(Mis)Uses of Technology

by Mike Masnick


Filed Under:
copyright, japan

Companies:
google, jasrac, youtube



Japanese Entertainment Industry Still Very Confused, Very Wrong About YouTube

from the let's-try-this-again-from-the-beginning dept

You may remember late last year that JASRAC, the group that represents various entertainment industry interests in Japan got very angry at YouTube and demanded the site prevent unauthorized videos from being uploaded. YouTube responded by trying to explain that it wasn't YouTube's fault, while also promising to put warnings about copyrights on the site in Japanese -- while also promising to travel to Japan and meet with entertainment industry officials there. This week a second round of those meetings happened and it appears that Japanese entertainment industry is still confused. They're not at all happy with YouTube, demanding that "all copyrighted material be removed immediately."

That was the statement from composer Hideki Matsutake, who apparently was the spokesmen for the coalition of entertainment industry interests that met with Google/YouTube execs. Of course, that doesn't make any sense. Thanks to current copyright laws, all new content automatically is copyrighted once created. In other words, nearly all content on YouTube is under someone's copyright. What the guy really means is that he wants all unauthorized content removed from YouTube and that's much more difficult -- because there's no easy way to know whether or not the content has been authorized. There are plenty of copyright holders who not only choose to put their content on sites like YouTube, but actually are thrilled when fans promote their content by uploading it to YouTube. Unfortunately, this Japanese group doesn't seem to understand that. Even more to the point, they apparently fail to understand that even if YouTube completely shut down today, all of that content would simply move to other sites -- and those sites are likely to care even less about what a coalition of Japanese entertainers and entertainment companies want them to do.

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  • identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 2 Aug 2007 @ 7:31pm

    Better the evil you know than the evil you don't.

    YouTube at least takes down unauthorized material and other stuff that violates their ToS. People should try working WITH them rather than against, but then they want easy money.

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • identicon
      ChurchHatesTucker, 2 Aug 2007 @ 10:02pm

      Re:

      Well, yeah. The obvious answer form yt is "OK, tell us what you're upset about, and we'll go through the proper channels."

      What the "providers" don't get is, the trade-off you made with having everything be under copyright, didn't end up meaning (it turns out) that everyone is going to bother to try to figure out who owns the copyright. So you still have to do some work to protect your property.

      Fancy that.

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • identicon
    Charles Griswold, 2 Aug 2007 @ 8:01pm

    Lack of Understanding?

    "There is no middle ground," Matsutake said. "We demand that all copyrighted material be removed immediately."
    This statement shows a complete lack of understanding of copyright law. Someone should inform him that (at least in the U.S.) everything that is created is automatically copyrighted by the creator. This means that (nearly) all of the content on Youtube is copyrighted.

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • identicon
    Ryan, 2 Aug 2007 @ 8:13pm

    Unauthorized doesn't mean illegal necessarily.

    Unauthorized doesn't mean illegal necessarily. For instance, if a video is covered under fair use it is almost definitely unauthorized but still completely legal and the copyright owner has no right whatsoever to pull the video from Youtube.

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • identicon
    Shalkar, 2 Aug 2007 @ 8:15pm

    Yes indeed!

    I'm right there with ya pal! Attacking YouTube is stupid. They just don't understand the internet. They pay people to understand it for them. They think it's hard to set up websites on the internet like it's hard to start a business. Stupid noobs. :P

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • identicon
    Ludditte, 2 Aug 2007 @ 9:24pm

    rather than watching someone else's...

    i create something that has value. you copy it and distribute it on youtube. you force me to find it and complain.

    i watch unauthorized videos all the time but at least i don't try to rationalize my theft. youtube is based on theft. so is bittorrent. pretty much the entire internet experience is one big copy and paste.

    just as long as i'm not a producer of value, i don't care. as soon as i make money from something you steal, then i care.

    some day we'll have to go back to actually creating value rather than copying it.

