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Ferguson PD Lies About Why It Released Videotape Of Store Robbery, Lies Some More When Confronted With The Facts

from the worst.-wagon-circling.-ever. dept

In the wake of the shooting of Michael Brown, the Ferguson Police made several ill-advised moves. The biggest was the paramilitary force that greeted protests, looking for all the world like a unit flown in from Kabul, followed shortly thereafter by the detainment of several journalists. The decision to withhold the officer's name was also received poorly, but this was complicated by one baffling move -- the release of a store surveillance tape that appeared to show Brown stealing cigarillos from a local store shortly before he was shot dead.

This tape's release was purely self-motivated. Even the Dept. of Justice -- which had stepped in shortly after everything went to hell in Ferguson -- advised against it. The only conceivable reason for the release was a post-facto "justification" of Officer Darren Wilson's decision to shoot an unarmed man several times.

But the Ferguson PD tried to cover up this motivation. Matthew Key at TheBlot has dug into the events surrounding the release of the surveillance tape and found nothing but Ferguson PD lies.

The chief of police for the Ferguson Police Department misled members of the media and the public when he asserted that his hand was forced in releasing surveillance footage that purported to show 18-year-old resident Michael Brown engaged in a strong-arm robbery at a convenience store minutes before he was fatally shot by a police officer.
The tape -- released on the same day the PD belatedly revealed the name of the officer who shot Brown -- was supposedly released as the result of "multiple" FOIA requests from journalists and other citizens.
“We’ve had this tape for a while, and we had to diligently review the information that was in the tape, determine if there was any other reason to keep it,” Jackson said at the press event. “We got a lot of Freedom of Information requests for this tape, and at some point it was just determined we had to release it. We didn’t have good cause, any other reason not to release it under FOI.”
But another FOIA request exposed this claim for what it is. TheBlot used a FOIA request to obtain all FOIA requests sent to the Ferguson PD. And it couldn't find a single one that specifically requested that tape.
Last month, TheBlot Magazine requested a copy of all open records requests made by members of the public — including journalists and news organizations — that specifically sought the release of the convenience store surveillance video. The logs, which were itself obtained under Missouri’s open records law, show only one journalist — Joel Currier with the St. Louis Post-Dispatch — broadly requested any and all multimedia evidence “leading up to” Brown’s death on Aug. 9.
With that lie uncovered, the Ferguson Police decided to double down. A statement issued to TheBlot claimed that multiple other FOIA requests were made orally, due to heavy traffic to the city's website and email server. Possibly believable, but was anyone logging these verbal requests? And could this be where the multiple requests for the surveillance video originated? The answers are "yes," "well, actually no," and "shut up."

The first response:
City of Ferguson attorney Stephanie Karr said that “many requests were made verbally due to the fact that the City’s website and email were down at several points during that week” and that “city personnel cataloged all requests and treated them in the same manner as it would any Sunshine Law request.
So, if they were logged, there'd be some record of a bunch of people asking for the release of the surveillance tape, right? Cue backpedal #1:
Karr responded to a request for comment Saturday afternoon by denying the City of Ferguson had a log of verbal records requests.

“You assume that the Custodian of Records, somehow, logged every single question, statement or request for information, verbal or otherwise, made to every single police officer, city employee, consultant, appointed official or elected official,” Karr told TheBlot by e-mail. “That assumption is, quite simply, wrong and unrealistic.”
Actually, TheBlot didn't "assume" anything. It simply took Karr's first statement at face value. Apparently, everything about the first statement was a lie. On top of that, the Ferguson PD may have violated the Sunshine Law by not logging requests it filled or denied. TheBlot has a request in for the logged verbal FOIA requests and in the meantime notes that the PD is still withholding both the incident report for the shooting (which may not even exist) as well as the incident report for the robbery.

Just a little more evidence pointing towards the unreliability of public officials, especially when caught in the middle of misconduct. Not only has the PD apparently lied about its reasons for releasing the tape, but it continues to withhold information about its involvement in the shooting of Michael Brown. Earlier, it claimed Officer Wilson suffered injuries -- possibly severe -- during his "interaction" with Brown. Those have proven false as well, with Wilson's own post-shooting text messages saying nothing about sustaining an injury as well as citizen video showing Wilson standing around the shooting scene for several minutes without seeking medical attention.

Odds are, no one directly requested this video. The release of the video coincided with the forced release of the officer's name in a blatant attempt to provide justification for his actions. While undoubtedly true that the city's website and email server have been hit pretty hard during the past few weeks, that's no excuse for city employees to fulfill or deny FOIA requests without documentation -- especially when its track record so far shows an urge to bury and obfuscate.


