Trump, DOJ Claim ANTIFA, Other Extremists Are Hijacking Protests. DOJ Filings Show No Link To Outside Groups.
from the all-narrative,-no-facts dept
The Trump Administration has decided to give cops a pass on killing black people. Wait. Hear me out. The Blue Lives Matter administration began its term by declaring war on the general public if it refused to lick boot properly. And now ANTIFA is behind the riots and looting seen around the country.
On June 9th, the President tweeted that the elderly man shoved to the ground by Buffalo (NY) police officers could be an “ANTIFA provocateur.” The president cited facts not in evidence: a One America News piece of speculative fiction delivered by its in-house double agent — a reporter who also has written for Russian state-affiliated media outfit, Sputnik.
Bill Barr echoed these sentiments, claiming violent extremists were infiltrating protests, apparently making the underlying protests unmeaningful.
With the rioting that is occurring in many of our cities around the country, the voices of peaceful and legitimate protests have been hijacked by violent radical elements. Groups of outside radicals and agitators are exploiting the situation to pursue their own separate, violent, and extremist agenda.’
Barr said that there is evidence that those extremists include Antifa and other groups of different political persuasions, as well as “foreign actors playing all sides to exacerbate the violence.”
FBI Director Christopher Wray elaborated on this, noting that “these individuals have set out to sow discord and upheaval.”
This echoed what a senior Justice Department official told Fox News Wednesday about how the feds have seen signs of “very organized” coordination from “professional” agitators, some linked to Antifa.
The DOJ may be publicly supporting these wild-ass claims by administration officials (one of which is the President of the United States), but there’s nothing in the paperwork to support these allegations. The front mouths may be frothing about ANTIFA hijackings but for all their efforts, they haven’t found anything to corroborate their wishful thinking. Ryan Lucas of NPR has the receipts.
NPR has reviewed court documents of 51 individuals facing federal charges in connection with the unrest. As of Tuesday morning, none is alleged to have links to the antifa movement.
Of the cases brought so far, 20 involve allegations related to arson; 16 involve the illegal possession of a firearm, more often than not by a felon; another eight people face charges related to inciting a riot or civil disorder.
There is one case linked to an “extremist” movement, though. Three Nevada men facing criminal charges are allegedly part of the “Boogaloo” movement, which advocates — usually impartially — for violently overthrowing the government and engaging in another civil war of us (the people) vs. them (the government).
Unfortunately, this isn’t the narrative that plays to the voting base, so it’s been ignored by Bill Barr and President Trump in order to present protests against police violence as opportunistic anarchism meted out by far left extremists opposed to the current administration. Not that the facts matter. Bill Barr is still insisting this is probably an ANTIFA thing, even when there appears to be no evidence backing his claims.
In his Fox interview, Barr repeated his assertion that an array of extremist groups has been instigating the violence, although he did — as he has repeatedly since the unrest over Floyd’s death began — single out antifa as the primary culprit.
Investigations are, of course, ongoing. And they will presumably continue until the DOJ satisfies Barr’s unofficial directive. That’s why extremely stupid things are happening, like the FBI trying to talk a random twitter user into becoming an informant after he jokingly told the FBI he was a regional ANTIFA director.
There’s a narrative being pushed here and it’s one designed to focus law enforcement attention on the president’s perceived enemies — not anyone currently endangering lives/buildings with criminal acts. It’s meant to recast demonstrations against police violence as fronts for violent extremists. The Trump Administration is trying to neutralize something it can’t ever hope to fully control. Pretending this is all about ANTIFA allows the administration to pretend it isn’t part of the problem.
Filed Under: antifa, arrests, donald trump, propaganda, protests, william barr
Comments on “Trump, DOJ Claim ANTIFA, Other Extremists Are Hijacking Protests. DOJ Filings Show No Link To Outside Groups.”
Yet he still claims to be Republican, but is there a difference?
Does Trump’s infatuation with anti fascism blatantly declare that he is in fact pro fascist, or a fascist himself? Has anyone in his coterie mentioned this possible interpretation to him (if they did, did he either smile quietly, or giggle, or guffaw)?
When the acronym ANTIFA first started appearing I mistakenly read it as anti first amendment. After seeing it a few times I looked it up and realized my error. Though given Trump’s behavior my initial reading could have been correct. Maybe it actually means both.
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gaslighting
Usual suspects like TechDirt are pulling out all the stops to make the American public believe that Antifa doesn’t exist. It’s all a myth, there is no such organization. You’re deluded if you think there is.
