As The White House (And Others) Blame Facebook For COVID Vaccination Rates, Health Officials Are Blaming Fox News

from the the-real-problem dept

Over the last few weeks there’s been a weird, wasteful, and just silly dispute in which the White House has tried to blame Facebook (and misinformation on Facebook) for not enough people agreeing to get vaccinated against COVID-19 (in light of cases ramping up again). Things have gotten so stupid that two Senators have released a terribly unconstitutional bill attempting to hold Facebook liable for “health misinformation” on its platform.

But… is Facebook actually to blame? Mark Zuckerberg (who, um, is obviously not an unbiased party) made a completely valid point in response to all of this: Facebook is available around the globe, yet much of the rest of the world is not seeing the same levels of vaccine hesitancy (indeed, the problem elsewhere tends to be a lack of supply), and that might raise questions as to why Facebook is facing the blame for vaccine hesitancy.

“..if one country is not reaching its vaccine goal, but other countries that all these same social media tools are in are doing just fine.. should lead you to conclude that.. platforms are not the decisive element..”

Of course, there’s more to it than that, but what strikes me as most notable is that actual health experts in places where there are high levels of vaccine hesitancy don’t seem to think that Facebook is the problem. They seem to recognize that it’s actually a Fox News problem. In an article talking with health officials in states like Alabama and Louisiana, where vaccine hesitancy is the highest, they’re saying the real problem remains Fox News.

Doctors and health officials in Alabama and Louisiana say their only hope for getting people vaccinated is if the media outlets that message to these areas, primarily Fox News, start advocating people get the shot, instead of pushing them away from the jab.

?I have people come up to me and say, ?Why on CNN? Couldn?t you go on Fox?? They are still very angry over the last couple of years. There?s an irritation. They are super frustrated. They need to hear it from the people that they trust. They need to hear it from where they get their news every day. And I don?t know why not Fox. Why not?,? O?Neal said. ?But it has to change this week. Every single show. And it has to be about the community, not the ?you? because there?s been too much about the ?you.? ?You? they got indoctrinated. It is not about ?you,? it is about the community. You?re going to kill your community.?

Others have been making this point as well.

But despite the enormous reach of Facebook, only one media outlet has devoted itself to injecting falsehoods about the pandemic into the nervous systems of its audience on a 24/7 basis. That, of course, would be Fox News, the right-wing cable station that tells its viewers, over and over, that vaccines are dangerous and that wearing a mask to prevent COVID-19 is ineffective ? and, in any case, is not worth the price we?d pay in giving up our freedom.

None of this should be surprising. For years now we’ve been pointing people to the detailed, data-driven research findings of Yochai Benkler, Robert Faris, and Hal Roberts in their book, Network Propaganda, which traced the actual flow of mis- and disinformation regarding the 2016 Presidential election, and found that the main vector (by far) was not Facebook, but Fox News. Yes, things would spread on Facebook eventually, but only after Fox News would make it into a story. A later study they did regarding disinformation about mail-in ballots found the same thing.

That’s not to say that mis- and disinformation don’t travel on Facebook. Clearly it happens all the time. But focusing on social media, as if it’s the primary culprit, or that somehow getting Facebook to delete the propagandists on that platform will magically solve all disinformation is clearly folly. Of course, you won’t see Senators Amy Klobuchar and Ben Ray Lujan introducing bills to make Fox News liable for the health misinformation they spew — they at least recognize that that would not only be blatantly unconstitutional, but would be interpreted as an attack on conservatives’ favorite TV news channel.

Mis- and disinformation remain a real problem, but kneejerk attempts to blame social media are not helping and not getting at any of the root causes of the credibility crisis currently facing people throughout the US.

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Comments on “As The White House (And Others) Blame Facebook For COVID Vaccination Rates, Health Officials Are Blaming Fox News”

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Samuel Abram (profile) says:

What I fear…

Here’s what I’m afraid of:

Let’s say that every single show on Fox were to encourage their viewers to become vaccinated (Sean Hannity and Steve Doocy already have). What would be the most likely outcome? I would say that their viewers would leave Fox and join NewsMax or OANN.