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  • identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 11 Sep 2014 @ 9:25am

    In terms of FOIA shenanigans would this place the Ferguson PD above or below the NYPD and/or CIA?

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • identicon
      Anonymous Coward, 11 Sep 2014 @ 12:14pm

      Re:

      'In terms of FOIA shenanigans would this place the Ferguson PD above or below the NYPD and/or CIA?'

      It would place the Ferguson PD well above the other two organizations. Remember, it took only ONE FOIA request.

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • icon
      btr1701 (profile), 12 Sep 2014 @ 6:59pm

      Re:

      I think it's hilarious how a site that's constantly calling for government transparency and criticizing government agencies for not releasing files and documents is now apparently upset that a government agency released a file because it found it advantageous to do so.

      Apparently the government is only supposed to be transparent when doing so will get them in trouble.

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

      • identicon
        Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2014 @ 11:19pm

        Re: Re:

        But that's the problem. Releasing the tape was subterfuge and misdirection, not transparency. The tape wasn't created by a government agency and it didn't demonstrate any government agent actions. The release was for the purpose of distracting the public from what they're doing or have done. That's not transparency, but quite the opposite.

        reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 11 Sep 2014 @ 9:32am

    Like a lot of police departments across the nation. The more attention is put on it's statements, the less validity they have when exposed to the light of day. What can't be covered up will show this was nothing more nor less than a CYA attempt.

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 11 Sep 2014 @ 9:33am

    These people need to have their power revoked.

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • identicon
    Michael, 11 Sep 2014 @ 9:46am

    You would think that an attorney would have known enough to keep her mouth shut.

    Perhaps this is why the Ferguson PD feels the need to just shoot suspects, the attorneys employed in their district are inept and probably cannot get anyone convicted.

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • icon
    orbitalinsertion (profile), 11 Sep 2014 @ 10:09am

    It's all because FPD is on the smoking-will-kill-you bandwagon. That's why, right?

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 11 Sep 2014 @ 10:14am

    the boy, in my opinion, was murdered and all the PD has done since the shooting is pull as many piles of shit out of the hat as they can think of to justify what happened!! the incident was a disgrace and the officer should be charged with carrying out either murder of unlawful killing or something very similar! and i seem to remember reading something about his 'exemplary service' was far from exemplary after all!
    the whole incident was tragic but it didn't warrant the shooting, let alone killing of an unarmed boy!! since the very beginning, the PD has been involved in a cover up. leaving the boy in the street for 4 hours and denying him the chance of medical help, even if it were too late is deplorable!!

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • icon
    sorrykb (profile), 11 Sep 2014 @ 10:21am

    Reasons

    The only conceivable reason for the release was a post-facto "justification" of Officer Darren Wilson's decision to shoot an unarmed man several times.

    There's another reason. On Thursday, August 14 (the day before the press conference where Ferguson PD released this video), Captain Ron Johnson of the Missouri Highway Patrol had taken over security in Ferguson and adopted (initially) non-confrontational tactics. Protesters and police were peaceful on Thursday evening, which further highlighted -- in a very public manner -- how badly the Ferguson PD had handled everything in the previous week.

    Ferguson police Chief Thomas Jackson was humiliated and felt that his territory was threatened. He released this tape certainly in an attempt to smear Mike Brown, but also knowing it would be a provocation, an insult on top of the many insults his department has piled on this community.

    I fully believe that Chief Jackson released this video as part of a deliberate effort to incite violence and undermine the efforts of community leaders and the fragile detente with outside police agencies, as well as to justify the earlier overreaction by his department.

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • identicon
      Michael, 11 Sep 2014 @ 10:41am

      Re: Reasons

      I think you are giving Chief Jackson way too much credit.

      From his other actions relating to this incident, I don't think he could have put nearly as much thought into this release as you have attributed to him.

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

      • icon
        sorrykb (profile), 11 Sep 2014 @ 11:11am

        Re: Re: Reasons

        Michael wrote:
        From his other actions relating to this incident, I don't think he could have put nearly as much thought into this release as you have attributed to him.

        A fair point. I just figured he'd taken some suggestions from other awful people in his department who said something along the lines of, "That'll show those outsiders..."

        reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • identicon
    RickA, 11 Sep 2014 @ 10:24am

    FOIA request for multimedia

    So there was an FOIA request - it just say "tape" - instead referring to all multimedia.

    That doesn't seem like a lie to me.