Meanwhile, in downtown Seattle, Antifa has taken over capital hill, including city all and the 6th precinct police division, Antifa-branded Twitter accounts are sending out messages asking for food and "more armed activists."
Re: gaslighting
So you must be Profa.
Re: gaslighting
and "more armed activists."
They’re just exercising their 2A rights. One would think conservatives would be totally on board with that.
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Re: gaslighting
Nobody is claiming that ANTIFA doesn’t exist. Only that they are just a bunch of militant people paid to turn peaceful protests into violent altercations so that those who paid them can point at the protests and say "See?! Bad!".
In other words, ANTIFA is a tool of the republican government, loosely organized via chat apps and used to make their opposition look bad. But we know better.
Re: Re: gaslighting
"Nobody is claiming that ANTIFA doesn’t exist."
It doesn’t exist as a coherent organisation with a structure, rules or leadership. That’s why it’s such a handy boogeyman for the right – they can claim anyone is a member.
Re: Re: gaslighting
"In other words, ANTIFA is a tool of the republican government, loosely organized via chat apps and used to make their opposition look bad. But we know better."
Not quite.
We do know that the only times someone self-designating as "Antifa" called for violence in online media it turned out to be a white supremacy group trying to turn protests violent.
We know a few white supremacists and outright neo-nazis got caught preparing weapons to use while marching in the black lives matter protest.
The republican government – that is to say, Trump – simply listened to the propaganda which had been churned out of some white supremacy echo chamber and then got caught up by OANN. At which point Trump went into twitter hysteria about it and his yes-men all stood up and started singing from his hymn sheet.
The reason people are throwing around the idea that the republicans are paying supremacists to do this shit is because most people would assume the US president, irrespective of how evil they might think he is, wouldn’t just twitter out every halfbaked white supremacy propaganda snippet he’d seen on one of the very worst alt-right conspiracy theory bullhorns.
Re: gaslighting
Meanwhile, in downtown Seattle, Antifa has taken over capital hill, including city all and the 6th precinct police division, Antifa-branded Twitter accounts are sending out messages asking for food and "more armed activists."
There is only one person here "gaslighting" and it’s you.
https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/welcome-to-the-capitol-hill-autonomous-zone-where-seattle-protesters-gather-without-police/
The police left and a bunch of peaceful protesters are continuing to have peaceful gatherings without the cops. They’re showing films and talking about how to build a better society. Seems like a good thing.
There remains no evidence that it’s "antifa." It’s a bunch of (mostly young) people protesting and pushing for change.
The supposed "antifa has taken over city hall" story is not that. A city council member with keys to the fucking building, invited a small group of protesters inside city hall, and they went in for one whole hour and left.
That’s not antifa. And it’s not a take over of city hall.
You’re the one gaslighting here. Or you’re a fucking moron.
Re: Re: gaslighting
I live 15-ish blocks to the west of where George Floyd died, I am blocks from the 5th precinct where there was a LOT of activity after the 3rd precinct fell.
I have chased asshats off my street trying to light trash cans, garages/fences or cars on fire and watched the instigators as this happened around me.
Antifa wasn’t here as far as anyone could tell on my block, but everyone who doesn’t live here sure keeps telling me they were. I did catch a bunch of cars that were driving around without license plates moving their rioting and arson activity around to avoid the national guard and cops out. The next morning the report from National Guard/Police in the press briefings was those were violence tourists attempting to start a full blown race war. Some from out of state, many from third-tier suburbs and the boonies. A lot of AR-15s confiscated from cops stopping those cars, and more than one of those trucks/cars without plates had QAnon stickers that I saw.
I guess antifa is a better boogey man than the more nuanced reality happening. Sure getting sick of assholes telling me what I literally witnessed though.
Re: Re: Re: gaslighting
So are you really pushing for reforms so that kind of thing doesn’t happen again?
Or are you just complaining about vandals and ensuring that riots happen again?
Re: Re: Re:2 gaslighting
I didn’t see you at the protests. What the fuck are you doing?
Re: Re: Re:2 gaslighting
Maybe read the comment you’re responding to more carefully, Baron.
dfed was saying there were no Antifa in evidence – rather, he was seeing more evidence of right-wing provocateurs than anything else.
The complaining was about people trying to gaslight people about the whole antifa thing.