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • identicon
      YouKnowNothing, 3 Aug 2007 @ 6:10am

      Re: rather than watching someone else's...

      As it has been said many times, copyright infringement is not the same as theft. Please see Dowling V. United States (1985). Here's the good bits for you (emphasis added)...

      "The phonorecords in question were not "stolen, converted or taken by fraud" for purposes of [section] 2314. The section's language clearly contemplates a physical identity between the items unlawfully obtained and those eventually transported, and hence some prior physical taking of the subject goods. Since the statutorily defined property rights of a copyright holder have a character distinct from the possessory interest of the owner of simple "goods, wares, [or] merchandise," interference with copyright does not easily equate with theft, conversion, or fraud. The infringer of a copyright does not assume physical control over the copyright nor wholly deprive its owner of its use. Infringement implicates a more complex set of property interests than does run-of-the-mill theft, conversion, or fraud."

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • identicon
      NoName, 3 Aug 2007 @ 12:46pm

      Re: rather than watching someone else's...

      youtube is based on theft. so is bittorrent.
      The big lie.

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • identicon
    Anonymous Coward, 2 Aug 2007 @ 9:41pm

    I guess sometimes ignorance isn't bliss... amazing... simply amazing those easterners

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • identicon
    rb, 2 Aug 2007 @ 10:00pm

    The fact is producers like me own the material and You Tube is using our material for profit. This is against the law.

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • identicon
      Anonymous Coward, 3 Aug 2007 @ 4:59am

      Re:

      Using someone else's material for profit isn't actually against the law. There are restrictions on how that happens. But anyway, a majority of videos on youtube are user-created ones. Plus, YouTube follows the law concerning the DMCA and takes down videos once they find out its infringing.

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • identicon
    rb, 2 Aug 2007 @ 10:00pm

    The fact is producers like me own the material and You Tube is using our material for profit. This is against the law. Plus the material will often show up in less than ideal quality where the producer has no control over their own content.

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • identicon
      PaulT, 3 Aug 2007 @ 12:40am

      Re:

      rb, It's not "against the law". YouTube are a service provider, and some people are misusing that service. According to the law, they are not liable for the abuse of their service by their users. If you don't want your content to be available on YouTube, work with them to help them know that your content is unauthorised and help them remove the offending items.

      Also, there's another alternative, YouTube are a provider of free bandwidth and promotional channels. Rather than complain about it, work out how to leverage that to your advantage. I'm sure that you can reach many more people through YouTube than by traditional means, you just have to work out a way of translating that into revenue, as many have done so before.

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • icon
      Mike (profile), 3 Aug 2007 @ 1:01am

      Re:

      The fact is producers like me own the material and You Tube is using our material for profit. This is against the law. Plus the material will often show up in less than ideal quality where the producer has no control over their own content.

      No. YouTube is not using your content for profit. They are offering a service of hosting and displaying videos. That's where the profit is. There may be some *users* of YouTube who are misusing your content, but that's not YouTube doing it. You need to understand the difference.

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

    • identicon
      Anonymous Coward, 3 Aug 2007 @ 2:44am

      Re:

      The fact is what you produce is probably shit and the only reason anyone consumes it at all is because it's promoted by youtube, otherwise your shit would never be seen because it's shit.

      reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • identicon
    John, 3 Aug 2007 @ 8:07am

    The Japanese

    The way Japanese do business is very different. When they have an issue that they want, they don't conceed it. You have to compromise on another issue in the contract. It's a real pain in the ass.

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • identicon
    4-80-sicks, 6 Aug 2007 @ 12:03pm

    Do they know how it works?

    The more of these stories I read, the more I wonder if the people complaining understand how a site like youtube works. They seem to think that copyrighted content is tagged as such, and that a human being (besides the person submitting the content) reviews videos before they get online.

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]

  • identicon
    Tyler Bennett, 30 Aug 2007 @ 8:07am

    I agree that youtube is a big load of crap.

    reply to this | link to this | view in chronology ]


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