(To be honest, I really hope I’m wrong, but considering what happened at the 2020 election when Fox News called the election for Biden, many of their viewers left Fox and watched NewsMax and OANN instead, depending on which network’s lies comforted them the most)

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Thad (profile) says:

Re: What I fear…

Per Wikipedia, Fox News is available to 114,848,000 households, which is approximately a hundred million more than Newsmax. (OANN’s numbers are not listed.) While I’m sure Fox viewers leaving for Newsmax and OANN is some concern, those networks simply don’t have anything remotely approaching its market penetration or name recognition.

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Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Re:

Walking up to someone like that and screaming at them

I don’t know what video you saw, but the guy confronting Fucker Carlson was calm, collected, and in no way screaming at him.

And if you don’t believe me, watch this un-edited version of that same encounter (without the stupid voiceover):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SbVIrOur23g

Now tell me how he was screaming?

Love how you Fox fans have to push the truth to be something completely different that what reality is.

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That One Guy (profile) says:

Of course, you won’t see Senators Amy Klobuchar and Ben Ray Lujan introducing bills to make Fox News liable for the health misinformation they spew — they at least recognize that that would not only be blatantly unconstitutional, but would be interpreted as an attack on conservatives’ favorite TV news channel.

Both are blatantly unconstitutional but at least going after Fox would be going after a direct source if misinformation rather than telling the target ‘do our work for us and take down what we tell you to’, so I’d say the refusal to go after Fox has little to nothing to do with the constitutional status of the bills(they’ve already shown they don’t care about that) and everything to do with optics.

Currently tech companies are the punching bags for both parties which makes them a safe target whereas if they tried to go after Fox that would cost them and get them pushback, and if(as I suspect is the case unless they are really stupid) this is nothing more than a dishonest PR stunt why go after a risky target when there’s a safe one available?

That One Guy (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re:

Agreed, it is well past time for them to stop meekly just taking the blows and start pushing back hard when politicians and others lie about them, though it’s possible that they’re doing so because they know that as annoying as the accusation and resulting ‘reforms’ aimed their way might be for them those efforts stand to be absolutely devastating to their competitors, such that they might consider it a worthwhile cost to take a few hits in the short-term for long-term gains.

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Frank Cox (profile) says:

"Falsehoods?"

It bugs me when articles like this refer to "falsehoods".

You’re sugar coating it and taking away the impact of calling it what it is. Lies.

Not falsehoods.

Why is everyone so afraid of calling a spade a spade here?

"That’s a lie." There. See how easy it was.

Falsehoods indeed. Peh.

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Samuel Abram (profile) says:

Re: "Falsehoods?"

If you intentionally tell a false statement with the intent to decieve, it’s a lie.

If you tell a false statement with reckless disregard to whether it’s true or false, it’s bullshit.

If you repeat a lie or bullshit repeated above whilst believing it was true, it’s a falsehood.

The US Right Wing trafficks in all three so much it’s best to label them all "falsehoods".

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Anonymous Coward says:

The unvaccinated are not causing the virus to mutate. Viruses mutate, that’s what the do. If the whole world were vaccinated, and the vaccine were 100% effective (both of which are impossible because: mankind), there would still be viral mutations. Booster shots would still be required, and extensive testing before administering these boosters; all of which would take time. During said time, guess what the virus would be doing????: Mutating. Instead of being mad at the people who chose not to take this particular vaccine, the vaccinated (who are also experiencing increased infection rates post vaccination) should be mad at the fact that they were told that the vaccines were highly effective at Preventing Infection. Now the vaccinated are being told that the vaccine only reduces symptoms post infection. What?!?!?!

How many people who signed up for the vaccine took comfort in the fact that they could still get infected with COVID, or even die from the vaccine itself? We’re not being told the whole numbers.

Unfortunately, baring a miraculous end to this virus, there will be more infections and deaths of both the vaccinated and unvaccinated.