Re: Re: Re: gaslighting
"Some from out of state, many from third-tier suburbs and the boonies. A lot of AR-15s confiscated from cops stopping those cars, and more than one of those trucks/cars without plates had QAnon stickers that I saw."
So basically a bunch of alt-right asshats in pickup trucks with Qanon stickers stirring shit up?
It’s the stickers part getting to me. I guess down south they’d be forgetting to remove the confederate flag instead, while driving around pretending to be angry black men.
Someone seriously needs to tell the racists a proper blackface act isn’t just about painting your face black. They need to lose the white sheets and hood too.
Re:
Antifascism is a philosophy. While antifascist groups may have “antifa” in their names, no broader “antifa” organization exists that controls all such groups. They are stand-alone complexes — that is, they are autonomous groups with similar goals who act independently of one another.
[citation needed]
Assume that actual antifascists run those accounts. What, then, is the big deal with them asking for food and “armed activists”? The Second Amendment guarantees a right to bear arms to all Americans, including ones with whom you have a political disagreement; the people in the autonomous zone might want guns for protection from people who want to do them harm for being there. And last I checked, buying and sharing food with other people doesn’t violate any laws.
Re: gaslighting
Ummm…. I live in downtown Seattle, and can, with 1st hand knowledge, say you are full of BULLSHIT!!!
1) The occupants in city hall were invited into city hall by a counsolmember who had a key to the front door.
2) there is no 6th precinct.
3) I just drove by CHAZ today and it seems like it would be a great party if I were 20 years younger.
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Re: Re: gaslighting
most interesting thing is that as soon as took over, they built walls to prevent people entering and started vetting people before the let them in.. sorta ironic if you think about it?
Re: Re: Re: gaslighting
Wrong wrong wrong wrong wrong!!!
Nobody took over anything, and if that is all you got, then leave now as you have already drank the kool-aid. Or at the minimum, quite believing what you see on Fox News.
There is a makeshift wall that really does nothing more than prevent vehicle traffic from entering the area, which is really the same thing that SPD had already done.
More importantly, NOBODY is there vetting people before entering. Whatever you hear is not true. I can walk up and go through the "wall" and participate in the protests and festivities without anybody stoping me, vetting me, nor asking any questions whatsoever.
What is really happening there… conversation cafes, teach-ins, documentary movies about racial injustice, spaghetti pot-lucks, food trucks, etc, etc, etc. Hell, local pizza places in the neighborhood have been giving away free slices!
So again, quit listening to people who are trying their damndest to put a political spin on it making it sound like the boogey man has invaded Seattle and we are all being assimilated into the Borg.
There is no disputing what I say as I am here on the ground observing what is happening. If I was 20 years younger, I would be there myself participating in everything that is peacefully taking place.
Re: Re: Re: gaslighting
Educate yourself, as it seems like the city authorities know what they are doing, unlike your president.
Re: Re: Re:2 gaslighting
Yeah, but "everybody" knows that city authorities in Seattle are a bunch of libtard antifa symps. /sarcasm
In any case, I appreciate your efforts trying to open closed minds. I’m too tired of that battle right now.
Re: gaslighting
"Usual suspects like TechDirt are pulling out all the stops to make the American public believe that Antifa doesn’t exist. It’s all a myth, there is no such organization."
Who is the leader of this organisation?
Who are the other managers of this organisation?
Where is the headquarters of this organisation?
Where is the website of this organisation?
What are the stated goals of this organisation?
Words have meanings. Apparently you don’t know the meaning of ‘organisation’.
Re: Re: gaslighting
"Apparently you don’t know the meaning of ‘organisation’."
Well, to be fair white supremacists have always insisted that people opposed to fascism are part of a massive organization. The usual culprit they used to haul to the table is the Global Jewish Conspiracy – but these days they only mention that in their echo chambers or when they try to actually explain how "anti-fascists" are out to Destroy The World As We Know It.
"Who is the leader of this organisation?"
"But Obama!"
…honestly, it fits their narrative that the Bad Black Man who touched them in the White house is the leader of the global conspiracy opposing them.
Re: gaslighting
"Antifa-branded Twitter accounts are sending out messages asking for food and "more armed activists."
Like these?
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/twitter-fake-antifa-acount-white-supremacists-removal/
Re: gaslighting
I don’t know of anyone saying that Antifa doesn’t exist at all. It’s true that there is no leadership or singular organization for the Antifa movement, but the movement does exist, and some small organizations may fall within it.
