Yet More Evidence Shows No Link Between Video Games And Actual Violence
from the outlier dept
Well, well, well. With the NRA planning to blame violent video games and movies, and eager grandstanding politicians, pundits and some members of an angry public ready to do the same, it seems like it might be useful to look at some actual data.
Senator Jay Rockefeller — one of the grandstandingest grandstanders on this particular issue — has already introduced a bill demanding that the National Academy of Sciences “study the impact of violent video games and other content on children.” The speed with which this was introduced suggests that it was already sitting in a desk drawer, just waiting for a tragedy to exploit.
But, the thing is, we’ve got a ton of evidence already. The moral panic crew always claims that there are studies that support their argument that violent video games are bad, but that’s not true. Every single study they cite tends to either have serious methodological problems, or to show something other than claimed (such as the fact that immediately after playing a violent video game, gamers may feel slightly more aggressive — but with no evidence this lasts or leads to violence). A few years ago, a very thorough review of all of the research trying to connect video games to violence showed that there was no real evidence of any real world impact. Instead, what they found was that some studies used “poorly standardized and unreliable measure of aggression” to make their arguments, but that no study had shown any real world impact. Furthermore, in going through all the research, they concluded that “Overall, effects were negligible, and we conclude that media violence generally has little demonstrable effect on aggressive behavior.”
Even the American Psychological Association, who had, in the past, warned about violent video games, recently walked back that warning, after it, too, reviewed a whole bunch of studies and found nothing to support the claims that violent video games lead to increased violence. The one possible exception was that for “a small minority with pre-existing personality or mental health problems,” video games might possibly exacerbate the condition. But, the problem there was more on the mental health side, rather than the video game side:
“Violent video games are like peanut butter,” said Christopher J. Ferguson, of Texas A&M International University. “They are harmless for the vast majority of kids but are harmful to a small minority with pre-existing personality or mental health problems.”
He added that studies have revealed that violent games have not created a generation of problem youngsters.
“Recent research has shown that as video games have become more popular, children in the United States and Europe are having fewer behavior problems, are less violent and score better on standardized tests,” Ferguson, a guest editor for the journal, explained.
That same study also showed that much of the research shows that video games can actually be quite useful to children.
Finally, the Washington Post recently published a Ten-country comparison of video game spending to gun-related murders. Let me know if you can spot the outlier.
Filed Under: research, studies, video games, violence
Comments on “Yet More Evidence Shows No Link Between Video Games And Actual Violence”
the problem is, no one will ever be able to convince those who dont want to be convinced. when there is one thought and one thought only, in a person’s mind or a person has only one opinion that isn’t open to change, no matter how much evidence is presented to them, it will be ignored. the old ‘head in the sand’ syndrome that seems to be so popular amongst politicians, especially the ones that want to be associated with a really important issue, that ends up in the way they want, obviously
Yet more evidence that it does!
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/11/30/violent_video_games_mess_with_your_head/
You’re just on this because your fanboy-trolls always respond like rabid ankle-biters, yapping their heads off: “I play video games alla time and I ain’t never killed nobody!” (And it tweaks others to protest, but right now I’m just pre-tweaking the fanboys; it’s a vice, I admit.)
Playing ANY video game is a waste of time. They’ve evolved from heroic role-playing into sheer slaughter. Pretending you’re killing people CAN’T be good.
Re: Yet more evidence that it does!
Blue, learn your video game history. Some text adventure games allowed you to slaughter people with impending results…I’m sure that You don’t realize that the typical Japanese RPG game consists of you playing a character battling evil and level up on demons and capa. In most terms those translate to mutated critters and evil spirits you rid that world of.
I cite my dear autistic brother who loves whooping my ass at Mortal Kombat II each Christmas when we break out the SNES. Seriously the sweetest person you would ever meet.
Re: Yet more evidence that it does!
Playing ANY video game is a waste of time. They’ve evolved from heroic role-playing into sheer slaughter. Pretending you’re killing people CAN’T be good.
If you pull too many things out of your arse you’ll have hemorrhoids ootb!
There has been plenty of slaughter in gaming history. Except that now the graphics can actually follow the bloodbath.
In any case, you’ve added yet another bad trait to the long list that is associated with you: fanatic moralism. Keep building, meybe we will conside you the worst example of a human being at some point 😉
Yet more evidence that it does!
Fuck off, you uninteresting little choad.
Yet more evidence that it does!
…I take back what I said earlier.
I will get flamed for this, but if the public is looking for someone to blame the only thing people have to do is look into a mirror.