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Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re:

Nearly all COVID deaths in US are now among unvaccinated

Nearly all COVID-19 deaths in the U.S. now are in people who weren’t vaccinated, a staggering demonstration of how effective the shots have been and an indication that deaths per day — now down to under 300 — could be practically zero if everyone eligible got the vaccine.

An Associated Press analysis of available government data from May shows that “breakthrough” infections in fully vaccinated people accounted for fewer than 1,200 of more than 107,000 COVID-19 hospitalizations. That’s about 1.1%.

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Stephen T. Stone (profile) says:

Re:

The unvaccinated are not causing the virus to mutate.

They’re giving the virus what it needs to mutate: fresh victims and time. And they’re doing that out of sociopathic selfishness. Is wearing a mask when going to Walmart really worse than having a breathing tube shoved down one’s throat?

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That One Guy (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re: Re:

And which system do you think is more friendly to a virus’ ability to stick around long enough to mutate and spread, one that’s been primed to kill it in short order thanks to vaccination or one that’s struggling to develop those countermeasures after the infection has already taken root?

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Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Re:2 Re:

Those unvaxxed, who were also previously infected, already have the same antibodies onboard that are provided via vaccination, yet they should still get vaccinated? No.
Anyone who says that no one was informed that the vaccine would provide protection from infection is just plain lying. What do you think the ‘efficacy rate’ defines, if not the rate of infection and/or transmission.

In the end, either we DO have the freedom to say yes/no to any medication, or we DON’T.

Meanwhile, the virus is still mutating and infecting the vaxxed, the vexed, and the unvaxxed.

I don’t know everything, and I could be completely wrong about absolutely all of my points…but I doubt it. Anyway, it’s good to be surrounded by so many omniscient gods who know how to destroy such a novel (not to you all, of course) virus.

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Rocky says:

Re: Re: Re:3 Re:

Those unvaxxed, who were also previously infected, already have the same antibodies onboard that are provided via vaccination, yet they should still get vaccinated? No.

That’s why there exist anti-body tests, if you have a low immune response to COVID you should get vaccinated.

Anyone who says that no one was informed that the vaccine would provide protection from infection is just plain lying. What do you think the ‘efficacy rate’ defines, if not the rate of infection and/or transmission.

You did that, having trouble keeping track of what you said earlier eh?

I don’t know everything, and I could be completely wrong about absolutely all of my points…but I doubt it.

I can confirm that you are completely wrong.

Anyway, it’s good to be surrounded by so many omniscient gods who know how to destroy such a novel (not to you all, of course) virus.

Uhm, it seems we just destroyed your false and dishonest arguments.

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JMT (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re:3 Re:

"I don’t know everything, and I could be completely wrong about absolutely all of my points…but I doubt it. Anyway, it’s good to be surrounded by so many omniscient gods who know how to destroy such a novel (not to you all, of course) virus."

Shall I follow and share the advice of doctors and scientists, or a go with a self-doubting anonymous rando on the internet. Gee, tough choice…

Scary Devil Monastery (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re:4 Re:

"Shall I follow and share the advice of doctors and scientists, or a go with a self-doubting anonymous rando on the internet. Gee, tough choice…"

Yeah, this is how conspiracy nuts function. At some point their narrative turns the whole world into an enemy and every expert into a malicious stooge of whatever sinister group is running the NWO…

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PaulT (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re:3 Re:

"I don’t know everything, and I could be completely wrong about absolutely all of my points…"

"I have no idea what I’m talking about, but I’ll go on the internet and shout at random people about how doctors are wrong about their profession"

Hmmm…

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Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Re:3 Re:

Instead of being mad at the people who chose not to take this particular
vaccine, the vaccinated (who are also experiencing increased infection rates
post vaccination) should be mad at the fact that they were told that the
vaccines were highly effective at Preventing Infection.

Except of course they were NOT being told that, only the Antivax Nutters pulled that out of their asses to claim they needed no vaccination cause they could not infect the vaccinated.