    Just saying.

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • icon
      nasch (profile), 11 Sep 2014 @ 10:49am

      Re: FOIA request for multimedia

      So there was an FOIA request - it just say "tape" - instead referring to all multimedia.

      That doesn't seem like a lie to me.


      There was one request, that didn't specify this tape in particular. Now consider the statement: "We got a lot of Freedom of Information requests for this tape". That's a lie.

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

      • identicon
        Michael, 11 Sep 2014 @ 10:55am

        Re: Re: FOIA request for multimedia

        lot informal
        a particular group, collection, or set of people or things.
        "it's just one lot of rich people stealing from another"


        Technically, one is a "lot" - not meaning many of them, just meaning a group or collection which could technically be a single unit.

        She's a lawyer, words only mean what she wants them to mean when explaining the meaning of her own words...

        reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

        • icon
          John Fenderson (profile), 11 Sep 2014 @ 10:58am

          Re: Re: Re: FOIA request for multimedia

          Well, if we're going by informal definitions then "a group" consists of more than one.

          reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

        • icon
          nasch (profile), 11 Sep 2014 @ 11:12am

          Re: Re: Re: FOIA request for multimedia

          Technically, one is a "lot" - not meaning many of them, just meaning a group or collection which could technically be a single unit.

          She's a lawyer, words only mean what she wants them to mean when explaining the meaning of her own words...


          That wasn't a lawyer, it was the chief of police. And regardless of the technical meaning of words, he clearly intended to indicate that there were a large number of requests. The reality is there was one, therefore he intentionally misled his audience*, in other words lied.

          * or he didn't know what he was talking about but just made stuff up anyway, which I could argue is also lying

          reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • identicon
      RickA, 11 Sep 2014 @ 11:42am

      Re: FOIA request for multimedia

      I meant to say "just didn't say 'tape'".

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • icon
    kenichi tanaka (profile), 11 Sep 2014 @ 10:44am

    I wish Techdirt would stop holding up Michael brown like he;s some kind of self appointed saint. You wouldn't hold up a cop killer or a rapist in the same manner. So why would you hold up Michael Brown, a black man who robbed a store, assaulted the store owner and then proclaim Michael Brown as a champion of what's wrong with race relations.

    Perhaps if Michael Brown had never robbed that store owner or assaulted that store owner, then this crap wouldn't have happened in the first place. Michael Brown was nothing more than a thug from the hood who was prompted to rob a store of some cigarettes and then assault the owner of the store.

    In this country, you get arrested and charged with a crime for doing just that. Michael Brown is NOT Rosa Parks. Michael Brown is a thug and I find it disengenuous that another black man, that idiot Eric Holder, is trying to hold Michael brown up like he's some type of fucking saint.

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • icon
      nasch (profile), 11 Sep 2014 @ 10:51am

      Re:

      I wish Techdirt would stop holding up Michael brown like he;s some kind of self appointed saint.

      Can you please provide some quotes from Techdirt that hold him up as saint?

      Perhaps if Michael Brown had never robbed that store owner or assaulted that store owner, then this crap wouldn't have happened in the first place.

      The arrest and confrontation had nothing to do with the theft, and the officer didn't even know about it at the time. So, no.


      In this country, you get arrested and charged with a crime for doing just that.


      Or just shot.

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

      • icon
        ChrisB (profile), 11 Sep 2014 @ 10:57am

        Re: Re:

        My understanding is he didn't know about the theft when he told Brown to get off the street, but did know when he doubled back. He heard it on the radio.

        Brown was shot in the front, and was described by an onlooker as running towards the cop. It is unfortunate, but within the realm of reasonable action by the cop.

        reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • identicon
      Michael, 11 Sep 2014 @ 10:51am

      Re:

      Ok, I'll bite.

      I wish Techdirt would stop holding up Michael brown like he;s some kind of self appointed saint.

      I have not seen this happening. There has been little proclaimed about his actions before the shooting and I don't think I have seen an article or even a comment calling him a saint. However, nothing he has been even accused of is a capital crime, so shooting him was most certainly not appropriate.

      Perhaps if Michael Brown had never robbed that store owner or assaulted that store owner, then this crap wouldn't have happened in the first place

      There appears to be no indication that at the time of the shooting the officer had any idea that Michael Brown had committed any of these crimes (which we still cannot confirm he actually did). The Ferguson PD will not even release the incident report for the robbery, so we still don't have any idea what happened there.

      In this country, you get arrested and charged with a crime for doing just that.