How many Mormons go on rampages and kill anything that is moving?
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“How many Mormons go on rampages and kill anything that is moving?”
Is this sarcasm or are you seriously that ignorant?
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“I will get flamed for this, but if the public is looking for someone to blame the only thing people have to do is look into a mirror.
How many Mormons go on rampages and kill anything that is moving?”
If by “kill” you mean “marry” and by “anything” you mean “any teenage girl,” the answer is “some.”
Yet more evidence that it does!
Life is a waste of time, everyone dies and few really do anything to change the world.
Recreational reading is a waste of time. Watching a movie is a waste of time. TV is a waste of time. Going for a vacation is a waste of time. Sleeping is a waste of time. And I could go on and on and on.
Honestly, the pleasures and joys of life are what give life meaning. A video game for many of us is much more than just fragging aliens, monsters and soldiers, they are a new artistic medium for telling story, immersing people into a new creative experience. If you don’t enjoy it, that’s fine, you can do whatever else it is that you do enjoy.
Play Backgammon, maybe, but you’re still “wasting your time”.
Life is not always about work, raising children, creating children, and etc. How we enjoy life, is every bit as important as how we sustain it.
The conclusion that video games can be violent, thus today’s youth are becoming more violent as a result is flawed. If that were a true statement we would find MORE cases of violence throughout our community increasing as each year goes by. Not less, as many other studies are showing.
The media is sensationalizing everything, and unscrupulous cretins are taking advantage of tragedy to shove their agenda down everyone’s throat.
Yet more evidence that it does!
What the fuck am I reading?
Re: Yet more evidence that it does!
An attempt by one man to smash his own record for the speed at which posts get turned to pink. I think he just beat his PB!
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Are you saying that people go criminally insane because they’re not Mormons?
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I think he is just parrotting Huckabees “more religion will take care of the gunshooting” and adding his own spin to it. It is wrong on so many levels, but if you want more christian religion in schools it is a way to gain some support.
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So we should all go join a cult now and give up our freedoms? Great logic.
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Mormons are a cult that makes you give up freedoms? Huh. And here I thought I didn’t drink beer or smoke because they were just flat out bad for me.
On a serious note, I do wonder if he (the original post) is trying to equate following a religion (regardless of how odd the world in general feels about it) to having better or more entrenched morals, which result in at least a bit less homicidal rampages than otherwise.
Yet more evidence that it does!
“Pretending you’re killing people CAN’T be good.”
It’s better than actually killing people!
Of course, if you want to be the subject, I’d be delighted to test your theory out…on you, OotB. 😉
No evidence?
So does that mean that owning a gun causes violence?
Re: No evidence?
It certainly makes it more likely that any violence that happens will be potentially lethal, and possibly affect more people.
Re: No evidence?
Having easy access to a gun will likely increase the chance that the violence you commit is gun violence. Do you need evidence for that?
Re: Re: No evidence?
So I guess people with a history of violence should not have access to guns … ummmm yup – that is a law.
But it’s totally cool that they can have knives – right?
What about scissors? Are they allowed to run with them?
It must be ban guns bash NRA day here at TD.
Remember 2 might be required one day to keep the government from screwing you over on 1,4, and 5.
Re: Re:
It must be ban guns bash NRA day here at TD.
I must have missed the part of this article that says to ban guns, and bashes the NRA. Maybe you could quote it for us.
Re: Re:
Conflating any one who calls for gun control with some one who is calling to ban all guns? Check.
Idiot confirmed, please ignore.
Peanut Butter
Peanut butter is dangerous to people with pre-existing mental problems? 🙂
Re: Peanut Butter
Peanut butter is dangerous to people with pre-existing mental problems? 🙂
Exactly what I was wondering…
Hmm, here’s a chart that shows another possible variable:
I really want to change the x axis on those graphs from video game consumption from “Miles between Capital City and Washington D.C.”, as the correlation is like .55.
Clearly, proximity to Washington D.C. correlates strongly with gun-related murders.
Hm… I wonder if it correlates to news coverage of gun-related murders…
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I think we have a winner here… If you want media coverage, go murder people with guns in USA. That will make people remember you!
Yet more evidence that it does!
So I read your study. It says some study group reacted differently to things that aren’t even violence at all, let alone violence initiated by them.. (“violent words” I guess?) after having played video games, and the effects were dimished but not completely gone after one week. Whats that supposed to tell us? That violent video games (that probably have violent words in them) make people used to hearing violent words for a while? Whoop di do.
Yet more evidence that it does!
“Pretending you’re killing people CAN’T be good.”