Scary Devil Monastery (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re:3 Re:

"I don’t know everything, and I could be completely wrong about absolutely all of my points…"

Coming from someone with an actual college degree in biology, yes. You are wrong on every point so far.

"Those unvaxxed, who were also previously infected, already have the same antibodies onboard that are provided via vaccination, yet they should still get vaccinated? No."

They really should. Antibody generation is an iterative process and the immune system prioritizes their generation based on exposure. Hence why, to make sure the effect is long-lasting, you usually get two shots, with an interim period between. It’s to inform the body "Yes, this isn’t a one-off risk, you will see more of this".

"…either we DO have the freedom to say yes/no to any medication, or we DON’T."

Feel free, but the opposite also holds true; The public should not have to accept in it’s midst, lethal dangers and plague rats. If your kid comes down with lice or a cold then the school sends that kid home so the rest don’t end up infected. If you’ve been in a plague area then authorities will see you quarantined on reentry to the country.

And if you are so bereft of the concept of personal responsibility you have to posit these questions and forgot to read the Bill of Rights where your responsibility as a person are outlined, then feel free to move to a nation which doesn’t have the assumption that every citizen does their part written right into the natiuonal god damn charter.

Or, you know, stay where you are and accept that you may be quarantined and sidelined until you choose to not be a bloody danger to other people.

"…it’s good to be surrounded by so many omniscient gods…"

If by that you mean "basically educated" or "experts in this damn field" then that only means you may want to start listening to them. The fact that the "anti-vax" community was started by an unscrupulous grifter who was trying to peddle "legal representation" as a sideline to "vaccine victims" in a study where he was shown to himself have fudged the numbers…honestly, Barnum would be proud of all the gullible morons who have fallen for this hook, line and sinker…

Scary Devil Monastery (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re: Re:

"Viruses mutate regardless of the potential host’s vaccine state."

Much like a gun is usable as a weapon with or without bullets, yes. A vaccinated person has a viable immune response to the virus, ergo the virus won’t prosper, multiply, spread, or, yes, mutate well.

You are actually at the point of trying to tell people the Polio and Measles vaccine success was myth. That’s historical revisionism on the order of trying to defend the USSR "worker’s paradise" or trying to debunk the phenomenon of american slavery.

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Rocky says:

Re: Re:

The unvaccinated are not causing the virus to mutate. Viruses mutate, that’s what the do

Yes, given time – which the unvaccinated have amply provided.

If the whole world were vaccinated, and the vaccine were 100% effective (both of which are impossible because: mankind), there would still be viral mutations.

Yes, but if everyone is vaccinated they usually have some protection against a new strain which means the R-value for the virus would be very low – ie it would hardly spread.

Instead of being mad at the people who chose not to take this particular vaccine, the vaccinated (who are also experiencing increased infection rates post vaccination) should be mad at the fact that they were told that the vaccines were highly effective at Preventing Infection

No one has said that the vaccine prevents infection, it protects. The increased infections (aka breakthrough cases) rates among vaccinated people are vanishingly small (0.003% of 161 million vaccinated) compared to what is currently happening to the unvaccinated. Trying to equate the two only tells me that you either don’t know what you are talking about or is just being dishonest.

Now the vaccinated are being told that the vaccine only reduces symptoms post infection. What?!?!?!

No, they where told that from the beginning – that stupid people choose not to listen or misrepresent what was said is the telltale of idiots or liars.

How many people who signed up for the vaccine took comfort in the fact that they could still get infected with COVID, or even die from the vaccine itself? We’re not being told the whole numbers.

It has been explained from the beginning that vaccines never prevent infections, it just protects and lessens the symptom incase of an infection. That people like you are obtuse doesn’t change that fact. And the number of deaths from taking the vaccines? There is a casual link for the J&J vaccine causing blood-clots, and the amount of people that may have died from it is <0.0004% (of 7.98 million vaccinated).

Unfortunately, baring a miraculous end to this virus, there will be more infections and deaths of both the vaccinated and unvaccinated.