[citation needed] Also, even if true, that doesn’t prove that a single organization for Antifa exists. At most, that just proves the movement exists and some people in it may be dangerous.
You’re the only one gaslighting here, not TechDirt.
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Elderly man pushed
Watching the video I see the man reaching his hand towards the officer, looks like near his belt.
Anyone reaching into the personal space of another, especially near the other persons weapons should expect to be swiftly distanced.
Put yourself in that situation, you are carrying weapons, an unknown person who is angry at you is reaching towards them. What would you do?
Say polite words and hope he does not take your weapon and use it on you?
Re: Elderly man pushed
Ugh back away. Easy.
Re: Elderly man pushed
If that man was a 75 year old I would take a step back, 100% thwarting any effort to grab my things. Not shove him to the ground and put him in the hospital, a totally predictable outcome.
Re: Elderly man pushed
Lemme get this straight….
The big tough cop, with a bullet-proof vest, helmet, sidearm, taser, pepper-spray, baton, second gun, self-defense training, surrounded by other cops…was afraid of a septuagenarian?
Not for nothing, but this sounds like a useless pussy that the force doesn’t need anyways.
Re: Re: Elderly man pushed
More importantly, it suggests that the cop didn’t keep his gun safety on – or kept it in a position such that a doddery old man can use the gun he just wrestled in an instant.
Speaks volumes about how trigger happy these knuckle draggers have become, really.
Re: Elderly man pushed
Do you have any justification for continuing to hold the man down like that for minutes after he had no pulse?
Also, putting someone in a knee chokehold is the opposite of swiftly distancing them.
If I was in that situation, I would back off, push them away, grab the gun myself, or grab the offending hand. I would not put them in a knee chokehold. I certainly wouldn’t—and I can’t emphasize this enough—continue to hold him there after I can no longer find a pulse! Seriously, what good would that do? And does reaching for someone’s weapon deserve death?
Bill Barr echoed these sentiments, claiming violent extremists were infiltrating protests, apparently making the underlying protests unmeaningful.
This thing, right here. So the logic is, people with a legitimate grievance (to insanely understate it) engage in legitimate protest, but since "outside forces" have "hijacked" these protests to do their own shtick on the side, this renders the legitimate protest null and void. The people making the very claim that protest has been co-opted by unwelcome parties then implies that the issues of the "real protesters" are moot due to this.
This is the narrative they have been pushing. I can see how it resonates with their fanbase since, like most of their platform, makes absolutely no sense.
Good job!
i dont think there has ever been a more paranoid leader of our Great Nation, or any more paranoid leaders of our security services than we have at present! i must say that they seemed to have been getting worse over the years, when under previous leaders but jeez! atm there’s more than a ‘red under every bed’ as in’ the day’, more like the only ones who are not trying to destroy the government, the country, the planet are this whole bunch of paranoid fuckers who want everyone dead except them and all their wealthy, biased friends! what a way to think, to behave, to pretend it’s right, it’s ok!!
Re: Re:
you are wrong about one thing, they don’t want us dead, they want us passive, not complaining, paying all the fees/fines they can come up with to increase their status even farther…
If the Billionaires have made over $500 million during the pandemic, while most households earning less than $40K a year are suffering job and healthcare losses that are leaving them with nothing, you can see what they really want from us…
Our money, tears, and endintured servitutude to further increase the wealth of the 1/2 of the top 1% of the individuals in the world (who at this point have more wealth than the lower 50% of the population combined… think about that a handfull of individuals have more money that 1/2 of the worlds population combined…
What would the world look like if that wealth was evenly distributed? Everyone would have enough to buy a house, a new car, and live without working for the rest of their life off the earnings (assuming they don’t splurge). So what really needs to happen, Purge Day 1%… we’ve seen the movies but in this scenario the rest of the world target the 1%… sigh we can dream can’t we (and while we do Bezos made another $10M doing nothing…)
Re: Re:
"…i dont think there has ever been a more paranoid leader of our Great Nation, or any more paranoid leaders of our security services than we have at present!"
…short memories. I present to you Nixon, Hoover and McCarthy.
The major difference appears to be that all three of those were far more competent at their jobs than the current crop or clowns.
Any organised protest movement, any group that defends minorities against racists abusing the machinery of the government and the far right will be labelled terrorists and the intelligence and police services will do whatever they can do dismantle them even if they need to incite violent action to justify doing so. It doesn’t matter how much good they do, it doesn’t matter that the aim of the group is to try and thwart fascist groups, if they seem like they aspire to changing the status quo, they’ll be smeared, if not outright murdered as the leadership of the Black Panthers were.