You mean like playing coyboys and indians or something? Sheesh making games out of pretending you are killing people probably predates history.
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MOUNTAIN MEADOWS MASSACRE
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These guys…
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mountain_Meadows_massacre
Response to: Anonymous Coward on Dec 19th, 2012 @ 1:32pm
What will we need to fight government troops when they come en mass? The Taliban and Al Qaida each have RPG’s light, medium and heavy machineguns. Various types of grenades, missile launchers, mortors, body armor, countless explosives and firearms ranging from pistols to full auto assault rifles. so if your hunting rifle can beat back the oppressive facist state troops you better hope it doesn’t fall into the terrorists hands or we’re all doomed
Re: Response to: Anonymous Coward on Dec 19th, 2012 @ 1:32pm
You forgot a phased plasma rifle in a 40 watt range
Yet more evidence that it does!
Fuck Off you Loser !
Next up you assholes will try to ban the music I play for fun.
Not quite; you’re assuming an equivalence among all video games played in the U.S. Not all video games involve killing, and not all video games that do involve killing feature extreme, graphic violence. Those would have to be filtered out of the equation to justify your statement.
It would be interesting to see a similar chart that compares to consumption of violent to nonviolent entertainment.
I had no clue people with mental issues were forbidden peanut butter!
Re: Re:
peanut butter – the gateway weapon
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Well, religion and homicidal rampages are often bedfellows.. So maybe it’s just mormons he’s thinking of?
Not really fair though, there aren’t enough mormons.. If everyone was a mormon, the serial killers would be too.
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No just pointing out that a subgroup of people inside a larger group is not generating so many killers and violent acts for some reason, it doesn’t matter if they are a religious group, crazies or whatever, what do matter is the fact that they seem not to generate so many dysfunctional people. They live and are exposed to the same environment others are, so it must be behavioral(cultural).
Yet more evidence that it does!
It’s a bad faith argument to suggest that pointing your finger at someone and shouting “bang” is the equivalent of playing a graphic survival-horror video game.
Re: Yet more evidence that it does!
No it’s not. Why are you buying your kids those games anyway?
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Never heard of the Mountain Meadows Massacre? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mountain_Meadows_massacre
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Or at least not dysfunctional in that particular manner..
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Well Canadians also don’t seem to create a lot of mass murderers, the Japanese are exposed and fantasize with violent acts more than most and still when they chose to do harm to someone is generally suicide, they do it to themselves more often they they do it to others, South Koreans do the same thing, Muslim Asian countries on the other hand apparently generate a lot of mass killers.
Cults generally create violent people, but Mormons seem to be an exception to that rule.
People just need to look at those groups and try to recognize what is that they are doing that inhibit the aggressive part in us all and focus that elsewhere, because something they must be doing it right and we wrong and I very much would like to find it and see it applied so maybe we don’t have to live in these interesting times any longer than we have to.
Curiosity:
“May you live in interesting times”
“May the powerful note you”
“May your wishes be granted”
Response to: Anonymous Coward on Dec 19th, 2012 @ 1:32pm
Yes, 2 is long gone. If the government lets you have anything these days, it’s because they know you can’t hurt them with it.
You can hurt each other with what they allow you, but certainly not the millitary.
Yet more evidence that it does!
Who said anything about video games? We are talking about pretending here.
Re: Yet more evidence that it does!
Er — the author of the post to which you responded.
Re: Re: Yet more evidence that it does!
If he had said the manner in which you pretend to kill people in video games CAN’T be good, that would be a different story since some people might actually hold that opinion, it’s a far weaker statement anyway, and is just
the same as saying he thinks violent video can’t be good..
Re: Re: Re: Yet more evidence that it does!
(and he thinks people pretend they are pacman in them)
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Well Canadians also don’t seem to create a lot of mass murderers, the Japanese are exposed and fantasize with violent acts more than most and still when they chose to do harm to someone is generally suicide, they do it to themselves more often they they do it to others, South Koreans do the same thing, Muslim Asian countries on the other hand apparently generate a lot of mass killers.
Cults generally create violent people, but Mormons seem to be an exception to that rule.
People just need to look at those groups and try to recognize what is that they are doing that inhibit the aggressive part in us all and focus that elsewhere, because something they must be doing it right and we wrong and I very much would like to find it and see it applied so maybe we don’t have to live in these interesting times any longer than we have to.
There is a mechanism at work, there is a pattern we just need to look for it now.