Mostly by the unvaccinated, who also functions as virus-mutating factories which will lead to new strains causing more breakthrough cases among the vaccinated.

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Samuel Abram (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re:

the number of deaths from taking the vaccines? There is a casual link for the J&J vaccine causing blood-clots, and the amount of people that may have died from it is <0.0004% (of 7.98 million vaccinate

Remember how Dick Cheney had the 1% doctrine? These chaotiferous anti-vaxxers are even more extreme that they have the 0.0004% doctrine, and they think that’s more risky than 2% or 3% (of unvaccinated people who died of COVID, that is).

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Scary Devil Monastery (profile) says:

Re: Re:

"The unvaccinated are not causing the virus to mutate."

Yes they are,m for the reason given below.

"Viruses mutate, that’s what the do."

Viruses can’t mutate outside of their lifecycle. Meaning that the only places a virus mutates is within a host. The more hosts exist, the faster the rate of mutation because the more virii exist who can mutate viably.

Your argument is like saying that roads don’t have any bearing on car traffic.

"the vaccinated (who are also experiencing increased infection rates post vaccination)"

They aren’t. US hospitals have already found that none of the people hospitalized recently have had both shots. Same with undertakers. Meaning that everyone getting ill enough to end up in hospital or morgue is unvaccinated.

If you want to be a plague rat then all I can advocate is that you stay away from everyone else rather than playing Typhoid Mary.

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Anonymous Coward says:

Yep

Hating smokers makes them stop smoking
Hating Klansmen makes them stop being bigots
Hating homosexuals makes them stop being homosexual
Hating child abusers makes them stop abusing kids
Hating prostitutes makes them stop prostituting
Yep, hating the antivaxxers and/or those who chose to skip this particular vaccine…that’ll fix ‘em

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Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Yep

Sex work is run by organized crime, destroys families, causes child sex trafficking, and would be rape without the money, the need for which in the first place is caused by unabridged capitalism.

Let’s make sex work legal under the condition that anyone who does it can’t use a pseudonym. Any problem with that rule is an admission of a problem with sex work.

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Scary Devil Monastery (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re: Yep

"Any problem with that rule is an admission of a problem with sex work."

It’s not, really. It’s an admission that other people than the sex worker has enough of a problem with sex work so as to ostracize the sex worker.

As some have already pointed out, feel free to reiterate your argument under your own name. Or are you in similar vein admitting that your argument is so massively flawed you don’t dare to fly it under your own name?

The lack of self-awareness of you jokers…

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Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Re: Yep

OK, so I do hate you people. You’re stupid as all fuck and as a result we’ve got Covid 2.0. So thanks, asshole.

It isn’t as if you want me to convince you of anything. Your mind is made up, so as far as I’m concerned, feel free to fuck off and die.

Signed,
A vaccinated person who doesn’t think your life is worth it

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sumgai (profile) says:

Re: Yep

You’ve forgotten one important factor: The first five members of your list are not out to kill you, or at a minimum, make you sick for a long period, perhaps for the rest of your life. Can’t claim that for number six on the list.

We don’t necessarily hate them, we’re just upset that the rest of us had to work for our scholastic achievements, and yet we have to put up with poster children for No Child Left Behind, still whining after all these years.

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Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Lies, bullshit, falsehoods and

but “trust the science”…
Just like we trust cigarette scientists
Just like we trust Coca Cola scientists
Just like we trust the Nazi scientists
The scientists that developed these vaccines were paid to do so (as they should have been for their work), but there’s “lies, damned lies, and statistics”. I know for a fact that stats can be skewed to show desired results. Heck, most people don’t even know the difference between mean and median.

If scientists were always correct, there would be no hypotheses, only laws; no need for experimentation when your hypothesis is already correct…because you already know everything. I’ll trust God as I cheer scientists that unwittingly continue to discover how HE does things.

