EU Pushing For Criminalizing Non-Commercial Infringement In ACTA

from the nothing-to-see-here... dept

The latest news coming out of ACTA negotiations (latest round in Switzerland) is that the EU is apparently pushing to include criminal sanctions even for non-commercial infringement. Apparently, part of the language suggests "imprisonment and monetary fines" as a way to dissuade people from infringing behavior, even in cases of private and non-commercial use. Specifically, such criminal sanctions could apply for the the broadly worded "inciting, aiding and abetting" of infringement. But what counts as aiding and abetting? Would having a file shared on BitTorrent count?


Reader Comments (rss)

(Flattened / Threaded)

  1.  
    identicon
    Anonymous Coward, Jun 25th, 2010 @ 4:41am

    i dont know why they bother calling it a trade agreement anymore...

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  2.  
    identicon
    Pinky, Jun 25th, 2010 @ 4:42am

    Re:

    It's more like a nefarious plotting to take over the world agreement

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  3.  
    icon
    bradmoreso (profile), Jun 25th, 2010 @ 4:50am

    I've got it !!!

    If they really want to modify behaviours, they ought to copy the US' anti-insurgency model in Afghanistan: Extortion payoffs!

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  4.  
    identicon
    abc gum, Jun 25th, 2010 @ 4:56am

    afaik

    Criminal procesution requires proof as opposed to preponderance.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  5.  
    identicon
    Anonymous Coward, Jun 25th, 2010 @ 5:15am

    Oh, this makes me sad...

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  6.  
    identicon
    Anonymous Coward, Jun 25th, 2010 @ 5:39am

    Re: afaik

    Not anymore.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  7.  
    identicon
    masquisieras, Jun 25th, 2010 @ 6:15am

    is politic

    Several departments/commissions of EU has try to pass quite draconian copyright reinterpretation, one of the problems has been that privacy rights are considerer an esencial rights as such a no-comercial civil infringement has little standing. This could be a try to bypass that by making non-comercial infringement a crime.

    Another possibility is that any international agrement is require to be approved by the European Parlament. That is and institution with a very high cost/reward ration for lobbing a way to bypass that could be to insert some very awful clausulas in ACTA so the Parlament concentrate in them to later renegotiate ACTA to eliminate the sticky point that themselves putted in the first place and distract the attention from other aspects.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  8.  
    identicon
    NAMELESS.ONE, Jun 25th, 2010 @ 6:21am

    FUCK THE EU AND USA GOVTS

    nuff said
    be funnny when they dont pass the copyright bill in canada......AGAIN, and due to that can't enforce ACTA.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  9.  
    identicon
    Bengie, Jun 25th, 2010 @ 6:34am

    Knowing someone

    "aiding and abetting"

    supplying power to their computer, supplying food for them to eat, supplying them a computer, supplying internet access, giving birth to them, educating them.

    Chaos theory(butterfly effect) applies and says everyone's actions, no matter how small, led up to cause this event where the this guy infringed.

    EVERYONE goes to prison for "aiding and abetting"!!!

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  10.  
    icon
    Overcast (profile), Jun 25th, 2010 @ 6:44am

    "non-commercial"?

    So that means - if a 'person' does anything - they go to jail.

    If a corporation does it, then it's ok to just settle in civil court?

    Truly a statement that clearly shows that politicians are not representing the people anymore, they represent their corporate money mills.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  11.  
    identicon
    Richard Corsale, Jun 25th, 2010 @ 7:11am

    Re:

    Right, the house is starting to crumble, the people have started to rumble, the oligarchy is anything but humble and history seems ready to tumble.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  12.  
    identicon
    hank mitchell, Jun 25th, 2010 @ 7:21am

    this is a logical step in the ultimate destruction of copyright constructs - the criminalization of copyright infringement for any purpose, then people will be forced to think about how ridiculous it is, imagine a newspaper reporter being sentenced to 15 years or hard labor in a prison for inadvertent "plagiarism" of another private party.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  13.  
    icon
    Joel (profile), Jun 25th, 2010 @ 7:29am

    Starting a Micro-nation!

    Hi everyone I will soon be starting a Micro-nation you are more than welcome to help me pick-out the place where will be located.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  14.  
    identicon
    Sam I Am, Jun 25th, 2010 @ 7:35am

    Is there an option?

    I think the most interesting thing here is not the press for criminal sanctions but rather who is now pressing for them. The EU, long a bastion of human rights and inalienable privacy is raising the stakes?

    Three things come to mind. 1) the threshold for conviction will rise considerably, as it should for a criminal conviction 2) just like every other law in every other country, live lawfully and it will be as if this law doesn’t even exist for you, and 3) the EU, like America, Japan and other post-industrialized nations increasingly have IP as their primary form of merchandise going forward.