Curiosity:
“May you live in interesting times”
“May the powerful note you”
“May your wishes be granted”
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It’s society. culture and biology, not whether or not a gun is legal. Any comparison with European nations is iffy at best.The most biologically and developmentally adventuresome and contrary personalities of those nations left during the colonial period, taking much of their genetics with them, and sought their fortunes elsewhere in the new world. Many of their descendants are in the US. What works and is accepted in there will not necessarily work and be accepted in the US.
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“May the Force be with you.”
“May the Schwartz be with you.”
Re: Re:
May all your showers be golden.
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“because something they must be doing it right and we wrong”
Thats a pretty big leap. These groups have their own set of “issues” that you might not want to trade for. Japan has a plague of suicide and many Mormons (and offshoots especially) have serious problems of their own.
I think we have our share of mass murderers in Canada.. We do have far less population.. Although it’s hard to say anything bad about Canada, of course we are awesome hehe
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That is exactly why I said we need to look into it to see what mechanisms exists and how they work.
Understanding how things work is the first step to design better systems.
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Well, honestly, the only congress pushed thing that was ever SOMETGING good was the request for the ESRB rating system. To this day, the ratings have not varied in one way or another. It’s quite reasonable compared to the MPAA. However, that’s when we had a pair presidents in a row who didn’t have an agenda. Bush Snr. and Bill Clinton.
The problem could be on patents, but not entirely so. The big question I have is how many people have taken the ESRB seriously as of late when the comparable rating system made by the MPAA keeps changing its own standards as to what determines an R rating??
Too much jacking around on standards may descebsitize children a lot quicker if some of the ratings are changed on an annual basis. It’s up to parents to do heavy research into a game or movie before you let them watch it or play it.
Now, were violent video games the cause of a lunatic’s rampage? Not likely. Because the media outside of Techdirt and a few other opinion pieces in blogs, I cannot get an analysis on the Newton shooter done properly as major media sources already have gotten his problem “correct”…They’ve blamed autism as his cause because, well, I guess the world needs a scapegoat…There is no better scapegoat in the eyes congress as violent videogames.
Just a bit of a jarring bit of analogy:
Congress is to violent video games as CNN and FoxNews Network are to autism.
Yet more evidence that it does!
In fact, I certainly wouldn’t equate them at all. Video games are much more fictional stories than they are pretending “you” are doing something, I think.. You don’t pretend you are doing your what the game character is doing, it’s more like an movie that responds to your control.
Apart from all that, though I just don’t think the statement that pretending you are killing someone can’t be good is correct.
Re: Yet more evidence that it does!
When I play Fallout 3/New Vegas, that is exactly what I do.
Re: Re: Yet more evidence that it does!
I guess you might be one of the ones with a peanut allergy.
Re: Yet more evidence that it does!
Well as an absolute statement I would have to agree with you, but I think it’s clear in the context that it isn’t meant as an absolute, but to apply to a specific style of video game.
Re: Re: Yet more evidence that it does!
Right, he was trying to say that video games are bad because you are pretending you are killing people in them, but pretending you are killing people is only bad if it’s in a video game.
Yet More Evidence That it Does!
Follow this link, also covering the Yang Wang study. Scroll to the comments and read some examples of deeper analysis of the findings. http://www.dailytech.com/AntiGaming+Groups+Fund+Study+on+Violent+Gamings+Changes+in+Brain+Activity/article23435.htm
Every few years, some tragedy provides the fodder to start this insane witch hunt again. Those that want to make rules you have to live your life by are all eager to tell you that you can’t do this or that because that is the source of cause.
Where do you want to start? Book burnings of the Nazi era? Middle ages book burnings over hearsay? How about comic books? Or the campaign to remove unapproved books out of school and public libraries because they don’t meet some imagined standard. Sex mentions because it might give the kids ideas? (most of the time because they didn’t get the birds and bees talk at home, they learned it on the bathroom walls and pages of Playboy and Penthouse.) Violent movie themes? Now how about video games?
Exactly where in all this do they address the lack of psychological help in the forum of public access for those that don’t have the money? Or the good lawyer Jack Thomson that eventually got disbarred over the constant drum of bad video games that cost the state of Florida millions of dollars to defend (and lose) bad laws trying to control something that never was the problem to begin with.
Let me mention, I play the very games that are supposed to be the trigger on this. I have no desire to go shoot someone in real life. I’ve no axe to grind that makes me feel this is the sole and only solution. In fact, after playing I find my aggression level is lower. I just worked it out shooting up the bad guys.
If someone can not tell the real difference between a video game with a reset and real life, they got more problems that removing the ability to play a game will cure. Justification can be found in the mind for whatever you truly desire, no matter how warped. Take away guns, how hard is it to buy a knife or even make one if one can’t be bought?