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Rocky says:

Re: Re: Lies, bullshit, falsehoods and

Oh, you are one of those deluded fools. The difference between you and scientists is that scientists are looking for the truth while you "know" the truth, and scientists re-defines what the truth is when they discover new things – you on the other hand deny reality that doesn’t conform to your "truth" with the hand-waving of "it’s gods will" or "burn the heretic at the stake!".

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Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Re: Lies, bullshit, falsehoods and

Science is merely the study of God’s creation. There’s nothing at all wrong with science. The problem is, man is too proud to say those 3 words: “I don’t know”. Hence, some off the wall theories, like Darwin’s, are accepted (by some) as truth.
The next time a scientist tells you she/he created something, ask them what we’re their raw materials. Man can not create; man can only Build from the raw materials that God had already Created from nothing.

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Rocky says:

Re: Re: Re:2 Lies, bullshit, falsehoods and

Which god are you referring to? Marduk? Ahura Mazda? An, Enlil, Enki, and Ninhursanga? Geb & Nut? There are so many, and they all have conflicting versions on how the Earth was created, and funnily enough they don’t really talk about the universe.

You have substituted "I don’t know, I want to find out" with "I rather believe in millennia old fairy-tales written by goat herders than learn something new."

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Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Re:2 Lies, bullshit, falsehoods are next to godliness

“Hence, some off the wall theories, like Darwin’s, are accepted (by some) as truth.”

There’s as much proof for the theory of evolution than there is for atomic theory. So are you a reactor denier as well?

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PaulT (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re:2 Lies, bullshit, falsehoods and

"Science is merely the study of God’s creation"

Well, thanks for admitting that God created COVID, I suppose… I’m not sure why you think we should worship that psychopath, but at least you admit his wrongdoings.

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Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Re:2 Lies, bullshit, falsehoods and

Science is merely the study of God’s creation. The problem is, man is too proud to say those 3 words: “I don’t know”. Hence, some off the wall theories, like Darwin’s, are accepted (by some) as truth.

Hence, some off the wall theories, like the existence of God to explain what isn’t known, are accepted (by some) as truth.

FTFY

Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Lies, bullshit, falsehoods and

I’ll trust God as I cheer scientists that unwittingly continue to discover how HE does things.

Me too! I’m going to trust god as well that he’s ‘telling’ you people who are reluctant to get the vaccine in an attempt to ‘cull the herd’ of you dumb fucks. I’ll tell you, if this second wave of Covid takes the lion’s share of you fools out, I might think god actually exists and actually listened to me.

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That One Guy (profile) says:

Re: Practically the same thing really

Ah yes, ostracizing people because they were accused of belonging to a particular political ideology is definitely equivalent to telling plague rats(or gerbils apparently) that if they want to be around other people they’ll need to take the most minor of steps to reduce the risk they pose to everyone around them by getting stabbed by a needle twice.

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Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Practically the same thing really

Ah yes, because it’s only a needle that’s going into their arms.
The goal posts have been moved, and some have no problem with it. The purpose of a vaccine is to Prevent Infection not alleviate symptoms.

When is your book coming out, since you (and your cohorts) know everything there is to possibly know about this Novel Coronavirus, vaccines, efficacy rates, side effects, mortality rates vs. infection rates, etc.?

None of us knows everything about this virus, thus scientists and doctors are still studying it. In the meantime, people still have the right to think for themselves and decide if taking the vaccine is the right thing to do for their own health.

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That One Guy (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re: Practically the same thing really

Ah yes, because it’s only a needle that’s going into their arms.

Well of course I left out the microchips and the mark of the beast the vaccine also includes, I mean who doesn’t know about those at this point?

The goal posts have been moved, and some have no problem with it. The purpose of a vaccine is to Prevent Infection not alleviate symptoms.

Yeah, if you think that’s ‘moving the goal posts’ it’s only because you were grossly misinformed about vaccines, reducing infection rates has always been the primary point of vaccines. Cutting down on the spread and severity of diseases are why we have vaccines in the first place and as history shows they’ve been really good at that.