      Yes. Absolutely, if he was a suspect in the robbery arresting him would have been completely appropriate. You know what isn't appropriate? Shooting an unarmed suspect even if you are absolutely positive he committed a crime - this is not Judge Dredd, we have courts in this country.

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • icon
      John Fenderson (profile), 11 Sep 2014 @ 10:52am

      Re:

      "I wish Techdirt would stop holding up Michael brown like he;s some kind of self appointed saint."

      Ummm, where is anybody doing that?

      "a black man who robbed a store, assaulted the store owner"

      We don't actually know that he did these things. Even if he did, though, it doesn't change the arguments.

      "what's wrong with race relations"

      No, this is about what's wrong with police militarization.

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

      • icon
        ChrisB (profile), 11 Sep 2014 @ 10:59am

        Re: Re:

        The shooting had nothing to do with police militarization. This was a beat cop with a clean record dealing with a belligerent man. My understanding is one round was fired in the cop car, which indicates a struggle.

        reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

        • icon
          John Fenderson (profile), 11 Sep 2014 @ 11:06am

          Re: Re: Re:

          I think it does have to do with police militarization. That trend has made it more likely that cops will shoot people. However, the real "news story" around this is not that single shooting -- cops shoot people down in the streets in equally questionable circumstances every day, after all. The exceptionally egregious actions were how the police handled the subsequent protests.

          reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

        • identicon
          Anonymous Coward, 11 Sep 2014 @ 11:11am

          Re: Re: Re:

          Photos of at least scenes of crimes team examining the car, or it is as real as the cop being injured.

          reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

        • icon
          JMT (profile), 11 Sep 2014 @ 5:49pm

          Re: Re: Re:

          "This was a beat cop with a clean record dealing with a belligerent man."

          So the threshold for lethal force is belligerence now? Do you even know what that word means, or do you actually think it justifies being killed for?

          reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • identicon
      Anonymous Coward, 11 Sep 2014 @ 10:54am

      Re:

      There's an old proverb, I think it goes something along the lines of "Two Wrongs Don't Make a Right."

      Just because Michael Brown did something wrong doesn't justify the actions taken against him and the escalation of forces afterwards.

      You're absolutely right that Michael Brown is not a saint, but he IS still a victim and what he did pales in comparison to executing someone in the street.

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

      • icon
        ChrisB (profile), 11 Sep 2014 @ 11:02am

        Re: Re:

        Calling this an execution is not reasonable at all. Some accounts say Brown tried to flee, then ran at the cop. This might be a borderline case, but describing it as "execution" is just ridiculous.

        reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

        • icon
          John Fenderson (profile), 11 Sep 2014 @ 11:04am

          Re: Re: Re:

          I agree. "Execution" is a loaded term. I call it "murder", but I suppose that it could technically be "manslaughter".

          reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

        • identicon
          Anonymous Coward, 11 Sep 2014 @ 12:03pm

          Re: Re: Re:

          I call it "innocent until proven guilty" -- this holds for the officer as well as Brown. Both of them are being smeared on hearsay and actions undecided by the courts.

          And none of that really matters, as the issue here is how the situation was handled by the city. The protests themselves weren't just a direct response to the shooting; the shooting was the last straw. The fact that the city then felt that it needed that much force to quell protests is quite telling -- they must have had some reason for that, and from the news that's been coming out, the reason is that the citizens of that part of town were feeling regularly victimized and like their rights were being ignored by the authorities.

          In short, people no longer felt like the police were protecting them, and this meant that the police no longer had the protection of the citizenry and had to replace it with a show of force.

          reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

          • icon
            John Fenderson (profile), 11 Sep 2014 @ 12:25pm

            Re: Re: Re: Re:

            "I call it "innocent until proven guilty" -- this holds for the officer as well as Brown. Both of them are being smeared on hearsay and actions undecided by the courts."

            The principle is that you're innocent until proven guilty in a court of law. It has never held outside of the courtroom.

            Actually, I think it very often does hold true outside of the courtroom as well, but the level of "proof" required for ordinary people to make the determination is ridiculously low.

            reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • identicon
      Zonker, 11 Sep 2014 @ 12:38pm

      Re:

      There would have been no hesitation in arresting and charging Michael Brown with robbery, jaywalking, and/or assaulting an officer and putting him on trial whether he was guilty or not.

      So why the outright refusal to even consider the same for the officer? Arrest him on murder charges and put him on trial to determine whether he is guilty or not. This is what the people are furious about: the double standard that we plebs have to face arrest, our names all over the news, and a trial when accused of any crime; but police officers get a paid vacation (on us), their names withheld, and no charges, no trial, no jail time. Even if this officer appears before a grand jury for indictment, he will be afforded an opportunity to speak in his defense that none of the rest of the public is afforded.