In the graphic, they fail to make a few points. One is that other than China most of the countries in the graphic don’t have the population base the US has. It’s an uneven presentation of facts.
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Riiight…
So wudja think of that totally awesome remake of Red Dawn?
Did the ushers catch ya fapping, or were ya smart enough to wait ’til after and wank in the theater washroom?
Yet more evidence that it does!
In some cases maybe if the person is mentally disabled but the majority of us know right from wrong.
I’ve always known killing is wrong for long as I can remember. Why? Because my parents took the time to sit me down and tell me that it is and why.
I grew up in the 90’s and yes I had all the bloody games I could get my hands on. Realistic no but still it’s what they represented that I knew was fantasy and not reality.
The thing is bad shit is going to happen through out history no matter what we do. There will be serial killers,rapist,psychopaths,terrorist, and whatever else. There are kids being abused right now and they may or may not turn into bad parents themselves someday. It’s sad that this happens but it’s just the way it is.
I suspect in time as we progress more into this technological rich era we’re moving towards more and more we will be able to stop a lot of these defects in our brains before birth. Right now they’re far too complex for us to fully understand but we’re working on it.
If anything is to blame it’s human error and flaws in our very design. This is a fact that is very measurable and can be seen most easily in someone that suffers brain damage. Lost memory,new habits,new moods,and pretty much a completely different person than before.
Putting the blame on video games is just a scape goat for those that are too lazy or greedy to invest their time and money in researching the real issues. It’s far more easy to say hey this guy played such and such game and now hes a killer than very costly and time consuming neurological research.
I for one will never look at the easy way our because if we all give up that easy we’ll never evolve into the far superior humans that will exist in the future. Free from disease, war, violence, poverty, hunger, hate, jealousy, greed, evil, and whatever else I missed.
I will most likely never see it in my lifetime but I can hope for a better future.
To me a game is a game and nothing more and honestly the news glorifies murder so much people know they can be famous because of it. That is a serious fucking problem if you ask me. If you kill someone you should be forgotten forever not remembered for far more years than any person will live.
China censors things and ideals in games the government doesn’t approve of. Germany requires all blood to be green. Games rated for 17 years old or older require the use of a valid ID for proof of age in Canada. Japan has arcades everywhere. Australia has bandwidth being capped. The Netherlands, UK, France, and South Korea have much lower population counts.
Many reasons why video game sales are so comparatively high in the US to the countries on that list. Three of which are known for extremely violent and/or corrupt mafias…Japan with the Yakuza’s, China with the Triads, and the South Korean with allowing bribery in it’s own government.
The mafia don’t play video games to learn violence through them. The do it with training and teaching it to each next generation.
I await the study ...
.. exploring whether there is a link between actual violence and repeatedly taking your mentally ill son to the shooting range.
Here’s another proposed study: Explore the link between gun violence and owning guns.
Re: I await the study ...
Media exposure vs violence. Nuff said.
Some have found there is a strong inverse correlation between Global Warming and the number of Pirates.
Re: Re:
Same was the case for storks and child births. Correlations are the trap of the scientist. If you blindly build a model based around correlations, you will end up with this. I think it is especially common in sciences with a lesser mathematical tradition, like, say, psychology!
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or politics
“have serious methodological problems”
Oh man, I remember one where they unplugged the gamer’s machine randomly while they were playing. rofl
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Oh man, I remember one where they unplugged the gamer’s machine randomly while they were playing. rofl
That could definitely lead to rage issues.
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There are constantly surveys and studies on correlations between violent games and violence among individuals and 99% end with the same result. It’s simply how we relieve stress and stay say without killing our neighbors and those we mix with in society.
Now with that said, there is also some responsibility that goes along with that. You wouldn’t let your 10yr old child play these games because his mind is still mending, and watching a character (himself) shooting other characters, stealing cars, and other provocative things molds his mind to think it’s more normal than it is. Now once you’ve his 15-18, you tend to know what to and what not to do. But this is why there are rating systems. That is to say, kids at 11 and 12yrs of age shouldn’t be exposed to these games. Ultimately it comes down to the parents keeping an eye on their kids. They can’t too easiy buy these violent games, it takes the help of their parent or other adult-type figure.
I know this comment will probably not been seen but, the issue that seems to be missed by everyone is: Mentally ill people should not have access to guns. IMO guns should be licensed, you should have to prove that you are indeed responsible enough to own and use. Unfortunately this will never be the case in good ole’ Murica..
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