When is your book coming out, since you (and your cohorts) know everything there is to possibly know about this Novel Coronavirus, vaccines, efficacy rates, side effects, mortality rates vs. infection rates, etc.?

None of us knows everything about this virus, thus scientists and doctors are still studying it.

That’s not how it works. The fact that scientists and medical experts don’t know everything about a particular subject does not mean they don’t know anything and when it comes to diseases and how best to combat them they’ve got a lot of experience and knowledge to pull from, certainly a hell of a lot more than the nurgle cultists decrying vaccines.

In the meantime, people still have the right to think for themselves and decide if taking the vaccine is the right thing to do for their own health.

And less selfish and ignorant people have the right to tell you that you’re not welcome near them until you take the most basic steps to safeguard their wellbeing by getting vaccinated.

Whether vaccination or other acts you have a right to be stupid, what you don’t have is a right to put other people’s health and lives at risk against their wishes thanks to your stupidity.

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Rocky says:

Re: Re: Re: Practically the same thing really

Ah yes, because it’s only a needle that’s going into their arms.
The goal posts have been moved, and some have no problem with it. The purpose of a vaccine is to Prevent Infection not alleviate symptoms.

The goal posts hasn’t been moved, it’s just that people like you doesn’t seem to understand that science actually progress. The main purpose of a vaccine is to confer a protection against contracting a disease, this protection is never 100% so there is always a slight chance of getting infected. A study in 2015 found that people who got infected with A/H3N2 (influenza) even though they where vaccinated had reduced symptom severity, which when translated to SARS/Cov2 means that people who are vaccinated and still get infected may not necessarily need to seek medical help.

That you can’t take the time to understand and learn about something and make stupid arguments is wholly on you.

When is your book coming out, since you (and your cohorts) know everything there is to possibly know about this Novel Coronavirus, vaccines, efficacy rates, side effects, mortality rates vs. infection rates, etc.?

No one knows everything about the corona-virus, but evidently you know less than the average person here.

None of us knows everything about this virus, thus scientists and doctors are still studying it. In the meantime, people still have the right to think for themselves and decide if taking the vaccine is the right thing to do for their own health.

So everyone who can "think for themselves" think they know better than the available medical expertise? Because the medical expertise says "take the damn vaccine!".

Fucking plague-bearer.

This comment has been deemed insightful by the community.
Scary Devil Monastery (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re: Practically the same thing really

"…thus scientists and doctors are still studying it."

Proven theory; Vaccines help.
Proven theory; Amount of help vaccines provide.
Proven theory; Vaccines help with deviant strains of virus.
Unproven hypothesis; How much current vaccines help against new strains.

Yeah, doctors and scientists are still studying the full extent of the protection offered. That the vaccine protects a lot is not in question.

"In the meantime, people still have the right to think for themselves and decide if taking the vaccine is the right thing to do for their own health."

People have the right to be all sorts of malicious assholes. It’s just that if you insist on jeopardizing not only yourself but everyone else then we are equally free to disdain you for the disease-spreading plague rat you unbelievably aspire to be.

Only in america does this sort of twisted mindset exist.

Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Re:2 Practically the same thing really

Unproven hypothesis; How much current vaccines help against new strains.

Let’s not forget this proven theory:
the more a virus spreads, the more it mutates

I.e., even though vaccines can’t protect against every possible mutation, sufficient vaccination can prevent these more dangerous variants from coming into existence or spreading.

This comment has been deemed insightful by the community.
Stephen T. Stone (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re:

people still have the right to think for themselves

In my experience, people who tout “being a free thinker” as a major personality trait are the kind of people who end up sucked into cults, wrapped up in conspiracy theories, and scammed out of their money. You’re not a “free thinker” or else you’d pay attention to the scientists instead of some nutter on YouTube who found one document out of a million that confirmed their biases and made a video about it titled “PROOF THE GOVERNMENT IS TRYING TO MAKE YOU BILL GATES’ 5G BITCH”.