    Nothing these countries do to enforce IP value-confers-price will surprise me. Their economies are based upon the license and sale of intellectual property, so they see little option.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  15.  
    icon
    Hephaestus (profile), Jun 25th, 2010 @ 7:43am

    What would be really neat ....

    What would be really neat is if all the nations not invited to the ACTA party in the first place were to get together and hammer out a totally different IP treaty. India, China, every south american country, etc ...

    They could hammer the whole thing out in a month and stop the insanity that is ACTA

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  16.  
    icon
    Sean T Henry (profile), Jun 25th, 2010 @ 8:04am

    Seems troublesome especially the aiding and abetting part. If a person goes to the library (non-profit) and uses the WiFi there to download infringing files they have no record of who was doing the downloading and even if they do and can prove it they will still be aiding the downloading of infringing files. This could go for any establishment that has free WiFi unless the company can prove they were infringing commercially on purpose. LOL

    Who wants to get on to politicians WiFi and infringe to get them arrested? It will happen at some point I'm sure.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  17.  
    identicon
    Jerry in Detroit, Jun 25th, 2010 @ 8:06am

    One potential answer

    One potential answer is the outright elimination of patents, copyrights and trademarks; These were supposed to facilitate production, not prevent it. We can do this by legislation or de facto when the whole sorry mess collapses from bureaucratic inertia.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  18.  
    identicon
    Anonymous Coward, Jun 25th, 2010 @ 8:11am

    Re: Knowing someone

    "supplying power to their computer, supplying food for them to eat, supplying them a computer, supplying internet access, giving birth to them, educating them. "

    your reaching further than mike usually does, and that is pretty far. you may want to see if you can find at least a reasonable definition of aiding and abetting.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  19.  
    identicon
    Anonymous Coward, Jun 25th, 2010 @ 8:12am

    Re: One potential answer

    how would this agreement harm production, except of illegal copies?

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  20.  
    icon
    jdizon (profile), Jun 25th, 2010 @ 9:06am

    That is and institution with a very high cost/reward ration for lobbing a way to bypass that could be to insert some very awful clausulas in ACTA so the Parlament concentrate in them to later renegotiate ACTA to eliminate the sticky point that themselves putted in the first place and distract. tampa attorney

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  21.  
    identicon
    NAMELESS.ONE, Jun 25th, 2010 @ 9:27am

    WHY they should just stop

    coca - cola

    there i infringed somehting non commercially.
    see how that fails to work and be enforced except on select people whom speak out against such laws

    TARGET ...AIM ...FIRE

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  22.  
    icon
    Modplan (profile), Jun 25th, 2010 @ 10:04am

    Re: Is there an option?

    1) No basis for this. Everything ACTA does has so far been to reduce the threshold down to level of accusations and baseless reasoning.

    2) Assuming the law is just and makes sense of course, which there is no evidence of in the case of ACTA.

    3) I would think merchandise is their primary form of merchandise, not IP. Several industries thrive without copyright and patents, like fashion, and make more money than film, TV and music.

    Yet another baseless post from Sam I Am.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  23.  
    icon
    Modplan (profile), Jun 25th, 2010 @ 10:06am

    Re: Re: One potential answer

    By restricting further what people can legally do, creating a further mess of laws that have to be navigated to produce anything in a variety of industries.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  24.  
    identicon
    FUTURE ACTA ENFORCER, Jun 25th, 2010 @ 10:39am

    Re: Re: afaik

    You'll all pay.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  25.  
    icon
    BigKeithO (profile), Jun 25th, 2010 @ 10:49am

    Re: FUCK THE EU AND USA GOVTS

    Copyright bill won't matter if ACTA is passed. Then we'll just have new laws introduced to "comply" with the ACTA. You should be very worried about the ACTA and what it means to Canadian law.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  26.  
    icon
    ltlw0lf (profile), Jun 25th, 2010 @ 12:09pm

    Re: Re: Knowing someone

    your reaching further than mike usually does

    But not quite as far as you routinely do, so your record is still safe. No need to persuade the competition away from reaching, because it'd take a whole lot of them a lot longer to go where you have already been.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  27.  
    identicon
    Sam I Am, Jun 25th, 2010 @ 12:52pm

    Re: Re: Is there an option?

    " I would think merchandise is their primary form of merchandise"

    Well, you'd be thinking incorrectly. The chemicals and binders in a pharmaceutical, for instance, may be worth pennies, but the research and development behind it prices in the millions, maybe tens of millions. Automotive, aerospace, you name it, the design is far more valuable than the material product itself. That's what we have to sell, and it is increasingly in digital format.

    Besides, material manufacturing has been outsourced from the EU and the USA for decades.