      I would rather have an alleged robber free on the street than an extrajudicial murderer any day. One may take my property, but the other will take my life. And as stated by others, robbery is not a capital offense.

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • identicon
      RD, 11 Sep 2014 @ 2:27pm

      Re:

      So, what you are saying is "he had it coming" because low-level local robbery now equals a sentence of execution. Got it. Can't wait until you step even slightly out of line and face getting gunned down for it. I'm sure you will loudly proclaim "I had it coming! I deserve it for infracting the law even a little bit!" through blood-filled lungs as your heart beats its last.

      And we'll be sure to hold you up as a "saint" by the same regard around here.

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

      • identicon
        Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2014 @ 5:54am

        Re: Re:

        If every kid who shoplifted something was shot and killed, the human race would never see another generation.

        reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • icon
      JMT (profile), 11 Sep 2014 @ 5:55pm

      Re:

      "I wish Techdirt would stop holding up Michael brown like he;s some kind of self appointed saint."

      And I wish you wouldn't make comments based a round a series of lies, incorrect info and strawman arguments.

      "Perhaps if Michael Brown had never robbed that store owner or assaulted that store owner, then this crap wouldn't have happened in the first place."

      Please explain how these two occurrences are linked, and how one affected the other. Keep in mind we all know that they're not connected, I just want to be entertained by you trying to justify your claims. Should be funny if nothing else.

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • identicon
      Anonymous Coward, 11 Sep 2014 @ 7:56pm

      Re:

      I wish you would stop holding up cops like they're some kind of group of infallible saints who can never be doubted or questioned.

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • identicon
      Severed Dragon, 12 Sep 2014 @ 4:59pm

      Re:

      quote:
      Michael Brown was nothing more than a thug from the hood who was prompted to rob a store of some cigarettes and then assault the owner of the store.

      In this country, you get arrested and charged with a crime for doing just that.


      This simply isn't true.
      Banksters fraud, theft, felonies and yet they still walk free.
      Shall we talk about Oath Breakers who swore an oath to protect the US Constitution, and then passed patriot act, ndaa, torture, wars (plural.)

      I suggest you buy one of those awesome AM super sensitive radios and tune into KFBK's EX-Sheriff John McGinnes show if all you want to hear and say is people are bad, petty thieves, drug addicted, alcoholic, a filtered view of the second amendment (e.g. support bans, databases, and supportive of the false science DSM-IV to be used to take peoples firearms ), and no matter what, officials never even FART near the public.

      Officials are so corrupt. Still that oath breaking scumbag Leland LEE is getting a paycheck!!

      Why should I as a Juror serving jury duty prosecute Michael Brown for stealing Smokes, when banksters and pieces of oath breaking crap are FREE and getting PAID STILL!!!?

      The truth of the matter is these oath breaking scum have destroyed the Rule of Law. Is it bad enough to cause a civil war? Maybe not yet, but I will bet, that Justice may be served by revenge blow-back in the future if things don't change back onto the path of following the Us Constitution and bill of rights.

      The Mafia Thugs doing the real damage here which LED to Michael Brown being a piece of crap in a crappy city, with crap oppertunity, and crap future ARE ALL the CEO's of Goldman Sachs, JP MOARgan, CHASE, Citi, Monsanto, Merk, EliLily, and ON and ON.
      Adding to the list members of CFR, AIPAC, PNAC, IMF, UN
      Along with the oath breakers in the NSA, CIA, FBI, Pentagon, Whitehouse, and other agencies like BLM, USDA, FDA, FCC on and ON and ON!!

      You want to get real.
      Better check yourself.

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • identicon
    Michael, 11 Sep 2014 @ 10:45am

    “You assume that the Custodian of Records, somehow, logged every single question, statement or request for information, verbal or otherwise, made to every single police officer, city employee, consultant, appointed official or elected official,”

    We don't assume that the Custodian of Records logs everything you have stated is being considered a FOIA request, THE LAW REQUIRES IT.

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • identicon
    Jasmine Charter, 11 Sep 2014 @ 11:10am

    Tired of this...

    A 6' 4" 300 lb thug, bully and thief attacked an armed officer of the law, beat him and broke is eye socket. the thug then charged the officer with the intent of finishing the job and the officer fired at the thug until he stopped coming at him.