Being a free thinker means confronting, and possibly accepting, facts that discomfort your biases and change your worldview. Being a dumbass means looking only for those “facts” that comfort your biases and confirm your worldview. If you’re already predisposed to distrusting the government, you’re going to be susceptible to believing anyone who tells you the government is evil to the core in every way⁠—including its public health arm. Once they’ve got their hooks in you, you’re going to be “open-minded” enough to their bullshit that you’ll never question it.

Look for the facts that challenge you and make you uncomfortable. Question the facts that validate your biases, but don’t dismiss them only because they do so. And for fuck’s sake, stop giving undue deference to the people who only ever confirm your worldview; they will never challenge you.

This comment has been deemed insightful by the community.
PaulT (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re:2 Re:

Ironically, a lot of people who "think for themselves" and "do their own research" get suckered into having someone else think for them because they have decided that "mainstream" implies faked or biased. That can be the case, but sometimes the person lying to you for profit is the guy feeding you the alternative news.

People who actually think for themselves and do research often end up agreeing with the mainstream, because it’s literally true. Not always the case, of course, but if you ever find yourself in a situation where accredited experts are in almost total agreement but a bunch of folks with memes and "just asking questions" YouTube videos are telling you something that sounds nicer to you, chances are the latter are simply making a nice cut from being "controversial".

This comment has been deemed insightful by the community.
Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Re: Practically the same thing really

In the meantime, people still have the right to think for themselves and decide
if taking the vaccine is the right thing to do for their own health.

So, how do you expect to reach proper conclusions when you thinking is based on grossly false information? I’d actually have no problems with clueless idiots like yo dying out in Darwinian fashion cause they misjudged the potential harmful effects compared to Corona’s actual effects. If only you wouldn’t spread it in the time before you finally kick it.

This comment has been deemed insightful by the community.
Anonymous Coward says:

"For years now we’ve been pointing people to the detailed, data-driven research findings of Yochai Benkler, Robert Faris, and Hal Roberts in their book, Network Propaganda, which traced the actual flow of mis- and disinformation regarding the 2016 Presidential election, and found that the main vector (by far) was not Facebook, but Fox News. Yes, things would spread on Facebook eventually, but only after Fox News would make it into a story. A later study they did regarding disinformation about mail-in ballots found the same thing."
If only these conclusions were constantly referred to not only for health disinformation but also for other areas, including international politics, war, CIA/NSA commenters etc – people would be more resilient to this cheap propaganda.

This comment has been flagged by the community. Click here to show it.

Scary Devil Monastery (profile) says:

Re: Re: Yawn... oh look it's the big Fox boogie man again

True to form for the alt-right he’s both…and using the fact that the Tuskagee experiment made black people mistrust white doctors as a slur against black people.

It’s just the racist way of first making sure a minority had a grievance so they could later also blame the "mistrust" that minority ended up having against authority for subsequent ostracism.

This comment has been flagged by the community. Click here to show it.

CountDrewku says:

Re: Re: Re: Yawn... oh look it's the big Fox boogie man again

"and using the fact that the Tuskagee experiment made black people mistrust white doctors as a slur against black people."

So exactly how is that Fox news fault again? Are you just slow or do you have a bit of dyslexia? You need to work on your reading comprehension bud.

This comment has been flagged by the community. Click here to show it.

This comment has been flagged by the community. Click here to show it.

CountDrewku says:

Re: Re: Re:2 Yawn... oh look it's the big Fox boogie man agai

What facts?

All I see are children throwing around big words they don’t understand.

I think you should stop commenting since you’re obviously racist, misogynistic, homophobe, transphobe, bigot, neo-nazi, kkk member, white supremacist ist ist phobe phobe.

Boy this is great! I won the argument. Would you like to have some adult discourse or continue being a fool?

Anonymous Coward says:

Here in Australia, we also have a shitshow of a vaccine rollout. The biggest issue has been the constant trashing of the AstraZeneca vaccine – and this trashing has been coming from multiple different places.

This article provides some valuable insight. https://www.crikey.com.au/2021/07/23/trashing-astrazeneca-national-sport-not-national-saviour/

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