    Expecting government to abandon IP in the marketplace so you can have your "freedom of speech" by taking unpurchased copies is.......a bit delusional. And now Europe is catching on.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  28.  
    identicon
    Anonymous Coward, Jun 25th, 2010 @ 3:32pm

    Aren't our jails already filled up enough as it is? The last thing we need to do is overload them with more non violent criminals who aren't doing anything unethical, especially since this might contribute towards converting them to true criminals.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  29.  
    identicon
    Anonymous Coward, Jun 25th, 2010 @ 3:41pm

    Re: Re: Re: Knowing someone

    Without IP laws creativity and music and art would die, no one would ever create anything, and the consumer will suffer. We need 95 year copy protection terms to prevent this.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  30.  
    icon
    ltlw0lf (profile), Jun 25th, 2010 @ 5:07pm

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Knowing someone

    Without IP laws creativity and music and art would die, no one would ever create anything, and the consumer will suffer. We need 95 year copy protection terms to prevent this.

    Nice try, but you still don't have him beat. Thanks for playing. A couple hints to become better: you gotta post either entirely in lowercase or uppercase letters, and inflate 95 years to 1,000 years before you're reaching at his level. Plus it helps to throw in a personal attack against Mike and accuse us all of being in his payroll.

    Love the sarcasm though.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  31.  
    icon
    ltlw0lf (profile), Jun 25th, 2010 @ 5:26pm

    Re:

    he last thing we need to do is overload them with more non violent criminals who aren't doing anything unethical, especially since this might contribute towards converting them to true criminals.

    At the risk of going all Ayn Rand in this discussion, I am not entirely certain that this isn't their (the copyright maximalist's) goal to begin with. After all, if the "pirates" are all behind bars, then there isn't an active group of individuals out there standing against their maximalist attitudes. Of course, since some politicians view anyone who doesn't have a maximalist view as a terrorist or revolutionary, it might just be easier to build a small city on an island somewhere and move all the maximalists there instead of putting everyone else in jail.

    Of course, they may just be thinking that if they get rid of the most obnoxious "pirates" everyone else will go along.

    Personally, I tend to agree with Overcast above...by making this criminalization of non-commercial infringement, we've targeted the behavior that causes the least amount of damage over the behaviors that cause the most amount of damage (commercial infringement.) If I am a member of a criminal organization who is selling knock-offs of copyrighted works, I pay the fine and move on, or better yet, go into hiding and allow others to take the fall for it. If I am Viacom, and am infringing copyright for works I downloaded off of Youtube and then placing them on my website where I get ad revenue without permission from the producers, I say sorry and remove the offending content when I get caught, but if I am joesixpack and I download a copy of the A-Team off the internet, I get 5 years in a federal prison, where I get to learn from the experts how to truly be a criminal. Guess the real answer is to go into business infringing on other people's content...as you don't get jail-time that way.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  32.  
    icon
    vivaelamor (profile), Jun 26th, 2010 @ 5:48pm

    Re: Is there an option?

    "just like every other law in every other country, live lawfully and it will be as if this law doesn’t even exist for you" I'm guessing you've never been subjected to a search?

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]

  33.  
    icon
    DNY (profile), Jun 27th, 2010 @ 9:22am

    ACTA and civil disobedience

    It is becoming increasingly clear that if ACTA is adopted and ratified in anything like the form we hear coming out of the negotiations, "piracy" in the digital sense will become a morally legitimate act of civil disobedience against tyranny, at least for those of us in the U.S., where the Constitutional justification for patent and copyright is "To promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts, by securing for limited Times to Authors and Inventors the exclusive Right to their respective Writings and Discoveries."

    Deliberately flouting the chop-logic distinction between parody and satire in derivative works (as reported in another of TechDirt's stories today) already strikes me as morally legitimate civil disobedience.

    As The Economist recently called for, it's time to take intellectual property law back to its roots in the Law of Queen Anne: 14 years, extendable for another 14 at the request of the author/artist/inventor if he or she is alive when it expires, and that's it. And, while we're at it, top it off with a dose of explicit fair-use protection for a broad class of derivative works, and provisions to make it impossible for the creator of a work to completely alienate his own control of his work by signing rights over to a commercial entity.

     

    reply to this | link to this | view in thread ]


Add Your Comment

Have a Techdirt Account? Sign in now. Want one? Register here
Get Techdirt’s Daily Email
Save me a cookie
  • Note: A CRLF will be replaced by a break tag (<br>), all other allowable HTML will remain intact
  • Allowed HTML Tags: <b> <i> <a> <em> <br> <strong> <blockquote> <hr> <tt>
Follow Techdirt
A word from our sponsors...
Essential Reading
Techdirt Reading List
Techdirt Insider Chat
A word from our sponsors...
Recent Stories
A word from our sponsors...

Close

Email This