    I don't agree with many things the police do but I don't like bullies and thugs who are made into saints.

    You're talking about a guy who robbed a store, assaulted and threatened the clerk, then assaulted a police officer. You're not talking about some 5' 100lb 13 year old who was skipping along. This was a criminal. A dangerous, violent criminal who got shot breaking the law.

    Don't try to make a thug into a saint and don't make him into a martyr.

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • identicon
      Michael, 11 Sep 2014 @ 11:24am

      Re: Tired of this...

      beat him and broke is eye socket

      This was absolutely false. No broken eye socket. At this time, it appears the officer was not injured at all.

      I don't like bullies and thugs who are made into saints

      Neither do I. Whether they are wearing a badge or not. I am pretty sure Michael Brown was not a very nice kid, but he was unarmed and got shot multiple times under some pretty sketchy circumstances that the local police refuse to clarify - that's not a good sign.

      You're talking about a guy who robbed a store, assaulted and threatened the clerk, then assaulted a police officer.

      As far as we can tell at this point, the officer did not know about the robbery when he encountered the "suspect", so bringing that incident up (that we still cannot confirm was Michael Brown or what happened there) does not help your case here. I would expect if the FPD could provide evidence that the officer was, in fact, trying to take him into custody because of the robbery they would have told us by now.

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • icon
      John Fenderson (profile), 11 Sep 2014 @ 11:26am

      Re: Tired of this...

      "who are made into saints."

      Again, who is making this guy into a saint? Nobody that I can see.

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • identicon
      Anonymous Coward, 11 Sep 2014 @ 11:38am

      Re: Tired of this...

      I'm sure you are tired of this. So tired in fact that you have zero facts correct. There is no proof he assaulted the cop beyond other cops saying so after the fact. The cops claimed he hit the cop multiple times and broke his eye socket, but again there is no proof because the xray showed no damage. The pictures that you assume to be the cop "victim" are not of him and in fact no pictures of him are available in the weeks following the "assault" probably because it directly contradicts the supposed injuries he sustained. You Jasmine Charter are a liar who picks and chooses what to believe based on your already made up mind. I also suspect you have posted here already with very closely worded statements under a different name.

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • identicon
      RD, 11 Sep 2014 @ 2:32pm

      Re: Tired of this...

      "Don't try to make a thug into a saint and don't make him into a martyr."

      So because he was (allegedly) a bully and a thug (none of which the officer could have possibly known at the time he shot him) he deserves to be shot without arrest, trial or defense?

      According to your own sick logic, all cops should summarily be shot as well then, since they are all thugs and bullys as well.

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • identicon
      alternatives(), 11 Sep 2014 @ 3:12pm

      Re: Tired of this...

      and broke is eye socket

      Do you have links to the pictures of this broken socket?

      Or articles about it?

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 11 Sep 2014 @ 11:38am

    All the facts

    They didn't need to lie - all they had to do was say we are releasing all related information regardless of how relevant it was or not.

    The video is definitely a clue into Michael Brown's state of mind at the time of the altercation.

    The more the people knew the better. it is part of the whole truth, like it or not. but they police didn't need to lie about why they were releasing it.

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • identicon
      Anonymous Coward, 11 Sep 2014 @ 12:36pm

      Re: All the facts

      The timing was suspicious and they haven't released the incident reports that would usually be accompanying the events. If they are claiming "evidence in an active investigation", so would the video be. The timing of this release and the lack of other relevant evidence suggests that they are actively trying to spin the story.

      Both mayor, lawyer and police chief seems very involved in actively promoting a narrative. Not a good sign for finding out the truth.

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 11 Sep 2014 @ 11:59am

    Are any of you naysayers even trying right now? Half the shit listed in this thread has been readily (factually) refuted, you don't even have to look that hard for a recap.

    Lets summarize the readily available information off the internet related to Mike's murder:

    Moving away - shots fired - 5 or 6 witness
    Arms up - shots fired - 4 witnesses
    Dropping to his knees - shots fired - 3 witnesses
    Audio Recording - 10-12 shots in two groups
    Video Recording - spontaneous utterances of he had his hands up etc etc

    Now lets see the summary of Darren Wilson's defense:

    Fighting with Officer - Officer by others
    Fighting over Weapon in car - Officer by others
    Weapon discharged in car - Officer by others
    Damage to officers eye - Medical report not released
    Officers statement - not released
    Police logs of incident ( radio report) - not released


    ** Let's not forgot the autopsy report requested by the family and was done by a neutral third party that revealed that Mike's "fatal" wounds (the head shots) were done at a trajectory that indicated he had his head down and was being towered over.

