243. This comment has been flagged by the community. Click here to show it
    identicon
    Peter, 9 Sep 2017 @ 8:34am

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: strong anti-SLAPP laws

    I agree completely Stephen. There is no room for Thad or Scott or anyone else when people are trying to seriously discuss important topics.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  244. identicon
    John N., 10 Sep 2017 @ 9:42am

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: strong anti-SLAPP laws

    Anything is better then having to W at a J.
    Right Thad!

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  245. icon
    rick (profile), 10 Sep 2017 @ 5:29pm

    Re: Re: Dumb question - how did he get the copyrights?

    I think what you are saying here is that the University should be the holder of the copyright. Yes?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  246. icon
    Ninja (profile), 11 Sep 2017 @ 6:37am

    Late to the party but I see much less trolling activity here than in past posts. Where are the "Shiva will get you" crew? The silence is deafening.

    Keep rocking TD. If he actually appeals we will keep supporting you.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  247. identicon
    Aaron, 11 Sep 2017 @ 7:25am

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: strong anti-SLAPP laws

    What's the problem with Randazza?
    He's actually done a lot of good for his clients. But let's not forget Randazza and every other attorney are just following the rules that are in place. You seem to want to play both sides of the fence Scott. You personally filed two anti-SLAPP lawsuits against the same company. I don't know the specifics of those lawsuits but you lost them both. Using your way you would be on the hook for 10's of thousands of dollars if not more. As I said I don't know the specifics of your suits but I'm sure it is something you truly believed in. Would you want to be punished just for trying and losing?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  248. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 11 Sep 2017 @ 9:15am

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: strong anti-SLAPP laws

    Marc Randazza was in support of Prenda Law for quite some time. Let that sink in.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  249. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 11 Sep 2017 @ 7:03pm

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: strong anti-SLAPP laws

    What is the W and J? Are we writing in codes now?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  250. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2017 @ 8:15am

    Re:

    It's why I've suspected that "Hamilton" might actually be Shiva. Or at least someone very close, such as Tara Carreon when she posted on behalf of her husband here, trolling the site with her inane babbling.

    Honestly, it would explain a lot.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  251. icon
    Stephen T. Stone (profile), 13 Sep 2017 @ 8:34pm

    Re: Re:

    Certain quirks in the writing voice of “Hamilton” seem familiar to quirks in Ayyadurai’s writing on social media—notably the emphasis on the adjective “American” and the capitalization of almost any noun following it (e.g., “American Inventors”). The attempts to gaslight people here with constant “so [x], right?” questions also mirrors Shiva’s practice of moving the goalposts on his claims during interviews.

    Given how “Hamilton” has not shown up in the comments as of late, I suspect that he was Ayyadurai. I also suspect that he planned to submit all the “mean” replies to him as evidence of further “defamation”. That he could do so—which the judge pointed out in the dismissal ruling—appears to have deterred him from further trolling here.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  252. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 14 Sep 2017 @ 1:27am

    Re: Re: Re:

    Including all the fantasies he has about Massachusetts and his supposed heritage? Simultaneously with his entire shtick about being poor and Indian being the chief reason for his enduring popularity with his fans? Wow, what a two-faced jackass. I can't say I'm surprised, but it still has to be said.

    For the great lawyer that Charles Harder supposedly is, if he didn't stop Shiva (or possibly encouraged him) from posting that garbage to use as evidence, he's even dumber than I'd thought.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  253. identicon
    I.T. Guy, 17 Sep 2017 @ 12:50pm

    Great news Mike & Co. Must feel like a huge weight was lifted.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  254. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 19 Sep 2017 @ 1:07pm

    Re: Re:

    That is because most politicians are lawyers.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  255. identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 19 Sep 2017 @ 1:12pm

    Is there a reason all your pages still have the fundraiser panhandle at the bottom?

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  256. identicon
    chad, 25 Sep 2017 @ 10:14am

    Re: Re: Re: strong anti-SLAPP laws

    Get a profile if your going to have vile responses you punk coward.
    Stick to the child porn sites. They are more your speed.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  257. identicon
    Joe, 6 Oct 2017 @ 7:02pm

    I think Shiva Ayyadurai will win his appeal, and the lawsuit will be reinstated, for the following reasons.

    Shiva Ayyadurai has clearly stated in many places what he means by email when he says he invented email.

    Techdirt will need to show the jury, by a preponderance of evidence, that Ayyadurai was lying when he said that he invented email as he (Ayyadurai) defines email. This is going to be hard. Ayyadurai has made a good case that he did invent what he calls "email".

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  258. icon
    Dan (profile), 7 Oct 2017 @ 6:02pm

    Re:

    Pretty much everything about this is wrong. First, even if the appeal results in a reversal (which is unlikely), the odds are slim that the case ever goes to a jury. Second, if it does, Shiva (not Techdirt) will need to convince the jury, by clear and convincing evidence (not a preponderance), that Techdirt (not Shiva) lied when they said Shiva didn't invent email. That is, Shiva will have to prove, to a high level, that Techdirt knew what they were saying was false, but said it anyway. In order to do that, Shiva will need to prove (also to a high level) that he did invent email, but that's just the start of his burden of proof. And he's the plaintiff, so the burden is squarely on him. And it's unlikely he'll be able to rely on his "email means this highly-specific definition I've invented, not the general system that's been documented as having been around since before I was born."

    You're right about one thing, though: that will be very hard. For Shiva, that is.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  259. icon
    Stephen T. Stone (profile), 10 Oct 2017 @ 12:01pm

    Re:

    In United States defamation cases, the burden of proof lies on the plaintiff. If Shiva wins his appeal and the suit is reinstated, he would still need to prove that Techdirt defamed him. To prove that, he would have to prove that Techdirt made knowingly false statements with reckless disregard for Ayyadurai’s reputation.

    An offer of any such proof would require Ayyadurai to admit facts. Not facts that fit his worldview or facts that fit the claims he made, but facts that impartial observers can look at and agree on being objective facts. (As objective as we can be sure of, anyway.) His claims twist definitions and facts in an attempt to gaslight the ignorant and the foolish. But when he cannot move the goalposts, he cannot win the argument; the dismissal of this case proves as much.

    The historical record of ARPANET and the development of the three major backbone protocols—none of which Ayyadurai was involved or influenced in any way—says he did not invent email as we know it today. Even if he wins a new trial, Shiva Ayyadurai would still need to overcome the best defense to a charge of defamation: the truth.

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]


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