Re:
Protests send the message that the status quo must change. But some people have invested into the status quo so hard that nothing pisses them off more than other people asking for a change in, or showing that we can make a change to, that status quo — and change it for the better, for the good of all people. To wit: the Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone, which pisses off so many right-wingers that they’ve resorted to lying their asses off about what is essentially a hippie commune.
Trump's Mirror
Given that we know about Trump’s Mirror (that he accuses others of what he does/thinks/acts), it is very telling that he says that antifa is running as agents provocateur.
Re:
The more likely suspects in such provocations are:
Antifascists might be responsible for some of the property damage and all — nothing’s impossible, only improbable — but I’d wager good money that the other three groups I named have destroyed far more property.
Re: Re: Re:
I literally live in the middle of this, and it is very likely based on what I witnessed that all three of your bullet points were happening.
But my favorite moronic tell from these asshats was that so many of them decided to take the plates off their cars and drive around causing their trouble in those cars, during curfew, with the largest law-enforcement task force deployed in the history of Minnesota concentrated in 50 square city blocks.
That takes a special kind of idiot.
Re: Re: Re: Re:
"That takes a special kind of idiot."
Unfortunately not exactly a rare one. I mean, racism is a very easy way to explain the whole world. It’s an attractive religion for the very simple.
HOLY SHIT! LOOK AT ALL THE HORRIFYING ACTS PERPETUATED BY ANTIFA IN MINNEAPOLIS!!!
Re: Re:
*Perpetrated. Ducking autocorrect.
Re: Re:
What flashed across my mind for a second there was the image of some white chonky redneck neckbeard with a "confederate forever" T-shirt screaming "Oh god the ni___rs are dancing with white women!!!" in a cracking falsetto voice…
The next image flashing across was that of that talking head carlson from Fox running that video in the background and talking about "Antifa military training". Then I remembered Trump’s tweets.
It’s official, people. We’re living in a dark political sitcom. And it’s not one of the funny british ones.
Re: Re: Re:
I mean, if you wanted evidence of terrible and nefarious antifa actions in Minneapolis you can watch that and think "Clearly these are outside agitator because they’re not dancing to Prince, The Time or Doomtree."
Re: Re: Re: Re:
""Clearly these are outside agitator because they’re not dancing to Prince, The Time or Doomtree.""
Hmm…no, I stand by my previous assertion. The type of person who drank the propaganda of "Anti-fascists" being a terrorist organization to be dealt with as if they were the resurrection of Al-Quaeda is more likely to trigger spontaneously to the image of white and black people dancing together than to anything having to do with actual words.
And let’s face it, when the Supreme Leader starts twittering out how a doddering 75-year old being brutalized by a gang of young and strong police officers is probably a terrorist plant then there simply is no image innocent enough for the rabid Cult of Trump, some of whom would, by now, argue for gas chambers for the undesirables if the orange wannabe-Kim-Jong-Un in the white house suggested it.
Well, he's half right...
In his Fox interview, Barr repeated his assertion that an array of extremist groups has been instigating the violence,
There is indeed, they’re called ‘the police’, maybe you’ve seen pictures or video of them instigating all sorts of violence?
… Oh, right, that doesn’t count because police violence is just part of the job and if someone didn’t want to be beaten/pepper-sprayed/murdered they shouldn’t have annoyed a cop.
FIxed
Blue lies matter. FIFY
No comment
Isn’t it like SOP that whenever the press asks about an investigation, that often, no investigation will be confirmed or denied, and certainly no details would be released or discussed. Barr has been vague, but couldn’t even vague reference jeopardize the investigation, like we are told about literally every other investigation on public interest?
And what really cracks me up is the failure of anyone, whether politically biased, or earnestly fearful that antifa mobs are going to descend on their town, to make even a nascent search to find out anything about antifa. Being that their overarching goal is to prevent the spread of fascist and racist ideology, by any means necessary, why would they show up ready for a fight when they agree with the point of the rally? Unless neo-nazis and the KKK plan on counter-protesting or disrupting BLM, antifa has no reason to show up any where as anything other than ordinary supporters of BLM. Antifa doesn’t believe in violence as a first line tactic, but it is a tactic they will use if they think necessary. Just like every other movement, right down to the suffragettes.