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • identicon
      Zonker, 11 Sep 2014 @ 1:02pm

      Re:

      Exactly. In every account I've seen, the actual eyewitnesses on the scene claim that Brown was shot while surrendering or fleeing, differing slightly on the details but not the substance. The self defense story source is always from either the officer himself or his fellow officers and friends who were not present at the scene of the shooting.

      Who would you believe more: eyewitnesses generally agreeing the shooting was unjustified despite some disagreement on the details, or friends and coworkers of the accused all agreeing verbatim with the accused's own account of self defense despite not being there themselves to witness it?

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 11 Sep 2014 @ 12:34pm

    Straight from the President's playbook...

    This is straight from the President's playbook, lie and deny. Then when the lies are discovered, often very quickly, issue more lies and denials. So it is quite hipocritical for the President to send the DOJ down when the goose is only following in the gander's footsteps.

    Now I am in no way defending anything going on in Ferguson, just point out that their actions are only mirroring those at the top.

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • identicon
    anon, 11 Sep 2014 @ 12:36pm

    Surprising

    The first thing I though when the police chief said on the news that they had overwhelming requests for the video was "from whom?" Oddly enough, despite the shitstorm over the release, nobody (NOBODY) at the press conference asked that question. Even more oddly, nobody seems to have commented 9despite 24-7 commentary) "Huh? We never asked for it." or even "Yes, we were one of the news stations asking for it." Another major failing of mainstream media, your source for news by press release rewrite.

    It irked me as much as the cigars. Close but no cigar. The cigars were not even mentioned until the tape came out. Even then, I searched for several days to find any mention of a handful of cigars strewn around the crime scene... nope.

    No interview with the store owner. How many cigars were "stolen"? ("A box" - what's a $38 box of cheap cigars - 15? 10?) If he "had them in his hand" why were they not all over the sidewalk, and a significant part of the story from the first day?

    Also, the media played the confrontation at the door of the store ad nauseum, but rarely did we see the prior bit, where Brown actually is at the counter apparently paying for something for a while. What were the details of this transaction? Far be it from the police to fill in this detail, or the press to seek it out.

    The general media seems to be either too lazy or too incompetent to tell the whole story. Or maybe they think that more than three facts a day is to complicated for their viewers. May it is.

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 11 Sep 2014 @ 12:59pm

    The Chief of the Ferguson Thug Department appears to be a flat-out liar. I can't say I'm surprised. Thugs are trained to lie. Especially when under oath.

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • icon
    MDT (profile), 11 Sep 2014 @ 1:07pm

    Robbery in Question

    It really is questionable whether it was a robbery or not. The tape shows him paying for something, and the cigarellos are placed on the counter by the person behind the counter. Those cigarellos are not kept on the counter, anyone who's been in a convenience store knows they are kept on a shelf way out of reach, for just this reason, so people don't steal them.

    From what I've read, what really happened was the underage guy paid for the cigarellos, and the person behind the counter twigged to it too late (likely the owner catching on when the staff didn't), and they tried to take the cigarellos back so they didn't get in trouble for selling them to a minor.

    If you pay for something, and then someone tries to take it back, it's highly questionable whether you can call that a robbery. And if it's not a robbery, then pushing the guy isn't felony robbery.

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • icon
    Uriel-238 (profile), 11 Sep 2014 @ 1:51pm

    New witness information about the Brown / Wilson encounter?

    As of August 20th, my take was as follows:

    Event 1: Brown ran from Wilson's cruiser.
    Event 2: Wilson fired shots and missed.
    Event 3: Brown stopped and raised his hands and turned around
    Event 4: Wilson continued firing into brown's arm.
    Event 5: Brown continued to submit dropping to his knees.
    Event 6: Wilson stops firing.
    Event 7: Wilson shoots two or three more times, killing Brown.

    By then the orbital ocular eye-hurt thingy was disproven. By then the Brown-charged-Wilson notion was refuted.

    Is there information since August 20th that Brown used his Jedi powers and attacked Wilson from the ground or something?

    I'm serious about the Jedi powers. Considering the show of force by the Ferguson PD, they were up against nothing short of either Jedi knights with the ability to toss Volkswagon Beetles with their mind, or rampaging tyrannosaurs. I've heard rumors that when black people smoke pot, rather than mellowing out and becoming sleepy, munchy and paranoid, they grow to the size of Godzilla and start looking for Tokyo.

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • icon
      Uriel-238 (profile), 11 Sep 2014 @ 2:00pm

      Re: New witness information about the Brown / Wilson encounter?

      I found this online and thought it was a good and relevant read (other than the fart jokes, which I think is a CRACKED requirement).

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

      • icon
        That One Guy (profile), 11 Sep 2014 @ 3:26pm

        Re: Re: New witness information about the Brown / Wilson encounter?

        Whoever named that particular article needs to get a smack upside the head. They took what should have been a serious discussion and made it sound like some stupid joke, to the point that the first time I saw it I just ignored it, figuring it to be just some stupid, childish article(because really, when 'wacky' and 'fart' are in the title, what else would you expect?)

        If you can ignore the idiotic fart jokes and videos though, yeah, that article covers the issue pretty well.

        reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • identicon
      Jack, 11 Sep 2014 @ 2:58pm

      Re: New witness information about the Brown / Wilson encounter?

      Not only did I hear about the black people turning into Godzilla thing when they smoke pot - I actually SAW a video of it! I think this guy "David" or "Dave" Chapel? Chapelle? or some french sounding name terrorizing Japanese citizens and defiling a Volcano after smoking that devil weed!

      It's definitely true.

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • icon
    toyotabedzrock (profile), 11 Sep 2014 @ 3:02pm

    If they didn't record who requested the tape then how could they then fulfill the requests. And since when do foia responses get pushed out in this manner.

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • identicon
    Rekrul, 11 Sep 2014 @ 3:06pm

    Sadly, the release of the tape worked to justify Brown's shooting in the minds of many people. Right after the tape was released my friend was telling me about Brown was a huge guy, how he tossed the store clerk around like a rag doll, etc. In his mind, Brown was a super-human thug who got what he deserved.

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 12 Sep 2014 @ 2:00am

    Yeah right, lets keep ignoring the fact that he ran towards the cop when he was shot and pretend that the video of him violently robbing a store doesnt exist.
    Sure, shooting him that many times was excessive but the evidence clearly shows that he wasnt innocent at all.
    And if they had not showed up in numbers your precious protesters would have looted every single shop in the city.

    This should have been about excessive use of force, not about a hatecrime (something that minorities are a lot better at than whites, again a fact you usally ignore).

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • icon
      Niall (profile), 12 Sep 2014 @ 4:47am

      Re:

      Leaving aside your first paragraph, which is debunked quite happily in previous posts...

      If this was a hate crime, then it was by the trigger-happy (police) thug on the unarmed (black) man. Where have we seen this before, then defended like crazy by the rabid right?

      As for minorities supposedly being 'better' at than whites for hate crimes, aside from [Citation Required], I would say that it is likely that as they are oppressed much more than the 'poor' whites so are more likely to react to the endemic racism they face.

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • icon
      Uriel-238 (profile), 12 Sep 2014 @ 12:29pm

      Ignoring facts you don't like

      Are you saying you have new data, or are you regurgitating the old set. I broke it down as of August 20th which is about when the audio recording of the Brown / Wilson encounter went public.

      This a tactic that Fox News likes to do, is pretend that developments debunking their preferred narrative didn't happen.

      Are you banking on the notion that if you repeat something so many times that people might believe you? Is this post an attempt to manipulate recollection of the events, rather than a sincere attempt to discuss the Ferguson events?

      Kinda paints you as outright hostile to this forum, doesn't it?

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • icon
    rl78 (profile), 13 Sep 2014 @ 7:17pm

    The tape definitely should have been released...

    although not in the manner, and timing in which it was released.

    I am not commenting here on the actions of Darren Wilson, because the police department at large is not responsible for them; they can be judged separately.

    I can agree with an assertion that the Ferguson PD may have tried to have used it with the timing of the release to falsely justify officer Wilson's actions, which is unjustifiable. I cannot agree that the recording should not have been released at all. It was part of the chain of events that day.

    It is also unjustifiable for the media to try to portray Michael Brown in a way that was contrary to evidence they had in their possession, whether or not it was material to the actions of officer Wilson.

    One side tried to spin evidence for their narrative, on side tried to sit on evidence for their narrative. We should all be seeking for the truth to be known, whatever that may be.

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • identicon
    Deserttrek, 17 Sep 2014 @ 4:40pm

    the only things unjustifiable is the corrupt media blowing up a story to benefit one political party and a bunch of rabble rousers .... as is typical of the simple minded nowadays, don't wait for the evidence just place blame and move on.
    the evidence on hand points to a justified shooting. the real criminals are the rioters and media who pushes an agenda that is destructive to the republic

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]


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